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Agnes (Stewart) Stewart Dowager Countess of Bothwell (abt. 1469 - 1557)

Lady Agnes Stewart Dowager Countess of Bothwell formerly Stewart aka Home Maxwell Ramsay [uncertain]
Born about in Traquhair, Peeblesshire, Scotlandmap
Ancestors ancestors
Wife of — married Aug 1511 [location unknown]
Wife of — married 1513 [location unknown]
Wife of — married about 1523 [location unknown]
Wife of — married 1549 [location unknown]
Descendants descendants
Died at about age 88 in Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotlandmap
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Profile last modified | Created 20 Oct 2010
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Scottish Nobility
Agnes (Stewart) Stewart Dowager Countess of Bothwell was a member of Scottish Nobility.
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Biography

Agnes (Stewart) Stewart Dowager Countess of Bothwell is a member of Clan Stewart.

Agnes Stewart was the daughter of James Stewart, 1st Earl of Buchan and his mistress Margaret Murray. Her date of birth is unknown. Agnes, Countess of Bothwell, was the mistress of King James IV of Scotland. She died in 1557.

The following is from the Foundation for Medieval Genealogy:

AGNES (-Feb 1557). Mistress of JAMES IV King of Scotland, son of JAMES III King of Scotland & his wife Margarethe of Denmark

She m firstly (1511) ADAM Hepburn Earl of Bothwell, son of Patrick Hepburn Earl of Bothwell & his second wife Margaret Gordon of the Earls of Huntly ([1492]-killed in battle Pinkie 9 Sep 1513).

m secondly ([9 Sep 1513/14 Feb 1514]) ALEXANDER Lord Home, son of ALEXANDER Home Lord Home (-beheaded Edinburgh 8 Oct 1516, bur Greyfriars).

m thirdly ([1520/15 Nov 1525]) as his second wife, ROBERT Maxwell Lord Maxwell, son of JOHN Maxwell Lord Maxwell & his wife Agnes Stewart of Garlies ([1493/94]-Logan 9 Jul 1546). He died in 1546.

m fourthly (before 13 Dec 1549) as his first wife, CUTHBERT Ramsay, son of NICHOLAS Ramsay of Dalhousie & his wife --- (-after Feb 1557).

She is sometimes given a son Richard Ramsay by her 4th husband Cuthbert Ramsay. Richard Ramsay cannot be the son of Agnes Stewart. Agnes's mother died in 1486, and her father in 1499. Agnes married as her 4th husband Cuthbert Ramsay between 1546-1549. Agnes was at least 60 years old when she married Cuthbert and probably older. I believe this is a misreading of The Scots Peerage, which states Cuthbert married Agnes and separately states he had a son Richard. The assumption made was that Richard was a son of Agnes - he must be the son of an earlier unknown wife.[1][2]

Research notes

She has been identified incorrectly as Isabel the daughter of James Stewart by his wife Margaret Ogilvy, instead of his mistress Margaret Murray.[3][4]

Sources

  1. Paul, James Balfour. "The Scots Peerage : founded on Wood's ed. of Sir Robert Douglas's Peerage of Scotland; containing an historical and genealogical account of the nobility of that kingdom", Edinburgh: David Douglas, 1906, Vol. III, Archive.org, p. 94.
  2. Paul, James Balfour. "The Scots Peerage : founded on Wood's ed. of Sir Robert Douglas's Peerage of Scotland; containing an historical and genealogical account of the nobility of that kingdom", Edinburgh: David Douglas, 1905, Vol. II, Archive.org, p. 157, p. 267.
  3. Paul, James Balfour. "The Scots Peerage : founded on Wood's ed. of Sir Robert Douglas's Peerage of Scotland; containing an historical and genealogical account of the nobility of that kingdom", Edinburgh: David Douglas, 1904, Vol. I, Archive.org, p. 22
  4. Richardson, Douglas, "Royal Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families", Salt Lake City: the author, 2013 Vol. I, p. 672

See also:

See also:




