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Ralph Allen (abt. 1590)

Ralph Allen [uncertain]
Born about in Englandmap [uncertain]
Son of [father unknown] and [mother unknown]
[sibling(s) unknown]
Husband of — married 6 May 1619 in London, Englandmap
Descendants descendants
Father of
Died [date unknown] [location unknown]
Profile last modified | Created 25 Mar 2011
This page has been accessed 2,070 times.
The Puritan Great Migration.
Ralph Allen migrated to New England during the Puritan Great Migration (1621-1640).
Join: Puritan Great Migration Project
Discuss: pgm

Biography

Caution: The subject of this profile has in the past frequently been confused with other Ralph Allens. Before editing, please be certain to carefully read the Research Notes below.

Little is known of the Ralph Allen of this profile beyond his marriage, at London in 1619, to the equally little-known Hester English. If of average marrying age for grooms of the day in 1619, he may have been born close to 1592, possibly (but speculatively) at or near London.

No record indicating his emigration, nor any certain record of his passing, nor of the passing of his wife, has been found to date (April 2023).

Research Notes

Disambiguation The Ralph Allen of this profile was formerly linked from the profile of Ralph Allen, Senior, of Sandwich, as Ralph Allen, “Junior" – who married a wife named Esther Swift at Sandwich about 1646. This profile’s subject is known to have married only Hester English. He and Ralph Allen, Junior – Allen-43736 – are two entirely distinct individuals.

This confusion apparently goes back at least half a century, as far as Clarence Almon Torrey’s New England Marriages Prior to 1700. Torrey, relying on other sources, posited the known spouse of this profile’s Ralph Allen, Hester English – the two were married in 1619 in London[1] – as a first wife of the man who later married “Esther [SWIFT]” at Sandwich “by 1646(7?)”[2]. But the husband of Esther Swift was Ralph Allen, Junior... who was, as that "Junior" clearly implies, born later than Ralph Allen, Senior. The profile for Ralph, Senior, estimates his date of birth as “about 1617”; the profile for Ralph, Junior, estimates his date of birth as “about 1621”. For the latter to have married anyone in 1619 is an obvious impossibility.

In fact, the Ralph Allen of this profile has no proven tie to Sandwich in the relevant time period. A claim originally appearing in the Biography of this profile that his wife Hester “is said to be the Hester Allen who died on 15 Jun 1640 in Sandwich” is not supported by any primary source to be currently found via NEHGS (americanancestors.org), ancestry.com, or familysearch.org: no such death record has to date (January 2023) been transcribed and registered in the database of any of these three major genealogical repositories.

Disputed Parentage This profile also previously connected its subject, as a likely son, with a John Allen – perhaps the John Allen christened in 1605, or perhaps one of an earlier generation – of Saltford, Somerset, England. No primary evidence has been found to date (Jan. 2023) in support of this assertion. Further, the introduction of a Saltford Allen family into the Sandwich picture – which has been considered by others, noting particularly the Saltford presence of a George Allen in the first decades of the 1600s[3][4][5] – is largely undercut by experienced Allen researcher (and descendant of Ralph Allen, Senior) Jack MacDonald in a paper that is linked and downloadable from the website of the Allen DNA Patrilineage 2 Project. This George Allen appears, from records of legal proceedings, to have remained in Somerset in 1638, but his Sandwich namesake is proven to have by then already emigrated; and a descendant of the Saltford line of Allens who is familiar with that family’s genealogy informed MacDonald that no connection has been found between his lineage, and that of the primary Sandwich line – that of Ralph Allen, Senior[6].

Additional Background For some background notes originally included in this profile, please see the free-space page at Background Notes, Biography for Allen-2292.

