Aan alle Dutch Roots Project leden!!/to all Dutch Roots Project Members !! [closed]

Question

Hallo allemaal ,Hi everyone,

Ik heb via de G2G (ideeen,vragen voor/over het DRP) niet veel reactie gekregen, wel via de mail gelukkig en ik snap natuurlijk ook wel dat als je nog maar net begint bij WT en/of nog veel vragen hebt,  je dit niet allemaal via de G2G wilt doen en dat hoeft ook niet, als je vragen hebt,of dingen die je liever persoonlijk wilt zeggen/vragen, mailen mag natuurlijk altijd !

I didn't get many reaction at the G2G (ideas questions for /about the DRP), fortunately members responded by email and I totally understand that if your new at WT and/or still have a lot of questions, you don't like to ask everything trough the G2G and this you don't have to, if you have questions, or things you rather say/ask personally, mailing of course is always ok !

Maar het is de bedoeling dat we zaken die betrekking hebben op het Dutch Roots Project vanaf nu wel zo veel mogelijk via de G2G gaan doen, zodat iedereen mee kan doen en straks alleen nog maar naar de G2G dutch_roots hoeft te kijken en dan weer helemaal en van alles op de hoogte is !

But it's the intention that from now all matters related to the Dutch Roots project  will be discussed or asked via the G2G, this way all members can participate and will be totally updated just by checking the dutch_roots G2G !

 

*Update voor alle project leden/ Update for all project members:

Het Dutch Roots Project is vooral van start gegaan omdat er duizenden Pre-1700 profielen zijn waar nu eigenlijk niets mee gebeurt en die vaak geen bronnen en geen verdere informatie hebben, ook zijn er nog genoeg andere Nederlandse profielen, die vaak met gedcoms zijn geupload en waar eigenlijk hetzelfde voor geld.

The Dutch roots Project mainly started because of the thousands Pre-1700 profiles where nothing actually happens and that often are unsourced and without any additionall info, also there are many Dutch profiles, gedcom uploaded ones, were it's mostly the same.

Ik wil graag weten wat jullie allemaal vinden van het splitsen van het project in 3 sub-projecten / I would like to know what you all think of splitting up the project in 3 sub-projects:  

                         - Pre-1700

                          -1700-1811

                         - After-1811

Genoemde reden voor het opsplitsen/Mentioned reasons for splitting up the project:

*het werken aan Pre-1700 profielen vergt veel onderzoek, dit kan soms ontmoedigend werken( soms ook heel erg lonend zijn natuurlijk ! )

*Working on Pre-1700 profiles is mostly a lot of research and can be discouraging sometimes ( also very rewarding sometimes of course ! ) 

*Door het project op te splitsen in 3 categorieen, kun je als je zin hebt om even met wat anders bezig te zijn, werken aan de profielen van een van de andere categorieen

*By splitting up the project in 3 categories, if you feel like doing something different for a while,  you can also work on the profiles of one of the other categories. 

*Of misschien zie je de Pre-1700 profielen wel helemaal niet zitten, ook dan kun je er nu dus voor kiezen om te werken aan de ''jongere'' profielen, waar de bronnen vaak iets makkelijker voor te vinden zijn natuurlijk.

*Or maybe you just don't like working on the Pre-1700 profiles at all, this way you can chose working on the ''younger'' profiles, where the sources are more easy to find of course.

*Verder wordt er door een van onze Nederlandse project leden gewerkt aan een Nederlandse vertaling van sommige onderdelen van de http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots, dit leek ons wel handig omdat het natuurlijk niet voor ieder Wikitree lid even makkelijk is dat alles in het Engels is, vooral niet omdat het niet echt alledaagse/veel voorkomende dingen zijn soms (Bijvoorbeeld de uitleg over de templates en hoe die werken etc)

*And one of our Dutch project members is working on a Dutch translation for some parts of the DRP page(link above), this seemed usefull because of course it 's not for all Wikitree members equally convenient all info is only available in English, especially since some of the subjects are not really everyday/common issues (For example the explanation for the templates etc)

*Aan de templates wordt gewerkt, als we met 3 sub-projecten gaan werken, zullen we dus ook met 3 verschillende templates gaan werken, de profielen van elk sub-project, moeten straks dus voorzien worden van de template horend bij dat project.

*The templates are worked on, if we are going to work with 3 sub-projects, we will have to work with 3 different templates as well, the profiles of all sub-projects will soon have to be provided with the for this project designed template.