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Comments: 22

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In Douglas Richardson's book, Magna Carta Ancestry IV, p 104, ii, Richardson gives detail about Margaret Murray's illegitimate daughter being "Agnes". It further states/ cites her husbands and her being a mistress to James IV.
posted on Stewart-17742 (merged) by Cynthia (Shields) Whalen
Further to the proposed merge of this profile and Stewart-17742. The Addenda and Corrigenda to The Scots Peerage, vol 9, p. 2, referring to 'p.22 l.3 from foot' does state that in relation to Isabella as mother of Janet Stewart, Lady Fleming, "for Isabella read Agnes" See here https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun09paul/page/2/mode/2up

It seems likely that other secondary sources that refer to Agnes as Isabella, (for instance Alison Weir's 'Britain's Royal Families' p.242) are sourcing The Scots Peerage, without referring to the Addenda and Corrigenda, and that Isabel or Isabella is incorrect as an alternative name.

posted by John Atkinson
I also agree that the correction in Scots Peerage allows for a merge of these two profiles. I would like to leave it for a few days, though, in case there is discussion or resistance to the merge from other interested parties as Agness/Isabelle has quite a few members on the lists of profile managers and trusted. 
posted by Bobbie (Madison) Hall
Since no disagreement has been given about the merge for a week, please go ahead with the proposed merge, John. I'll leave it to you as you're more familiar with the discrepancies. Thanks for your patience!
posted by Bobbie (Madison) Hall
Stewart-17742 and Stewart-589 appear to represent the same person because: Agnes Stewart, Countess of Bothwell, was the mother of Janet Stewart, Lady Fleming with James IV, King of Scotland born before her first marriage to Adam Hepburn, Earl of Bothwell. See The Scots Peerage, vol. 2, pp. 156-57 https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun02paul/page/156/mode/2up In some other volumes of The Scots Peerage, she is named Isabella (see vol. 1. p. 22 - https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun01pauluoft/page/22/mode/1up ) but I haven't come across any primary sources that confirm this as an alternative first name. Given Stewart-589 is Agnes Stewart Countess of Bothwell and Stewart-17742 is the mother of Janet Stewart, Lady Fleming, these two profiles should be merged.
posted by John Atkinson
I proposed a merge because:

If these two aren't the same ladies there is, in the least, a lot of speculation on both profiles with a lot of blanks and "Uncertains". I don't see there being undocumented twins to this line and it seems both have some confusion on if the name is Margaret or Isabel or even Jane (there is a sister Margaret connected as well. I am hoping to clarify some things as I am a direct descendent through several siblings (as are many if us I'm sure) but I have adopted some of the profiles closer to 1500 until I am certified and would like to learn as much as possible while also contributing if I'm able. I just ask that before ignoring this we look at the family a bit closer- plus most people aren't pre-1500 & wouldn't be able to jump and complete this anyway. I am going to post this on both pages. Thanks for your time, Becky Elizabeth (Simmons-11603)

posted on Stewart-17742 (merged) by Becky Simmons
Sorry Becky, but these two profiles are definitely not the same. The mother of Janet Stewart, Lady Fleming, is actually Agnes Stewart, Countess of Bothwell who is referred to as Isabella or Isabel in The Scots Peerage in some sections but not others This one for instance https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun01pauluoft/page/22/mode/1up?view=theater but in another volume refers to her as Agnes https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun02paul/page/156/mode/2up

The reason that the other profile is referred to as Isabel or Margaret or Jane (all Uncertain) is that her name isn't mentioned in any reliable source found so far. It would probably be better to have her name as Unknown, and in the biography mention the possibilities. She is mentioned in the Addenda and Corrigenda to The Scots Peerage https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun09paul/page/46/mode/2up

So I will reject your proposed merge, and re-instate a merge to the profile of Agnes Stewart.

posted on Stewart-17742 (merged) by John Atkinson
I'll be working on this profile as there is a merge that is default approved with a duplicate of Agnes's husband Robert Maxwell-657, but they both have this Agnes as their mother as well. John, you've summarised the problem well, so I think I should be fine to sort it out.
posted by Gillian Thomas
Somewhere there has been an incorrect merge. All the Maxwell children of this profile, are the children of John Maxwell, 3rd or 4th Lord Maxwell and his wife, Agnes Stewart, the daughter of Sir Alexander Stewart of Garlies. This Agnes Stewart married as her third husband Robert Maxwell, 4th or 5th Lord Maxwell and there were no children with him. All the Maxwell children need to be disconnected from this profile.
posted by John Atkinson
Agreed. These presumably are left over from the earlier confusion about her third marriage. I have corrected her Wikipedia entry, where this was also confused.

