Why the sudden interest in being related to famous people?

+19 votes
1.6k views
I was wondering why there is a sudden interest in being related to famous people?  Could it because of the Global Reunion?  I have no problem with it  but I hope somewhere that there is documented proof instead of just heresay to prove the lineage. I've already heard about George Washington is related to almost all the presidents and now the wives of the Presidents are also related through a direct line.  I am profile manager for several of the President's and their families, and as of yet I have not found that so called link to President Washington.  We've already seen what has happened on ancestry, are we going to let it happen here also?  Please folks, if you are related to any or everyone in the global reunion,please state your proof.  I am in the DAR. Maybe we should use their rules here to make sure that the lines are true.  Thanks for listening.  Mary
in Policy and Style by Living Hammond G2G6 Mach 8 (83.1k points)
edited by Chris Whitten
Well done agree with all these posts it all makes sense was all confusing but im getting it all now reading all this cleared a lot up thanks you all x
That interest is by no means 'sudden', though certainly much easier due to the internet. Charlemagne tried to link his ancestry back to the Roman emperors. Usurpers to various thrones tried to justify their actions based on lineage. Early American 'researchers' sold family histories linking certain families back to aristocratic ancestors. And now we can discover links to famous people through a simple click.

Since WT uses 'crowdsourcing', documentation proving or disproving certain links can always be added by anybody, and the cream tends to rise to the top. i.e. legitimate sources and discussion and analysis about facts will eventually improve the overall health. More than once I have been contacted by those wanting to publicize research disproving some inaccurate relationships repeated over and over again throughout the internet, and I am always happy to help. DNA testing adds yet another dimension to either confirm or deny some long-ago documented lineages.
A MEANT ALL OF THE SUDDEN COOPERS FOXES ALL OVER TV WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE WAS ABOUT IT THEN ANOTHER WHILE UP THROUGH THE NIGHT SEEMS TO BE POPPING UP ALL OVER  GOOD THING THO GETS MORE INVOLVED AND MORE INPUT ALL THAT IN THE END I SAY X

4 Answers

+14 votes
 
Best answer

Hi Mary, Thanks so much for this message. And thanks to everyone for the feedback, both positive and skeptical! 

It's true -- I'm a beginner. I'm still learning about genealogy and mastering Wikitree. But I can tell you that I'm here to stay. I'm super-excited about the Global Family Reunion. In fact, I've never been more excited about a project in my life. 

And as some of you mentioned, it's for a good cause. The Reunion itself will be a fundraiser for Alzheimer's Research. (I'm not making any money off the reunion ). And in the next few weeks I'll be approaching foundations to fund it. I want it to be free to attendees, so they can just come and experience the exhibits and music and talks meet fascinating people. 

The other big message of the Reunion -- which I know is a bit quixotic -- is I want to get across the idea that humans are all one big family, and that we should treat each other with a little more kindness. I got a great email today from a geneticist who talks about this (I'm pasting the email below) 

And thank you for the concern about the celebrities. It's a great point. We may be related to George Washington, but we're also related to thousands of scullery maids and night soil men. I'm interested in them all. 

I guess the reason to bring celebrities into it is two-fold: First, to help raise publicity. Which I don't think is a bad thing. The more people who get interested in crowdsourced genealogy, the more likely we are to achieve the dream of a world family tree. And second, I think -- and I could be wrong, since I'm not the wikitree expert that you guys are yet -- it helps make connections. So that if my friend knows he's related to Albert Einstein, and I'm related to Einstein, then we know we'll be able to make a link. 

As for the accuracy, I'm been blown away by the attention to accuracy from Abby and Chris and everyone else working on this project. 

Oh, and one more point. You're right -- the wording on my website about wikitree is awkward! I will fix that. I'm launching a new website in the next couple of weeks and will give wikitree the billing it deserves. 

Anyway, I love the honest feedback. And if you have any concerns, compliments, complaints, please feel free to email me directly, if you want. I'm very reachable at aj-at-ajjacobs.com

Thanks again! 