*Ik denk dat het handigst is om de (geschatte) geboortedatum als uitgangspunt aan te houden om te bepalen bij welk sub-project een profiel hoort, verder moeten we even kijken of en waar we een grens gaan trekken, want het is natuurlijk niet de bedoeling / onbegonnen werk (lijkt mij tenminste) om alle Nederlandse profielen toe te voegen aan het project. Dus vanaf 1811 tot ????

*I guess most convenient is to take the (estimated) date of Birth as the starting point to determine which sub-project includes a profile, also I guess we should look if and were to draw the line, because it's not our intention of course to include/an  impossible task (I guess) all Dutch profiles in the project. So from 1811 untill ????

Verder is de Dutch Roots Project pagina hier en daar weer aangepast/Also the Dutch Roots Project page is adjusted here and there.

*de ' Dutch naming convention' inclusief gedeelte over patroniemen en diverse Nederlands- en Engelstalige links zijn toegevoegd/The Dutch naming convention is added including a part about patronyms and Dutch- as well as English links are added

*Er zijn bronnen(links) toegevoegd en we moeten met zijn allen even bedenken wat we acceptabele en goede bronnen vinden ,dus bij deze ,wat vinden jullie allemaal acceptabele en goede bronnen?

*En hebben jullie zelf misschien ook nog wensen of ideeen voor het project laat het aub hier dan ook weten (G2G) 

*There are sources added and we all have to think of what we find acceptable and good sources, so what do you all find acceptable and good sources?

*And do you have any wishes or ideas for the project ,please respond here as well (G2G)

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots

En natuurlijk allemaal bedankt voor al jullie inzet en hulp bij het verwezenlijken van dit project !

And of course thank you all for all your effort and assistance and making the project possible !

ps: Badges ready and awarded already ! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Comments

Allemaal geweldige voorstellen, Bea. Ihb het splitsen van het project in 3 sub-projecten lijkt me zeer verstandig.

 

---

Dankjewel Albertus ! 

Ja over het opsplitsen is iedereen het wel eens, dus dat gaan we maar gewoon uitvoeren, misschien heb je ook nog ideeen over of links naar bronnen die we kunnen gebruiken? Ik heb nu diverse links toegevoegd naar voornamelijk archieven, de site zoekacten.nl is een zoekmachine waar een van onze project leden ook aan mee heeft gewerkt ,  je wordt ook direct naar de echte bron(nen) bij bijv familysearch doorgelinkt, iets wat enorm veel tijd en speurwerk daar scheelt Maar er zijn bijvoorbeeld ook veel online boeken te vinden of bijvoorbeeld andere informatieve sites, soms zelfs wikipedia waar soms ook best veel, soms ook hele goede info te vinden is, die je dan ook wel kunt controleren doordat daar ook goede links en/of naslagwerken aan toe zijn gevoegd. Dus als je nog iets weet of goede bronnen hebt, dan kunnen we die ook toevoegen!

---

Nog een handige bron: http://www.delpher.nl/

zoeken in ruim 1 miljoen Nederlandse boeken, kranten en tijdschriften

Fantastische site. Gebruik 'm zelf als laatste toevluchtsoord als de reguliere bronnen niets opleveren.

Another good source: http://www.delpher.nl

Search over 1 million Dutch books, newspapers and magazines

Great site. Use it myself as last resort when regular sources don't give information.

---

Ok die kende ik nog niet, heb het even geprobeerd, ziet er goed uit, meteen een aantal mooie ''hits'' dankjewel, ga hem zeker toevoegen

Ok didn't know this one, looking good, tried it and immediately got some nice ''hits'',

thanks going to add this one for sure 

Answer 1

I like the idea of the three time periods. Here are my ideas of tasks to be done:

1) Pre-1700 needs to be sourced for PPP, and only pre-1700 qualified members can work on these. Those are the group of profiles which should be added to the category, Project_Collateral-Prospect for further research. Go to that category page, to see how to do this. Also, click on "limit to watchlist" in the upper right to see only your own profiles that are already there, and then work on those.

2) There are already thousands of these pre-1700 profiles existing, and they are mostly connected to later emigrant descendant lines, but very few of these deep ancestors are connected to other branches in the Netherlands. Mainly this is because the patronymic system makes them difficult to find for each other. So, the next task is to discover and create good pre-1700 family links between these Netherlands deep ancestors. I think a determined pre-1700 source list might be very useful.

