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Agnes (Unknown) de Brus (1095 - 1170)

Agnes de Brus formerly [surname unknown]
Born in Warwickshire, Englandmap
Daughter of [father unknown] and [mother unknown]
[sibling(s) unknown]
Wife of — married 1112 [location unknown]
Descendants descendants
Died at about age 75 in Skelton, Yorkshire, , Englandmap
Problems/Questions Profile manager: Darlene Athey-Hill private message [send private message]
Profile last modified | Created 20 Jun 2011
This page has been accessed 5,467 times.
Research suggests that this person may never have existed. See the text for details.

Contents

Biography

Rejected Origins

"Farrer's own initial suggestion was that Agnes was daughter of Geoffrey Bainard, a sheriff of Yorkshire who briefly held the manor of Burton [Agnes] in the time of Rufus. Although King supports this theory, Farrer himself ultimately rejected it, with good reason. Like Carlton, Burton [Agnes] was part of the initial Brus fief, and two of its berewicks were added in the exchange of 1103 as a direct grant from the king. In 1086 the manor had been held by the king and let out to farm, so despite Geoffrey Bainard granting the church and some land there to St Mary's, York, he may only have held it temporarily or by virtue of his office. Furthermore, Agnes is not named at all in her husband's own grant of the church of Burton [Agnes] to York, making it unlikely that she was Geoffrey's heir. Finally, the appellation 'Agnes' was not used until the mid-thirteenth century and may well have come from Agnes d'Aumale, wife of Adam de Brus I."[1]

Marriage

Robert had two sons by Agnes. His older son Adam also allegedly fought against David at the Battle of the Standard, but his younger son Robert chose to remain in David's allegiance, fighting against his own father. It was the younger Robert who was given possession of Annandale. Adam and his descendents continued to hold lands in England as Lord of Skelton. Robert the elder died in 1142.[citation needed]

"Little is known about the wife of the first Robert de Brus except that her name was Agnes, that she was linked with her husband in his grants to foundations at Guisborough, York and Whitby, and that she made a gift to Guisborough priory in her own right, of the manor of Carlton by Camblesforth.

This last grant has given rise to the theory that Agnes was the daughter of a Paynel, an idea which Farrer rightly rejected. Although Carlton was soke of the Paynel manor of Drax, it had been held by the king in 1086, formed part of the original Brus fief and was later held by Paynel of Brus not the other way round. It is therefore more likely that Carlton had been gifted to Agnes by her husband as part of her dower."

Sources

  1. Blakely, 2000
  • Blakely, R.M. (2000). The Brus Family in England and Scotland 1100 - c.1290, (pp.26-27). Durham Theses. Durham University. http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/1594.




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Comments: 6

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Here is Lady Agnes de Bainard/Pagnell death record.

b. 1086 Dudley, Metropolitan Borough of Dudley west Midlands, England d. 1140 Skelton, York Unitary Authority, North Yorkshire, England Cemetery: Guisborough Priory. Title- UK and Ireland, Find A Grave Index, 1300-1300-Current. Author- Ancestry. Com Date- URL: https://www.Findagrave.com/memorial/1437491281/agnes-bainard. Father- Fulk de Pagnell b. 1056 d. 1138 URL: https://www.Findagrave.com/memorial/143749541/Fulk -de_ Pagnell Mother- Dame Beatrix de Pagnell, URL: https://www.Findagrave.com/memorial/143749825

posted by Philip Bruce
That's not a death record. It is simply a Find a Grave memorial.
Darlene you don't even have the profile name!

This is the comments section and I will comment how ever I like. You being the profile manager need to do some work here as this profile is lacking.

posted by Philip Bruce
flagged by Linda (Carruth) Peterson
FindAGrave is NOT a reliable source. None of the memorials gives any real evidence. They are just what someone has uploaded to FindAGrave. They are no more reliable than a family tree on the web.

And the geographical information on FindAGrave is clearly anachronistic. It refers to very modern administrative entities. That is common on FindAGrave and is usually an indication that the FindAGrave information has not been properly sourced, as is the case with a very high proportion of pre-1700 entries on FindAGrave.

posted by Michael Cayley
edited by Michael Cayley
… and no reliable evidence has yet been found for suggestions that are sometimes made of a Pagnell parentage. At the moment it is no more than speculation, and the speculation has been seriously questioned. We simply do not know who her parents were. Her last name at birth needs to remain Unknown unless and until some reliable evidence can be found for whose child she was. There is slightly more extended discussion on her husband's profile.
posted by Michael Cayley
edited by Michael Cayley
Since Agnes is Uknown, Farrer rejected his own Bainard theory, and the idea that she may be a Pagnel is speculation ... profile managers are free to merge Agnes into a single profile with the last name UNKNOWN, and disconnect her from the 2 sets of parents that break the line.

And given that she was dubbed Agnes in the 13th century, some may even consider a more strict interpretation and call her UNKNOWN UKNOWN.

See her husband's profile, and the duplicate for more...

posted by [Living Ogle]

[Do you know Agnes's family name?]  |  D  >  de Brus  >  Agnes (Unknown) de Brus

Categories: Medieval Project, England and Wales, needs biography | Uncertain Existence