no image
Privacy Level: Open (White)

Alice (Neville) Conyers (abt. 1470)

Alice Conyers formerly Neville
Born about in Englandmap [uncertain]
Ancestors ancestors
Daughter of and [mother unknown]
Sister of [half], and [half]
Wife of — married [date unknown] [location unknown]
Descendants descendants
Mother of
Died [date unknown] [location unknown]
Problems/Questions Profile manager: Magna Carta Project WikiTree private message [send private message]
Profile last modified | Created 27 Dec 2014
This page has been accessed 2,237 times.
The Birth Date is a rough estimate. See the text for details.
Project Logo with "Pending" across it
Magna Carta Trail Pending
This profile is in a Magna Carta trail that is pending
development. See text for details.
Join: Magna Carta Project
Discuss: magna_carta

Contents

Biography

Alice was one of two illegitimate daughters of Richard Neville "the Kingmaker".[1] Her mother is unknown.[2][3]

Alice married Christopher Conyers, Esq., of Pinchingthorpe, Yorkshire,[1] son and heir of Brian Conyers and Elizabeth Nelson, before 1 July 1506 (date of demise).[2] They had two sone and three daughters:

  • John, Esq.[2]
  • George, Esq.[2]
  • Elizabeth, married Richard Carlisle[2]
  • Agnes, married Geoffrey Lee, Esq. and had issue[2]
  • Dorothy, married ______ Salter[2]

Alice's date and place of death are unknown. Her husband, Christopher, died 6 April 1543. Administration of his estate was granted 26 April 1543.[2]

Sources

  1. ↑ 1.0 1.1 Douglas Richardson, Royal Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 5 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham (Salt Lake City, Utah: the author, 2013), Vol IV, pp.126-129, MONTAGU #12, 12.ii
  2. ↑ 2.0 2.1 2.2 2.3 2.4 2.5 2.6 2.7 Douglas Richardson, Royal Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 5 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham (Salt Lake City, Utah: the author, 2013), Vol II, p. 465, DRAKE #13.
  3. ↑ Douglas Richardson, Magna Carta Ancestry: A Study in Colonial and Medieval Families, 2nd edition, 4 vols., ed. Kimball G. Everingham (Salt Lake City, Utah: the author, 2011), Vol II, p. 90, DRAKE #12.

Acknowledgements

Magna Carta Project

Alice (Neville) Conyers appears in Magna Carta Ancestry in a Richardson-documented trail from Gateway Ancestor Robert Drake to Magna Carta Surety Baron Roger le Bigod (vol. II, pages 90-92 DRAKE). This trail has not yet been developed. See the trail in the Magna Carta Trails section of the Gateway's profile.
  • Needs Development: This profile needs development against the project's checklist to bring it up to current project standards. ~ Thiessen-117 19:29, 29 July 2020 (UTC)
See Base Camp for more information about identified Magna Carta trails and their status. See the project's glossary for project-specific terms, such as a "badged trail".




Sponsored Search by Ancestry.com

DNA
No known carriers of Alice's DNA have taken a DNA test.

Have you taken a DNA test? If so, login to add it. If not, see our friends at Ancestry DNA.