3) Browse ne.Wikipedia, for famous Dutch ancestors. There are many entries in that Dutch language site, which are not also in en.Wikipedia, because they are famous in the Netherlands, but not quite enough so for English-speaking contributors. Many of them have documented genealogies there.

4) 1700-1811 should have it's own good source list. If there are good Dutch source databases that people can access to prove and create these profiles, that would be great.

So I think one of the main things to start with would be to identify and link certain source lists that can be reliably and easily used in each of the three time periods, to prove and create branches of profiles.

5) Perhaps a Netherlands unconnected category might be useful. Something like this could be added to the many Netherlands profiles that lacks parents..The Categorization project might have some ideas about this. There are a huge number of Dutch trees that just sort of end in the 1700s, 1600s, 1500s, with no proven siblings and no parents. Surely these deep ancestors might need a tool like this category to help them be researched and properly connected.

Comments

Thanks Steven,

Will  add some more tomorrow, it's getting late and my head is spinning, lots of info, did some editing for the patronym forms, you know the other very hard and by most people unknown one, hope it's more clear this way   

Will answer the mail as well, and how easy ..nowiki ... now I can try and explain the use of the prospect template much easier 

So Thanks for your tips, tricks and help ...again !

Just received a Template !

 

---

As you are writing the guidance for handling profiles in the NNS and Dutch Roots projects, it would be good to let us know if when we find well documented individuals that have vague profiles attached to them, are we allowed to "disconnect" obvious errors?  

For example, I was working on the family of Maria DePue / De Puw and I see that she is "married" to the wrong spouse of the same name.  Am I allowed to correct her spouse and move her children to the correct father ... so that the ancestry lines up?

I have been working through the Elders, Deacons and Consitory (council members) of the Dutch Refomed Church Records.  Another such glaring error is the mismatch of two "Dirck Storm" families.  The elder is famous and has a WikiPedia page, and is known as the recorder of the families at the Old Dutch Church of Sleepy Hollow and Tarrytown.  He was married to Maria Peters Monfoort.  The younger was married to Eliezabeth Mey.  She is in the system as both "Mey" and "May" (phonetically correct) but married to the wrong Dirck Storm.

It would be nice if, while the source documents are on our screen, and fresh in our mind, we were able to make those corrections.  Is there some sort of process for doing so?

---

Janne you need to connect with the profile managers before removing any family attachments. You can post the sources within the profile and make a note. Also, note in the comments box as well. You can also ask to be added to the trusted list to make the needed changes.

Answer 2

I feel very comfortable with the sub categories.  Since the baptism and marriage records I'm familiar with were started between 1580 and 1740, depending on the church, it's very difficult to find a good precise date to divide the first and second sub-categories.  1700 works well as an average and it fits with the Pre-1700 badge.

My first wish for the Dutch Roots project is to see a consistent way developed and recorded in a findable place how to record names, baptisms, deaths and sources.  I see a lot of work has already gone into developing a consistent way to record and correct surnames.  I still have questions about patronyms.  I have been recording them as middle names when the person has a surname.  Is this correct?  If not, where should I put it?

I have found many sources that I would consider acceptable.  Many are already listed.  Here are a few more databases I have found very helpful:

Tresoar (Frisian records)

Westfries Archief (Westfrisian records in Noord Holland)

Regionaal Archief Alkmaar (Alkmaar area records in Noord Holland)

There are some other sources I consider reliable that I've used: for example M. G. Baltes has downloaded a database of all baptisms, marriages and deaths of people in the towns of Andijk and Wervershoof in Noord Holland.  He has connected these into family groups as much as possible; most of them seem to be correct.  His site is called Buurtjeskerk-Genealogie. I've also used the Kistemaker Netwerk for information about individuals in Andijk.  This source seems to be very reliable, but of course is very localized.

Comments

It is not "correct" to treat patronymics as middle names, but given the way that WikiTree is set up, the arrangement you describe (treating the patronym as a middle name if the person also has a surname) seems to be the best way to handle patronyms.