 

Dear A.J.

so nice to meet you and hear your wonderful plans.  i work at a Historically Black College and University (HBCU), Clark Atlanta University in Atlanta.  i too share your hope that an increased understanding of how similar we are (at the DNA sequence identity level) >99.5% within the human species will have a profound effect on how we view each other as humans.  although i study the small differences that may lead to different health risks in different ethnicities, i always try to emphasize the overwhelming identity of our species.  it’s just that 0.1% of 3 billion is still 3 million.  You can make a big deal of the 3 million differences, but 2,997,000,000 identical bases dwarfs that number.  it’s all relative (pun intended).  we have a lot to learn about other differences (insertions and deletions of pieces of DNA), but for the present time we can focus on the overwhelming sequence identity while pushing for social equality.  

 

a few things that I wanted to share with you:

 

--my wikitree link:

http://www.WikiTree.com/treewidget/Bowen-1368/4

 

 

 

 

by AJ Jacobs G2G6 Mach 1 (10.5k points)
selected by Eowyn Walker

Cousin AJ, (25 indirect steps)

When I first started getting into genealogy, many years ago, I got hooked on the "Celebrity Relationship" thing.  As I got farther along with my tree and better at genealogy, I discovered Gary Boyd Roberts and his book, Ancestors of American Presidents.  

Two things happened.  I was amazed to find how many president's I could connect with (because I reconized a few names in my tree) and I discovered an error in my tree which caused me to remove my only known connection to the Kings of England.  

I was very disapointed, but I had come to the realization that the question is not, "are we related?" but rather "WHERE are we related?" along the Global Family Tree.  My wife is second generation Irish and our connection would be lost in the history of the Irish.

To assuage my disappointment, I changed my focus to DISPROVE my connections. This has actually made me better at finding acurate and true sources and to look twice at stories an assumed connections.  Thus if I can find no reason to remove the connection I can feel good about the veracity of the connection.  Anyways, it fun!

You and I are connected through our Dutch Ancestors, our Monfoort (Wyckoff) families (going through brothers and sisters).

PS, Dig around this site. It has a lot of interesting links for those looking to find famous and noble ancestors as well as some of the math behind genealogy.

http://humphrysfamilytree.com/

Oh... keep in mind that Celebrity and Noble Ancesty, if well done, can be great bridges to find connections with us "common" folk. We find the common Celebrity and viola! we know where we become cousins.

Say hello to the family,

Michael

 

This is a great Post and i just wanted to partisapate to be part of the experiance plus the connection to my tree, but A.J comment makes it that more worthwhile. I have been working on the line connected to the Claflin's and this is one ive just completed;

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Montague-516

Eric

thank you AJ for your kind note.  I appreciate it.   Mary  yes

+12 votes
Thank you for posting this Mary.  I think it goes back a number of years with the popularity of genealogy, the creation of Ancestry.com and the television shows that perpetuate the idea that you might find yourself related to some celebrity or royalty.  I could not care less either way, but I have also been concerned with the GFR leading to a lot of rushed and incorrect connections here on WIkiTree.  No offense to the author AJ Jacobs, but I have avoided the GFR - I have no interest in helping someone sell a new book as genealogy appears to be his latest interest/obsession and will move on to something else once the event takes place.  I wish everyone the best who is enjoying creating his family tree for him here and the excitement of making connections through history, but since this site is about proof and accuracy, I have wondered at the indulgence in what is mostly a publicity stunt.  At least there is a "good cause" associated with the GFR - Alzheimers Research.  However, that has never been mentioned or promoted here, so I hope people don't mind being hit up for a donation at some point.  ;-)
by Lauren Conte G2G6 Pilot (121k points)
Part of it is WikiTree pride - we want to show our sources openly and be more accurate than the other crowdsourcing sites AJ mentions. On the other hand, we're crowdsourcing, so we need to be extra careful. I know that one person is not representative of the whole - but part of why I've enjoyed working on making connections for the GFR is that I get into parts of the WikiTree that I normally wouldn't be in. In these cases, I've added sources to profiles, and even drawn the attention of others to a few lines that were added here incorrectly and needed to be debunked or fixed for accuracy. If we're not careful, a project like this can devolve into "I'm descended from Anastasia Romanov, and Pocahontas, and Prester John!" If we are careful, we can shake out the bugs that are already here and create something fantastic.
When I saw the bit about all presidents being related to Washington, I thought it would be fun to see how they were related. It was not about being related to famous people. I found their supposed relationships to each other by using the relationship finder to find their relationship to me. I have spent many hours trying to find a tie of each president to Washington and not yet found any who tie to him. I thought people might find that info interesting. It is about sharing what is already on wikitree not about bragging about being related to a famous person.  It is no secret that though many people work hard for accuracy on wikitree and insist on accuracy in their work, many people have not and some lines are a mess. If the fact that I shared what I found on wikitree tree is offensive to other members because it is not accurate then maybe some members , not all but some members should stop adding thousands of profiles, volunteering for projects, being greeters, and other things until their own profiles are sourced and clean up from duplicates. If following DAR rules is considered.  Then I think wikitree members should think about ELITE you want be and chase off people before they sign up. Some of us have grown up with Many family members who are  members of Historical Societies. This site is difficult and hard to use for many people, and I have seen where some members wonder why people leave. Many people on this site are great people. But ..make it clear from the beginning who you want here and you don't.
I have joined the progect not only because of one specific line will join to my tree but to add sources too and correct the the line, and i have to say it is fun. But ive also been able to add and source many Profiles to do with American Colonial History and here is just one