It would be useful to add https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun02paul/page/156/mode/2up as a worthwhile source for this page.

posted by James Heald
edited by James Heald
John, thanks for enlightening me in regards to my confusion regarding Agnes (Stewart) Maxwell and Agnes Stewart of Garlies. I wasn’t even aware, as you stated earlier, that Agnes (Stewart) Maxwell is/was the daughter in-law of Agnes Stewart of Garlies.

Since I am not pre-1500 Certified, do you think you could add Robert Maxwell’s parents to the tree, meaning Agnes’ in-law parents through her husband Robert Maxwell? Your cooperation would be appreciated.

Regards,

Enrique

The Scot's Peerage, vol. 4, page 152, names Agnes Stewart of Garlies, daughter of Alexander Stewart, third of Garlies and Elizabeth Douglas, as wife of John, Lord Maxwell (she is actually mother-in-law of this Agnes Stewart - see section in biography)

The page from The Scots Peerage is here https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun04paul/page/152

posted by John Atkinson
I need someone to tell me that I am correct or that I am wrong.

I have a source that may burst everyone's bubble including my own bubble regarding this particular Agnes (Stewart) Maxwell as being the daughter of James Stewart.

Through a new source shared to me, I now believe that this particular Agnes (Stewart) Maxwell is NOT the daughter of James Stewart. Instead, she is the daughter of Alexander Stewart 3rd of Garlies and Elizabeth Douglas. This Agnes is better known as Agnes Stewart of Garlies. She married Robert Charteris of Amisfield.

See Maxwell, Earl of Nithsdale, pages 478 & 479. I will attempt to provide a more formal citation of this source at a future time.

Stewart-17742 and Stewart-589 are not ready to be merged because: Cannot merge since need more common identifiers than parents
posted by Cheryl (Stone) Caudill
Stewart-17742 and Stewart-589 appear to represent the same person because: In some sources she is called Isabel, in others Agnes, but they are the same person. See page 156 and 157 of The Scots Peerage https://archive.org/stream/scotspeeragefoun02paul#page/156/mode/2up
posted by John Atkinson
While she was the mother of Janet, she did not marry James Stewart
posted on Stewart-17742 (merged) by Robin Lee
According to her wikipedia entry, her mother was Isabel Stewart of Buchan, the daughter of James Stewart, 1st Earl of Buchan. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Janet_Stewart.
posted on Stewart-17742 (merged) by Robert Williams III
Can anyone explain why/how; Janet (Jane) Fleming and Janet (Stewart) Fleming are listed above as siblings, but when you click on them they both go to the same profile Stewart-587. They are the same person, but separated in this profile. VERY CONFUSED????
posted by Cheryl (Stone) Caudill
Stewart-9752 and Stewart-589 appear to represent the same person because: These are the same women
posted by Cheryl (Stone) Caudill
Stewart-1146 and Stewart-589 appear to represent the same person because: Although the mistress of James IV of Scotland and mother of Janet Stewart wife of Lord Fleming, is sometimes named Isabel in some sources, her names is really Agnes, later Countess of Bothwell, and wife to 3 other men. See The Scots Peerage, vol 2, page 156-157 https://archive.org/details/scotspeeragefoun02pauluoft
posted by John Atkinson
Stuart-339 and Stewart-1146 appear to represent the same person because: same name, same time frame, exact date and place of death, same location
Stewart-10418 and Stewart-7432 do not represent the same person because: b
posted by Dawn Ellis