---

Thanks Bertram and Ellen, for answering,I'll get back tomorrow, it's waay past midnight here, different timezones. Here you maybe can find some answers already, about the use of patronyms http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots/Naming_Convention

as well. The links sound great, just send them and I'll add them at the sources section of the Dutch Roots Page, or if you like and  now how to, you can add them there as well. If there are no other last names, the patronym is added in the last name field.(Dutch Naming conventions)

If there is a last name and a patronym, I always add the patronym to the (first) name field, this way it shows, and since there were so many same names and patronyms repeated in one family you immediately can see if you are for example adding the right child to the right father and you don't have to constantly click to see if the one you're looking for , really has the patronym you only can guess, if you add them to the middle name field, you only see Jan H + last name, I find it more easy if I can see if it is Jan Hendriksz and not having to doubt and because of that checking these guys over and over 

For now I'm going to get a few hours of sleep, will be back tomorrow.Sounds like almost all are feeling comfortable with the sub categories ,so that's great !

See you tomorrow 

Greets and Thanks 

Bea

---

Hi Bertam I added the sources you mentioned to the DRP sources/bronnen, thanks for the info 

And about the patronym and were you should put it (if there is a last name as well), guess we all could keep it how we prefer, because ''rule'' now  is what you prefer, there's no absolute rule for it, just what you find more convenient, so if you add it in the middle name field or in the first name field with the first name,  but if there's no last name, patronym of course should be LNAB otherwise all these Unknowns will never get known and stay Unknowns forever, they never were born with a last name other than the patronym so that's the only LNAB they ever had.

So how I feel about it (my opnion), you don't have to change all middle fields, just leave them were they are, and if anyone thinks different about it or has a better idea, or finds it important we should get an absolute rule for this we like to hear this as well of course..

---

Thanks Bea. In my mind patronymns made sense as a sort of "middle name" and I really didn't enjoy seeing names like "Willem Pietersz (middle name?) Sluijs on profiles.  But I can see why it would be good to put the patronym with the first name.  I'll wait to see if anyone else has a strong opinion in a different direction.  I have used patronymns as the last name when there was no last name, and I will continue to do so in the future.

I have some related questions.  I know this is really picky, and I think I know the answers, but I figure it's better for me to actually read the answers in order to set my mind at ease...  I have several families in my genealogy where the last name was used sporadically - for instance for half the records of the son, grandfather and great grandfather but not for the father.  I have been using the last name for the "in between" people, although I don't generally use it for the earliest person's father if it doesn't appear in his records.  Would you consider this correct?  Also, sometimes last names are spelled several different ways.  I have been placing the alternate spellings in "Other Last Name(s)" section so that people using alternate spellings can find the record.  Would you consider this to be correct?

---

Have some visitors so will get back later ok ?  It's not picky it's just normal ,I also have some of these in my tree and have doubts sometimes as well what's the right thing to do, the Dutch naming system and the often ''messy'' many different ways of registration is quite complicated/difficult sometimes especially for the old profiles .

So be right back ,

Thanks !

Bea 

---

About the in between group, this issue also is mentioned at the patronym section, there was a large group of people that sometimes were and sometimes weren't registrated with the last names they sometimes did and sometimes did not use, so guess this is the group the family you mention belongs to as well?

*One rule is we always use for LNAB the name they were registered with at birth or if they were baptized short after birth , the names used / mentioned there, so if these records say father was born with no last name, we don't add it for him, and this is for all the members of the family the same, so if son Pieter wasn't registrated with a last name (birth/baptism) he gets the patronym for LNAB ,if at some point members of the family start using or are registered with a last name , this is added to the current last name field, and indeed all variations become other last names at birth.

If grandfather and great grandfather already used the last name during their lives, but were registered at birth without the last name, same story, but I know these are very complicated families ... 

But for all seperate family members goes, you have to check the records for all of them, because in some families children used/adopted different last names as well, so Piet adopted or used last name van de Berg and brother Henk adopted or used a totally different one, to make it even more complicated 

Sounds you already tracked all records and it sounds correct to me, if it not appears in records it's most likely he didn't have or used one, so keep up the good work and if you ever really have doubts what to do, you can always ask some help at the G2G , sometimes two (or more) people see more (clearly) than one and the Dutch profiles, especially these ''sometimes we do and sometimes we don't'' groups can be quite frustrating eeh 

Hope this helped :)

Bea 

---

Sorry I didn't get back earlier; I was going through information on Scottish ancestors that had been sent to me over the past week.  I will go through and change profiles as I have time, hopefully as I add more complete sources.  I have hundreds of profiles where last names weren't listed at baptism but were listed in other places.  Right now I have the last name in the last name place rather than the patronym.  I of course have used the system most genealogies use, but then most genealogies don't have the options of previous and current last names....