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Montague-513

 

Eric
Lauren, I wonder if you feel that those of us who are the enthusiasts for this project on WikiTree are also those guilty of rushed and inaccurate profiles and connections?   Because my feeling is that it is the exact opposite and those of us who are GFR enthusiasts are far less likely to be guilty of those crimes than the average WikiTree contributor.

I feel if anything, the profiles we are contributing and more importantly those that we're cleaning up and updating are far superior and far better researched than the run-of-the-mill gedcom uploads that still dominate the site.

I must admit, however, that I am not objective about my own work.

Kyle, I avoided commenting on the GFR because I knew my opinion would not be popular but did not want to leave Mary thinking she was alone in her concerns.  As we all know, and you in particular with the many years spent researching your own family, genealogy is not something that can be rushed and locked into a short timeframe.  In addition, WikiTree's goal of an accurate, one profile per person, worldwide tree of free access to everyone means that it has to be taken one slow step at a time with constant inflow of duplicate profiles that have to be sorted out again and again.

When AJ Jacobs and the GFR was introduced, I spent quite a bit of time reading and rereading all I could about it, and it left me with some concerns and more questions than answers mainly regarding it's ultimate goal and it's affect on WikiTree itself.  First and foremost AJ Jacobs is a best-selling and very busy author who in his own words lives his life as one experiment after another.  Genealogy is his latest "experiment" which is leading to a book on the experience, the reunion itself, a documentary and I believe a Guiness Record for largest family photo.  This is all about him and not about genealogy or WikiTree itself.  That is a means to an end.  There are a great many books written about genealogy and many here have spent years researching and know that it takes more than a passing interest and those books don't garner much attention because the people who write them do not have the pull to put on a huge publicity event.

"You could also try Wikitree.com, which is also building a collaborative tree. They have a project devoted to finding my relatives" - seems almost an afterthought as even his own profile here on the site is basically an advertisement.  If he is actively doing genealogy himself or just coerced others to do it for him, I do not know, so I'm not sure if the book he creates is going to even be an accurate portrayal of genealogy or just a humorous take on his interaction with people who take genealogy seriously.  That remains to be seen as well as if genealogy will continue to be a vehicle for those hoping to be related to someone famous.  The carrots are there in the draw of the reunion - being related to AJ himself or someone else famous, being part of a large party and photo/documentary/book, but will it encourage people to do their own genealogy or become members of WikiTree and stick with it?  Who knows.  

It could be good for WikiTree or bad, that remains to be seen.  As it is we have many who join and give up because it takes effort, many who come thinking their lineage is automatically at their fingertips and are disappointed that it isn't and many who find the lack of charge appealing and bring their badly mistaken and unsourced trees over from Ancestry.com.  Dealing with that now is one thing, having it increase in the future because of attention drawn to it by a large publicity event could be overwhelming.

All that being said, I have a tremendous amount of respect and not a little affection for the WikiTreers I have had the pleasure to work with and consider friends if not family here on the site.  I know that you are working very diligently on this project for AJ as well as giving up a great deal of time away from your own personal profiles on the site.  I hope that ultimately it will be a good experience for you, that you will receive the acknowledgment you deserve for your efforts and that WikiTree will come out the better for it.  :-)

 

I may be a little biased, being a long-time fan of A.J. Jacobs and his books, but I can't help but feel that people are being a little unfair towards him. I met A.J. at RootsTech and he's a really nice guy, who shows nothing but respect for genealogists. Who cares if he's new to genealogy? Don't we want more people to get interested in genealogy?