Sources

  1. "ALLEN, Ralph1 & 1/wf Hester ENGLISH; St. Mary le Bow, London, 6 May 1619; Newport/Rehoboth/Sandwich {Allen (,2) 20, 22, 48, 59; Crapo 182, 852; Putnam's Mag. 1:289}" -- Vol. 1, p. 25, New England Marriages to 1700, Vol. 1, p. 25 (Online database. AmericanAncestors.org. New England Historic Genealogical Society, 2008.) Originally published as: New England Marriages Prior to 1700. Boston, Mass.: New England Historic Genealogical Society, 2015; https://www.americanancestors.org/DB1568/i/21174/25/426912092 (by subscription)
  2. "ALLEN, Ralph1 & 2/wf Esther [SWIFT]; by 1646(/7?); Sandwich {MD 14:109, 166, 16:21; Allen (,2) 24; Allen (,16) 27; Noyes-Gilman 371; Cornell 314; Crapo 182; Gen. Adv. 3:35, 74; Swift 18; Sv. 1:35; Austin: GDRI 73; Cape Cod Lib. 15:18; Reg. 25:144}" -- Vol. 1, p. 25, New England Marriages to 1700. (Online database. AmericanAncestors.org. New England Historic Genealogical Society, 2008.) Originally published as: New England Marriages Prior to 1700. Boston, Mass.: New England Historic Genealogical Society, 2015; https://www.americanancestors.org/DB1568/i/21174/25/426874575 (by subscription)
  3. George Allen, son of George: ”George Allen | Baptism | 15 Dec 1605 | Somerset | Saltford: St Mary : Parish Register”, FreeReg.org.UK, parish register transcribed by unspecified volunteer; https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_queries/63b775e4b620e0b168daa39f?locale=en
  4. ”A Sandwich-Dartmouth-North Kingstown Allen Line”, by Bertha Clark, Boston, 1955; typescript held by NEHGS; see image #377 of 421 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99XF-HNQ9?i=376&cat=118032
  5. ’’Ancestral Lines, Third Edition’’, by Carl Boyer 3rd, Santa Clarita, CA, 1998 [not found accessible online as of Jan. 2023; print version known to be available at the State Library in San Francisco]
  6. The ALLEN DNA Patrilineage 2 Project, as above; http://www.johnbrobb.com/JBR-ALLEN-R.htm [search on "The Allen Family: Descendants of George Allen", without quotes]




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Comments: 18

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If this profile is to be justified as that for the Ralph Allen who married Hester English at London in 1619 – which is really the only legitimate raison d'être I can see for it – then it needs to be, once and for all, disentangled from the profile of Ralph Allen, Junior (aka Ralph the Mason) of Sandwich. I have just added a marriage source from NEHGS, citing Torrey's New England Marriages.

The problem likely began with, or at least was promoted by, Torrey, who posited Hester English as a first wife of the man who later married "Esther [SWIFT]" at Sandwich "by 1646(7?)". But the husband of Esther Swift was Ralph Allen, Junior... who was, as that "Junior" clearly implies, born _later_ than Ralph Allen, Senior. The profile for Senior estimates his DOB as "about 1617"; the profile for Junior estimates his DOB as "about 1621". The problem, given the 1619 marriage date for Ralph and Hester, is fairly obvious.

It gets worse. This profile's Ralph has been linked to John Allen of Saltford as his father... with no source. The narrative biography in John's profile (which was orphaned, and which I've just adopted) touches on an old, and essentially unsound, hypothesis that John may have been the father of GM emigrant George Allen. I will be revising that narrative extensively.

I propose to also edit this profile's Biography so that the profile simply and correctly represents the husband of Hester English... with no demonstrable connection to the actual Allens of Sandwich. If this revision is put in place, PGM may wish either to remain as a co-manager to assist in preventing any repetition of the past confusion, or to remove itself from management.

If some real evidence is later found that links this Ralph Allen to the Allens of Sandwich, then my revision can of course be tossed and a new Biography put in place.