---

Hi Bertram,

Same here,had to change some also already and many of the now Dutch Roots project profiles were not attended to for quite a few years already, so we don't need to rush and finish this Project in one day eeh, one step at the time and just take your time, if you need some help just add the template unsourced or the: http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Project_Collateral-Prospect this way you know for sure someone,if not you, is at some point going to look at these and work on them, or just ask some help from one of the project members. And great you received info about your Scottish ancestors !

Thanks and greets

Bea

Answer 3

I mostly work on Pre-1700 profiles.  I would like to know how much overlap there will be between the Dutch Root Project and the New Netherland Settlers Project.  Maybe a Venn diagram would be helpful.  :-)

Comments

Thanks Janne , a quick answer (visitors here) ,Steven already suggested maybe just the parents and grandparents would be sufficient/enough for the NNS project, but  maybe he can answer this question ?

About disconnecting possible wrong spouses and stuff, guess this should be always properly discussed, reviewed by at least more than one member, I know what you mean, and you are right about doing this, making these kind of corrections while the documents and info are on your screen and fresh on your mind, we can of course try if we can find/think of  a way of handling this (these kind of situations) that's most quick and easy.. for example, maybe we could agree if this is done/reviewed/discussed by at least two (eperienced) project members and if they both agree this is absolutely proven and correct, they could explain this/show this to a leader or coordinator who than can approve (or if it's not totally clear) disaprove ??

If everyone just starts disconnecting people because they think/find (sourced or unsourced)  these people are wrongfully connected, maybe whole families/lines get messed up, so to prevent this it's always best and more logic to propose this at the G2G for example or by a private message so it can be reviewed, if someone else has ideas about this I or maybe you have an idea yourself ?

Greets

Bea

---

I usually document the record with a preponderance of evidence and then leave it up to the profile manager.  

However, in the spirit of cooperation, I have been sending both private and public messages concerning the incorrect linkages.  After doing so, I am not sure if I am the one who is allowed to make the repairs, or if I am WAITING for someone to take action?

It is just sad to see that delays between after the problem is identified causes more and more profiles to get linked incorrectly and a quick fix becomes a convoluted mess!

---

I see Michelle already answered, so hope this will do ? If the manager doesn't respond after all your efforts I guess you could contact a leader and see if he /she can solve this or help with this issue.

greets Bea

Answer 4

For me the most important is not time frames or periods (but then my focus is on incidental help with the solving of difficult Dutch LN'sAB, not undertaking another load of ''problem profiles'' to solve on my plate), but to get an inventory (zoals in een sociaal kaart in Dutch) of all the archives in especially the Netherlands and indexes of registers so that  we know where to find what when and how (do we pay / is it free / is it online and how user friendly are they or do we need to go to the reading rooms). 

This is my biggest ''problem'' with Dutch archives.

Comments

Hi Philip ,

Yes I know and we really appreciate  Already added many links to many archives http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots#Resources most lead directly to the index or search box , most are really user friendly and very easy to use and ...best of all most are free ,the most important info you need is, for the real records sometimes you have to pay, but the archives/real records almost all are at familysearch as well, and a lot of them are really very hard to read, so I would not pay for them. 

Will add more ...

Thanks , dankjewel en groetjes 

Bea 

---

Great, I made a link on the Dutch Cape Project Resources Page It is not so much the text that is the problem, but the 'versnipperde' state of the Nation's archives. I recently got the certificate Archivistiek voor Niet-Archivarissen and precisely because I have a lot of experience visiting online archives and the different user-interfaces, my need was a index such as you now have made - a good start (Familysearch has less quality photographs, and many, many mistakes as far as transcriptions go, but I also use that often). 

---

Yes almost all city's / towns have their own online archive, and than also each province has his own archive , and there's the National archive as well, and than there are many different sources/sites from genealogists who gathered lots and lots of sources and published these, so lots and lots of archives and almost all are online and for free... also we have different searchengines like  www.wiewaswie.nl or the zoekakten.nl etc.

So knowing this, if you know what town people were born or lived, just google name of ''town archief'' , and succes garanteed in most cases. I already added the three sub-Project pages, and have to add the additional info for each sub project as well, so working on that, planning on adding source pages there as well with more specific source lists (so pre-1700 sources etc.) like Steven suggested.

greets and thanks,

Bea

---

Great thanks Bea, you're doing us all a great favor. I would have started 'mapping' as you will the Dutch sites and indexes but spend so much time and energy in the South African sources and priority wise that is much more important at this moment in order to stay ahead of the evert exsiting threat of new duplicates being made. Remember that there were as many German, Polish, Danish, Scandinavian, French emigres to the Cape Colony as well, so for now my focus is on the first generation and second generation - at a later moment I'll tackle the European sources ...

