Remove Experience Harvey b. 1644, Boston as wife of Jonathan Briggs b. 1635 Weymouth ???

Question

Jonathan Briggs b. 1635 in Weymouth has a marriage record listing an Elizabeth ______ (possibly ? BABBITT) as spouse - definitely no mention of Harvey.  Nonetheless, countless genealogies list Experience Harvey b. 1644 in Boston as Jonathan Briggs' wife.

[Torry, Clarence A. New England Marriages Prior to 1700. Baltimore, MD, USA: Genealogical Publishing Co., 2004.  (page 350)] has a 1668 Taunton  marriage for Thomas Harvey b. 1643 with his 1st cousin Experience Harvey b. 1644 in Boston.  This marriage is also reported in The Harvey Book as compiled and published by Oscar Jewell Harvey in 1899.

Since Briggs is not a major element of my research focus I would like to have other folks look at this in depth and pass judgement as to the validity of the linkage between Briggs and Harvey at this point in time and locals.

Comments

There is no such Harvey-Harvey marriage in the Taunton VR. one Thomas Harvey Sr married Elizabeth Willis there Dec 10, 1679. See vol II, p 226.

Answer 1

Errk! According to the best sources cited in the Jonathan Briggs profile (the TAG article and The Great Migration), the only wife that Jonathan had was named Experience (some authors mention a first wife named Elizabeth, but without providing any evidence or reasoning for this) and her last name is not known. So his wife should be Experience Unknown, not Experience Harvey, and not Elizabeth.

Until a couple of weeks ago, there was a profile for Experience Unknown, but she got merged into Experience Harvey.

There is a birth record for Experience Harvey, born 1644 in Boston, so she is a real person who needs to be kept as a separate profile. A new profile needs to be created for Experience (LNAB Unknown) Briggs, wife of Jonathan Briggs, and we'll need to plead with the PGM project to provide project protection¹ for Experience (Unknown) Briggs so she doesn't get re-merged with Experience Harvey.

¹Jonathan, and presumably also Experience, is the child of a PGM immigrant. They are not within the scope of the PGM project, but because they are documented by the Great Migration Project of NEHGS, I'm hoping that PGM will adopt them and provide profile protection.

Comments

When you want the new profile for unknown PPP'd send me a message, We'll PPP under the US History Project.

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Thanks, Anne.

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Nice to see the proposal for protected status as there has been a plethora of genealogies erroneously connecting Experience Harvey with Jonathan Briggs within the various "tree venues" relatively recently.

We have found a necessary merge of two profiles for Experience Harvey, and once completed, her connection to Thomas Harvey b. 1643 will be secured once again.

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Anne B, you promised to protect her once created. Please do so. Thanks.

 

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Unknown-325561

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Experience Unknown is all set Jillaine

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There is a person on Family Search site who is repeatedly changing Thomas harvey's birth dte to 1600 and giving him a new mother 'Ann Hall'.

This person not only is disconnecting Thomas from his maternal ancetors, but also leaving detailed comments about how there is no proof that Thomas and or William Harvey ever emmigrated. I have probably repaired Thomas Harvey's data more than a dozen times, only to have it destroyed again, the person has her own theories which are at odds with all other evidence. William 1614 and Thomas Harvey 1617 are "Gateway Ansestors", and as such they also need protection against the historical mauling they are being subjected to on the Family Search site. Thanks

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Sorry to hear about the trouble you are having at FamilySearch, C. Zakary. I don't think there's much we can do about FamilySearch content, but WikiTreers can be on the lookout for issues.

I think the WikiTree profiles for these men are William Harvey-243 and Thomas Harvey-1871. Is that correct?

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Yes Ellen. These are the two gateway ancestors I was referring to

Answer 2

According to an article by Mrs. John E. Barclay, FASG, in The American Genealogist Volume 33, pages 83-86, despite a "diligent search" over several years, Experience's last name at birth has never been found.

I would suggest adding a Disputed Wife section to his profile, include his current spouse's name and WikiTree ID in that section along with some verbiage. There appear to be no quality sources on the profile for Experience Harvey indicating that she was the person who married Jonathan. She may indeed be a daughter of William Harvey, but there are no quality sources to support that in the profile either; I have not looked for information to support her parentage, but it may exist.

If you will leave a message on Elizabeth Harvey's profile, asking for sources of her marriage to Jonathan, maybe there will be some added. It would be helpful if her parentage had quality sources as well.

In short, because Jonathan definitely married an Experience ______, I wouldn't remove her yet as her spouse until more research is done into her parentage. You may wind up needing to add a profile for Experience _______ as his wife (ideally recycling an existing profile).

Comments

Experience Harvie born March 4, 1644, Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts., Daughter of William and Joan, is listed in Massachusetts Births and Christenings 1639-1915. Experience Harvie. existed and her parents were William and Joan Harvie.Experience and Thomas Harvey married 1668 and had at least 6 children over the following 10 years. I haven't checked the dates on the supposed Briggs marriage, but how do the dates compare with the births of Thomas and Experience's children's births?

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Experience Harvis is a real person. Quality sources showing her marriage to Thomas Harvey have not been found.

It looks as if Experience Harvey may have married a different person (based on another comment in this thread).

Answer 3

I have removed Experience Harvey as wife of Jonathan Briggs for the time being.   I am waiting for any DNA or other evidence to appear that will verify the marriage of Jonathan Briggs.

Comments

Edna, you'll be waiting a very long time for DNA evidence to verify the identity of Jonathan's wife. This is a question that DNA can't resolve.

Florence (Mrs. John) Barclay, a respected New England genealogist, undertook an extensive study of the Briggs families of Taunton. Many of the early records for Taunton are lost, so hard evidence of some relationships will never be found. Her findings were published in 1957. Mrs. Barclay concluded that Jonathan Briggs' wife is named Experience, but (as S. Willson quotes above) she states that despite a "diligent search" over several years, Experience's last name at birth has never been found. Additionally, as discussed here, Experience Harvey had a different husband. With that background (and unless someone is aware of recent work that challenges Mrs. Barclay's conclusion), the best choice we can make is to accept that Experience will have the LNAB of Unknown -- and connect her profile to her children.

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in 1793 Elkanna Briggs appears in the Georgia Militia.  He came south, probably by ship or boat from Mass., because he DNA connects to Clement Briggs.  Descendants of Elkanna [b. 1766 likely in Mass.], have not been considered in Harvey DNA testing.  Research on the Harvey/Briggs family will not be complete until all DNA records are considered.