Please let me know of objections/concerns. -- Christopher (PGM Research)

posted by Christopher Childs
Christopher,

You might consider creating a new bio in a Free Space Page, which people can review and provide input on. Once accepted, the information could be copied into this profile (assuming consensus). How does that sound?

S

posted by S (Hill) Willson
Can do. Probably going to be a pretty short Bio, though! -- apart from the Disambiguation section...
posted by Christopher Childs
A proposed replacement Biography, including a Disambiguation section and Research Notes, is now reviewable at:

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Draft%2C_replacement_Biography_for_Allen-2292 .

PMs especially please take note.

posted by Christopher Childs
I have also now severed the unsupported connection with alleged father John Allen, whose profile I adopted... and which I've now extensively revised.
posted by Christopher Childs
Thank you Christopher,

The draft replacement has inline citation citing, "”A Sandwich-Dartmouth-North Kingstown Allen Line”, by Bertha Clark, Boston, 1955; typescript held by NEHGS [not found accessible online as of Jan. 2023]"

The manuscript is accessible online, see Bertha W. Clark. "A Sandwich-Dartmouth-North Kingstown Allen line," January 1955, 35 pp. (includes index), 5; digital images via FamilySearch Catalog, film 547019 (Item 8), digital collection (DGS) 7578550; manuscript begins at image 372 of 421; manuscript page 5 at image 381 of 421.

posted by GeneJ X
edited by GeneJ X
The only suggestion I can offer on the draft is to move "Disambiguation" so that it is under the biography. +3 if we can consolidate that section with the research notes section.--Gene
posted by GeneJ X
... Profile of the linked spouse seems similarly confused, no? --Gene
posted by GeneJ X
Does Hester English need to be removed as his wife?
posted by H Husted
Note The man known as Ralph Allen Jr who married Esther Swift. would be younger that the man known as Ralph Allen Sr. Sr's birth is estimated as 1617. Ralph Jr. could not be the man who married 1619. I've left notes for further research hopefully to clarify this.
posted by Anne B
Allen-38300 and Allen-2292 appear to represent the same person because: Despite the differences in data, these two people represent the same person. 2292 appears to be the best sourced (although may still need some work).
posted by Jillaine Smith
What sources show that this Ralph Allen is the one that married Esther Swift?
posted by S (Hill) Willson
This profile is for Ralph Allen "the mason," supposed son of John Allen. He must have been born before 1600 if he married in 1619.

The evidence for the two Ralphs are described in Anderson's "The Great Migration Begins" in the George Allen sketch (Vol. I, pg 31) and is a pretty good summary. That George was, apparently, the father of Ralph Allen (1617-1697).

posted by Randy Seaver
1) There is no Thurcaster in Leicestershire. I believe you must mean Thurcaston, although there is also Thurmaston and Thurlaston in Leicestershire.

2) If he was born in 1610, his first marriage would have been at age 9

3)If he was born in 1590 as the bio suggests, the father is too young.

Why does this profile show two different birthplaces for the same Ralph Allen? One of his birthplaces must be an error. His biography should be corrected to reflect one or the other unless neither can be proved. So much guess work isn't good for this Ralph Allen's Profile. Just making an observation with a suggestion. Thank you for posting the profile.
posted by William Fox Jr.
This profile was a composite of two different Ralph Allens. Changed birth and death dates to those for Ralph Allen "the mason", consistent with wife Esther and son Jedediah.
posted by Bryan McCullagh
Adding wife Esther Swift-174; see Bio for details and sources.
posted by Bryan McCullagh
There is no question that this Ralph Allen "the mason" was related to George Allen the immigrant (Allen-958).

Boyer suggests that they were brothers, but Jack MacDonald - who has researched the Allen family for years - is convinced they were not. (See Jack's comments on Allen-1301.) Jack suggests that they were either cousins, or that Ralph was George's nephew.

posted by Bryan McCullagh

Rejected matches › Ralph Allen Sr (abt.1617-abt.1698)