Groetjes,

Philip

---

It's a pleasure Philip, I'm really glad we now have our DutchRoots Project, and I of course get some help from members, one of our members helped indexing the website zoekakten.nl I'll ask him if maybe he can help with this , he's experienced so guess we will be fine.

And of course your project needs your full attention,we're only human, so one thing at the time eeh 

Thanks en groetjes ,

Bea 

Answer 5

Ik heb toch nog wel wat vragen over de te verrichten handelingen  n.a.v. de project-tekst:

A. Goals

3. pertaining categories added: Welke? Onder welke voorwaarden?

4. templates added: Welke? Onder welke voorwaarden?

B. To-Do or Task List

1.Primary task for all project members is to review/improve/source all of your own pre-1700 profiles of people who were born in the Netherlands and then edit each of them (if not yet categorized to a project!) to add the main Dutch Roots hunting ground template: welke is dat?

C.Templates and Categories

Please add this :{{Unsourced|Netherlands}} if you come across unsourced profiles that belong to one of the sub-categories of the Dutch Roots Project.

Is een profile unsourced als 1 of meer feiten geen source hebben, en kan {{Unsourced|Netherlands}} pas weer verwijderd worden als alle feiten een source hebben?

Comments

B.  to add the main Dutch Roots hunting ground template: welke is dat?

[[Category:Project Collateral-Prospect]]

That is the code for the category, but for putting it on any newly discovered profiles, it is best to use the template code instead, which is in bold on that category page:

{{Project_Collateral-Prospect|~~~~}}

It has been noted in a lot of places, but it should probably be WikiLinked in that phrase, for more clarity.

It contains thousands of Pre-1700 Netherlands profiles. And more.

And if you are asking about where are the Dutch Roots templates, I beleve they are still being constructed.

---

Steven, thanks for clarifying. As I'm (maybe too) anxious to get started I like to get things clear as to the procedural 'rules' to apply.

---

And that is good of you to do, Jan, because it alerts us to where points of confusion and lack of clarity need to be made more clear and specific.

---

Hallo Jan,

Ik zal even in het Nederlands antwoorden dat praat wat makkelijker en dit is dus ook waarom we graag een Nederlandse vertaling wilden en erbij krijgen (Waar Johan dus ook nog mee bezig is en ook de templates voor de Sub Projecten zijn nog in de maak, daar is Michelle mee bezig) Steven heeft al laten zien wat er bedoeld wordt met de http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Project_Collateral-Prospect template en waar je deze kunt vinden, ik zal er zometeen even een duidelijker uitleg over plaatsen bij:  http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots ,zodat je duidelijk kunt zien hoe deze template precies werkt, veel mensen vinden het een nogal ingewikkelde template, als je het weet is het niet zo moeilijk, maar ik kan me voorstellen dat het nu niet echt duidelijk is / verwarrend is wat je precies met die template moet doen en hoe deze werkt, dus morgen is er een duidelijk uitleg aanwezig hoor.

Alle Pre-1700 profielen waar deze project collateral prospect template op is geplaatst kun je daarna makkelijk vinden (= dat is nu dus de 'hunting ground' voor die Pre-1700 profielen), de template zorgt er eigenlijk alleen maar voor dat ze zichtbaar worden/ verzameld worden op een plaats http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Project_Collateral-Prospect als je hier naar beneden scrollt zie je staan:

*People or pages in Project Collateral-Prospect

en daaronder dus alle namen/profielen die deze template al hebben, dit zijn dus allemaal 'mogelijk' Nederlandse pre-1700 profielen (het zijn heel veel pagina's en wel duizenden profielen ! ) en dit is dus ook eigenlijk de (hoofd) reden dat we gestart zijn met dit project ,want met heel veel van deze profielen gebeurt of helemaal niets of er wordt wel aan gewerkt, maar omdat er zoveel zijn is dit voor een persoon alleen niet te doen, vandaar dus dat we een project gestart zijn, om te kijken of we er met zijn allen wat van kunnen maken !