Plus, I just want to repeat what Abby said in her comment, because she made a great point:

"We are not doing this to help sell books. We are doing this because A.J.'s belief in one world tree where we are all connected is the same as WikiTree's."

That's why the GFR is so exciting for us. It's just a way of bringing focus to what was already our goal here.

What's funny is that, (as Abby can attest) my first reaction to the Global Family Reunion was that I probably wasn't going to get heavily involved with it.  But my reasoning was simple selfishness - I wasn't interested in researching family lines that weren't connected to mine.

It was only once I caught the scent of a related family that I got interested.  And it was only once I realized that I could consistently do research for the GFR that dovetailed nicely with research that I already wanted to on my own related families that I became enthusiastic about the project.  

Yes, I've added profiles for "unrelated" families, but I figure that's my way of giving back to the WikiTree community and fulfilling the goals that are shared by WikiTree and myself, not primarily because of AJ's project.

As I've worked on the project, I've also realized that the concrete goals of finding a connection to AJ or reducing the number of "steps" are a motivator for me.  They're not going to change my process or my research rigor, but they do keep me working, and there's value in that.

Many great points here.

One small, subtle way that the publicity machine named AJ Jacobs helps us all: Cousin bait. When AJ mentions WikiTree in the New York Times, for example, Google takes notice. That little mention registers as a signal to Google. It says that WikiTree is worth mentioning in the New York Times. This then affects how well WikiTree ranks in Google. When our profiles rank well, we attract more cousins and genealogists to help grow our tree.
I have had this in the back of my mind with AJ's project as well, Chris.  My thinking is that the GFR, while it could be just a publicity stunt for him (though I don't think so), is a giant flashing sign for WikiTree shouting that what we do here is fantastic and worth jumping on board with for serious genealogy researchers.

Like I said in a post a few months ago, I've been hoping for years to find what I found here on WikiTree and for some reason I didn't find the site or realize its power until December.  If the GFR helps us connect with more folks who get on board with crowd-sourced genealogy, then more power to it.
+12 votes
Part of it is the Global Family Reunion - those of us involved in the project are having fun using research to play a huge game of six degrees of separation (Kevin Bacon!) When one of us hits a famous/notable person, we share it in G2G because it is fun and interesting and this increases the chances of more people joining and adding more good connections. I would say that a large majority of the new profiles being added on behalf of this project are being well sourced (Abby has it as a requirement on the project page). When we hit parts of the existing WikiTree, we have to trust that the research of others is just as good. Some times it isn't. Pitfall of crowdsourcing. Coming across these profiles can be good, too. I thought I had found a connection to the Spencer/Despencer family because of branches that already existed on WikiTree, but it turned out that line and the connection to medieval Despencers had been proven false: http://www.wikitree.com/g2g/68815/spencer-despencer-family-connection-global-reunion-project . It was good for the health of the tree to get that false genealogy someone had entered brought to light and corrected.

There have always been questions in G2G about famous genealogies, and they are just coming up more often because of how much the Global Family Reunion Project uses G2G to communicate. (How many people have asked about being related to the McCoys and Hatfields over the time that G2G has been open? I'm really surprised there hasn't been enough interest to start a project for that.)

I posted the George Washington question in G2G because I thought it would be interesting to see if we could prove or disprove that statement.
by Erin Breen G2G6 Pilot (334k points)
I will add also, that there have been many quality and well-sourced non-famous profiles created because of the GFR project, they just don't get posted about as much in the G2G.  :)
Thank you, Erin, for your answer.

The Reunion is not about being able to say you are related to a famous person. It is about showing that we are all connected to each other, part of one, large, global family. Some of those connections are via marriage, some by blood. All are connections, and all are family, especially if you believe in one world tree.

The famous people are being used as way-points; markers to show where we've made progress and to help gather the attention of other researchers who may have a connection to that person already, and now might be willing to help us create and connect this one tree. It is a large job, and we need all the help we can.

We are not doing this to help sell books. We are doing this because AJ's belief in one world tree where we are all connected is the same as WikITree's. It has the awesome side benefit of getting WikiTree some much deserved attention, because AJ thinks we're all kind of great and he lets the rest of the world know when he does interviews.

And, as others have said, it is fun to trace lines you may otherwise ignore, and it has done great work in building and properly sourcing so many lines on WikiTree. We have standards under which we work to make our site shine amongst the other crowd-sourced genea-sites out there. There is no just copy and pasting trees-if we cannot track down the source, then we do not add the link.