De sub Projecten zijn dus ook eigenlijk meer een ''toevoeging aan'' dan een opsplitsing van het project, zodat er wat meer afwisseling is voor iedereen, want het alleen maar werken aan Pre-1700 profielen vindt niet iedereen even leuk , dus door toevoeging van ook de 2 andere groepen 1700-1811 en After-1811 kan iedereen/ de mensen die dat liever /of voor de afwisseling even willen, ook daarmee aan de slag .

Een unsourced profiel is gewoon een profiel helemaal zonder bronnen of met bijvooorbeeld niet werkende links naar niet bestaande bronnen wat dus neerkomt op ook helemaal geen bronnen. Als er wel 1 of meer bronnen vermeld zijn is het niet unsourced . belangrijkste is dat er wel een echt ''bewijs'' is dat de persoon echt heeft bestaand , dus een geboorteakte of een doopakte of een huwelijksakte of bijvoorbeeld voor de hele oude profielen ,regesten/notarieele aktes etc waar ze in genoemd worden, of boeken etc waarin ze voorkomen met naam en toenaam , het belangrijkste bij de hele oude profielen die nu soms helemaal geen bronnen en dus unsourced zijn is dus dat ze minstens 1 (liefst zo veel mogelijk natuurlijk) maar toch in elk geval 1 bron hebben die bewijst dat deze persoon echt heeft bestaan. En het plaatsen van de unsourced template zorgt er dus ook voor dat de profielen op een plaats verzameld en te vinden zijn http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Netherlands_Unsourced_Profiles

 

Goals:Hier zijn we nu nog niet echt aan toe omdat we nog geen templates hebben en ook nog niet echt hoeven te mergen etc ,straks wordt het allemaal wel duidelijk maar toch een korte uitleg.

De categorien die toegevoegd worden kunnen bijvoorbeeld zijn de categorie met bijvoorbeeld de plaatsnaam of het land van geboorte ,of de categorie Projecten en dan dus ook de template van het Sub- Project waar het profiel onder valt, als we straks een template hebben zal ik een voorbeeld(link) van zo'n profiel plaatsen en er wat uitleg over geven.

Het is bijvoorbeeld net zoiets als je met jou eigen http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Dutch_Archives free space hebt gedaan, daar heb je de categorie Dutch Roots Project geplaatst en nog een,  je kunt er bijvoorbeeld ook de categorie Projects aan toe voegen, dan wordt je free space page ook daar zichtbaar (in de lijst van projecten ) Je voegt dus de categorieen toe waarvan jij denkt / vindt dat je free space page daar bij hoort / onder valt, en die categorie template zorgt er dus voor dat je pagina in al die categorieen te vinden is door iedereen.

Maar fijn dat je dit allemaal even door geeft, want daar is de G2G tenslotte voor en alleen zo kom ik erachter of iets wel of niet helemaal duidelijk is voor iedereen en weet ik in elk geval wat ik nog aan kan passen, meer verduidelijken.

Dus bedankt hoor ! 

groetjes 

Bea 

 

 

Answer 6

A willing volunteer has posted offering help in research in the Netherlands.  I do not know how to redirect the post to this page.  I do know that it can be done!

The profile is Terink-1, maybe someone else can check it out and I will send a private message, too.

Comments

Hi Kristina, that would be our new member Jan, who has indeed already posted in this G2G above.

Not sure what you mean about "redirect" the post to this page. The G2G is linked by url, so copy and paste that. It presents better in a Comments box if you make it an aliased link, as in Aan alle Dutch Roots Project leden!!/to all Dutch Roots Project Members !! although in this case, I think the url is actually shorter than the G2G name :)

It is best to just advise any new interested person to add dutch_roots to their list of followed tags. That way they will get home page alerts on new activity in any G2G like this which has that tag.

But if they are new to using tags, they must be advised to be sure to include the underscore in the middle, or it will not work.

---

Thnx Kristina and Steven,

Indeed that's Jan ,he is already a very active member and working on the Dutch Archives for all Wikitreers and the Dutch Roots Project of course http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Dutch_Archives 

(the aliased thing someone has to explain ,why it doesn't work here at the G2G) 

[ link Dutch Archives] normally does it ,but in a G2G it doesn't ?

Learning new stuff every day here 

---

i just thought to mention it because I had not seen it post on this page.

Thanks for the additional information.

---

Hi Kristina  and thank you of course 

Here's  our  members page , so here you can find info about the members , maybe you would like to add something about yourself as well ?  

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Dutch_Roots/Members

greets Bea

Answer 7

I have a question as example. I have a pre-1700 profile in need of baptismal validation: http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Pretorius-4702

I have nearly all the exact information but a) How do I post a question to this G2G-feed (stupid as it may seem, I still do not get the correct procedure) b) Where can I find and upload a sourced baptismal record - preferably both a transcription and photograph of the baptismal entry c) How come with all the possiblities of online research available to me living here in the Netherlands and speaking Dutch myself, I cannot navigate all the websources and find the record myself ... ?

== English ==

Wessel and Josyntgen's eldest son Joannes (John) is baptized on 26 October 1642 by his father in the Reformed Church in Ouddorp, on the same day that the church's new bell is being inaugurated. The baptismal entry reads: "Den 26 October: van mij gedoopt mijn eersgeboren zoon en hebbe die genoemt Joannes. Getuigen zijn geweest mij vader Barent Schout, mijn swager Laurentius Nicolay van Egmont en Meutie Geertruij Reiniersdochter huisvrouw van Cornelis Gom". "Den 26 October: mine christened my son and eersgeboren hebbe the genoemt Joannes. Witnesses have been my father Barent Schout my Swager Lawrence Nicolay of Egmont and Meutie Geertruij Reiniersdochter wife of Cornelis Gum.

== Afrikaans ==

''Johannes Pretorius'' (eers '''Joannes Preatorius''') is die Stamvader van die Pretoriusse in Suid Afrika: gedoop in die NHK Oude Kerk, op eiland Goeree-Overflakkee, Nederland 16.10.1642 oudste seun van twee seuns en vyf dogters van ds. Wessel Schout (* c. 1614) wat sy familienaam na die Latynse vorm Wesselius Praetorius (later Pretorius)

Comments

Hi Philip,

The pre-1700 sources are not that easy, not all archives go this far back, so the Pre-1700 still is a lot of searching, google all names or combinations and hopefully have some luck and get a view nice and usefull ''hits'' , Jan our member is working on the Dutch Archives  http://http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Dutch_Archives

He has sources by town etc ,don't know if he has a link to a reliable source in Ouddorp ? I'll try if I can find something for you as well 

De Pre 1700 bronnen zijn nog niet overal even gemakkelijk te vinden hoor, sommige archieven gaan gewoon ook nog niet zover terug, dus het ligt niet aan jou, het is gewoon voor iedereen zoeken geblazen en geluk hebben vaak ;)  Jan onze 'collega' is nu  druk bezig met een Nederlands archief voor het project en alle WT leden  http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Dutch_Archives

Hij heeft ook bronnen op plaatsnaam , misschien heeft of weet hij ook een betrouwbare bron voor Ouddorp ? 

Dit is de link voor Ouddorp in het nationaal archief (gewoon de plaatsnaam + archief googelen) Ik zal ook wel even een beetje voor je rondkijken 

http://www.gahetna.nl/collectie/archief/ead/index/eadid/3.04.16.108

Groetjes en succes en als ik wat vind post ik het wel even het profiel,

Bea

And you can always add a new question with tag dutch_roots of course 

here's the link to the scans that are public from the reformed church :

http://www.gahetna.nl/collectie/archief/inventaris/gahetnascans/eadid/3.04.16.108/inventarisnr/1.I/level/file

---

Found it ! 

---

Why I get this message now up in my G2G feed? Don t see anyone replying on this today. Whatever....... I have something that I wanna discuss for days and mabey you Bea and Jan can think this out. I don t know if it s possible but.... every time I m running through churchbooks I wish I could make some of a bookmark on where the years start. Meaning not just for me on my computer or even on a piece of paper but for all to see.

Jan s links are working great for me. I m a lot in the books of Ouddorp and ofc I can write down at what image f.i year 1634 starts. But wouldn t it be nice to have a page where we post the links to the beginning of a year instead of searching them all every day. Or is it just me doing this? :) Would love to make that. So we can search faster.

---

Hi Astrid,

It would be nice to submit these data to zoekakten.nl where lots of volunteers (including me) indexed and are indexing the Familysearch films.

There is a link on the homepage of zoekakten.nl:
 De Excel-sheet voor de indexen   where you can download the spreadsheet, add data to it, and send it back to zoekakten.nl

 

---

Thank you Jan. Sheet already on my computer. Gonna read how and what.:)

---

Oh Jan! You prolly think I m stupid but I have completely overseen the indexen! Thank you for making me see this! And I will come back to you with questions, as I would love to help on indexing.