I can appreciate your concern, but this is really nothing new. As someone pointed out, there is always a flurry of folks wanting to see if they are related to someone famous. I prefer to just know the truth of my history, but not everyone thinks this way.

I hope that clarifies some!
I have searched wikitree to find a tree and a profile page for A.J. and have not found any.  Is he a member of wikitree?

He most definitely is! AJ is here.

ok, thank you abby.  Now, where is he related as to a global tree?
I don't know if this answers your question, but Roland Arsenault created a script that crawls WikiTree for profiles that connect into the Global Family Reunion Tree. When he ran it last on April 1, he picked up over 50000 profiles that were connected together by blood or marriage relationships, within 25 steps of being able to trace to AJ: http://apps.wikitree.com/apps/arsenault64/aj_25.html

Here's the G2G thread about it: http://www.wikitree.com/g2g/71503/are-you-within-25-steps-from-aj-global-family-reunion

Thanks so much for the links, Erin.  It is appreciated.   cheeky

I personally don't care if it's politically correct... I love finding out I am related to celebrities and politicians and royalty! What a hoot! My kids love it, and it brings them a feeling of being connected to the world. I am the 10th cousin of James Spader, 13th cousin of the Queen of England, 12th great Granddaughter of Ann Marbury Hutchinson, and the 5th Great granddaughter of Mary McCoy!!! Mine, like many others, is a story of immigrations, religious dissent, and back-hills tom-foolery! I love my history, and all the famous, infamous, and even the nameless Ute people who created it. It makes it fun to share with people who don't know a darn thing about their histories!
Robin, I totally agree with you. I'm not generally focused on finding connections to famous people in my tree, but when I find them I'm totally gonna tell people about them. My younger cousins aren't interested in genealogy, but they sure were excited when I told them that Ellen Degeneres is our 9th cousin, twice removed! And there's nothing wrong with that. As long as the genealogy is sound and well-sourced, I'm all for it.
That's so fun! Ellen rocks! Knowing our famous ancestors gives us something to talk about with friends and family to show our connection to people. My daughter is enamoured with the Royal family. I can work on here for days, and my daughter looks at me like I'm nuts, but the minute I told her about being a distant relative of the Royals, she sat next to me for the next hour and had me explain how generations work, and how the whole "removed" thing is how many generations separate us. She listened and learned because I found a connection that mattered to her. I guess we don't really find those connections for ourselves, but to publicize what we do. Besides, I get a sense of satisfaction from the reminder that all those rich and famous people, are just that... people.
+9 votes
I completely agree!

This is also why I have never been a fan of the tv series "Who Do You Think You Are?", which, in my experience anyway, trivializes genealogy by turning it into an exercise to link celebrities to famous people and dramatic historical events.

I don't mind spending a little time here and there seeing how my work does or does not tie into the lines of a famous person (celebrity, president, etc.), but most of my family are immigrants who worked as laborers both here in Western Pennsylvania and in the different parts of Europe going back in time.
by Ray Jones G2G6 Pilot (161k points)

I sometime wish there was a "like" button on some of these beautiful messages we receive here at the forum.    laugh

The celebrity stuff bores me too, but it excites some people. Some of those people are valuable contributors to WikiTree. (See the great messages from Robin and others above.)
I don't know what gets left on the editing floors of these shows (and I'm including the British version of WDYTYA and the Henry Louis Gates show on PBS as well), but my experience has been that they all focus on connecting the celebrity's family tree with something very broad which I would term "some interesting story that makes for good TV."  Celebrity and historical events are low-hanging fruit, as they are highly likely to resonate with the viewer, but just as often the shows tell compelling stories that are not celebrity- or major event-related.  The important thing is to have a story to tell ('cause it definitely wouldn't make for good TV without a story).  And every family tree has that.
 

I personally like all three shows, and Genealogy Roadshow, too, but they make me jealous, too because I wish I could have professional genealogy researchers and a seemingly unlimited travel budget to assist me in my research.
Access to professional genealogy is exactly why I seek out connections to famous people-it helps me check my own work, and often extend it. So long as the work is sourced and of high integrity, it can be a big boost to me. There is one particular famous person whose ancestry has been scrutinized with whom I share over 150 immigrant ancestors- so many opportunities for cluster research with the siblings of those ancestors being a jumping off point!

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