Comments: 11

Leave a message for others who see this profile.
There are no comments yet.
Login to post a comment.
Ramsey Corbett
HoP (Geoffery Lee) does not say Alice was a Neville but does suggest Agnes had a relationship with Margaret Pole and her son Reginald through the house of Conyers thus they would support Alice as a Neville. However Reginald was a Cardinal and brother Edward Lee was Archbishop of York but such a relationship would be through the house of Lee. HoP which is held in high esteem, suggests Margaret and Reginald may have had a hand in the marriage as well as in Geoffery's election to Parliament. I still do not understand how Richard Neville's illegitimate daughter Margaret can be completely documented and an illegitimate daughter Alice completely overlooked.
posted by Ramsey Corbett
Thiessen-117 Traci Thiessen
Thank you for the information. This profile hasn't yet been developed by the Magna Carta Project. As Michael mentioned below, if you have reliable sources to add to this profile, please let us know by posting them to comments (you need to be a full member of WikiTree with pre-1500 certification to edit this profile). If you'd like to propose different parents, etc. please do so in the comments section. The MCP will get to this profile eventually but we have a huge workload so it might be awhile.
posted by Traci Thiessen
Ramsey Corbett
Hello again, I shouldn't go so far as proposing parents as I haven't done any original research (other than finding an explanation for the annuity as a political statement linking Agnes to Baldwin Fulford. Such statements ultimately led Henry VIII to order the execution of the Countess). I can only note that BLG1952 says Alice was the likely daughter of Thomas Fulford. I have seen proposals where the Earl's mistress was a Fulford which would allow Alice to be the Earl's daughter and account for the annuity. The Earl and Baldwin Fulford fought on the same side although he fell out with York and fled to France in 1470, about the time Alice was born. He returned to England supporting Henry VI which might account for Alice being overlooked if her mother was a Fulford and was killed in 1471 at the battle of Barnet. I can propose there may be some confusion on the part of Raines as the Earl had a (legitimate) niece Alice Neville who married a John (not Christopher) Conyers. By the same token there could be confusion on the part of BLG1952 as Christopher and Alice had a son John Conyers who married Alice daughter of Thomas Fulthrope (not Fulford). Ultimately, you'll have to sort out the Alice's, John's and Thomas's for yourselves.
posted by Ramsey Corbett
edited by Ramsey Corbett
Cayley-55 Michael Cayley
Thanks. If BLG is Burke’s Landed Gentry, we would place no reliance on it. None of the Burke publications are regarded as reliable sources for pre-1700 profiles: they contain many errors.
posted by Michael Cayley
Ramsey Corbett
If I said Alice was the daughter of Earl Richard Neville everyone would laugh but Richardson is gospel, at least here. She was the daughter of Thomas Fulford (not mentioned in the Devon Visitations, they missed a number of children including Joan/e who married Richard Downish). The earl did not have an illegitimate daughter Alice (not in Stirnet or FMG), he did have a mother and sister Alice. Was he trying to insult them? Alice would be a half-sister of Queen Anne Neville, wife of Richard III. Does anyone think Lee Magna would have forgotten that! The idea seems to be based on a token annuity given by the earl's granddaughter Countess Margaret Pole, to Alice's daughter Agnes Lee which was not financial support (it was 5L) but a political statement. Agnes's great grandfather Baldwin Fulford who supported Anne's father in-law Henry VI at the battle of Towton (her 1st husband Edward Prince of Wales was killed 10 years latter at the battle of Tewkesbury which triggered the execution of Henry VI), was captured and beheaded a few months after the Lancasterian defeat. That was the reason for the annuity. This should be marked as uncertain at the least, or disconnected and Thomas Fulford reattached.
posted by Ramsey Corbett
edited by Ramsey Corbett
Cayley-55 Michael Cayley
Thanks for your comments. As noted, this profile needs to be overhauled, and the evidence for Alice as a daughter of Richard Neville will need to be weighed up. One source naming Alice as an illegitimate daughter of Richard Neville, by the way, is Weaver’s edition of Somerset Visitations - see the Carlille pedigree, p. 14, https://archive.org/details/visitationsofcou00beno/page/14/mode/2up. Visitations are not always accurate. A secondary source is James Raine's "Wills and Inventories from the Registry of the Archdeaconry of Richmond", footnote on p. 110, https://archive.org/details/willsinventories00richrich/page/110/mode/2up. There may well be other sources but these are just two I have very quickly located.

If you have good reliable sources to contribute to help with this, please give them.

We do not regard Douglas Richardson as infallible on WikiTree, though we recognise that he is a respected genealogist. You will find a number of profiles where disagreements with Richardson are flagged up. I am afraid I would not regard Stirnet as a reliable source. Cawley's Medieval Lands - which you refer to as FMG - needs to be treated with caution: those of us active in working on medieval profiles have found quite a number of mistakes and omissions.

posted by Michael Cayley
edited by Michael Cayley
Ramsey Corbett
I just got around to looking up the secondary source you mention. It's quite interesting but I should note Earl Richard had a 1st cousin Alice Neville who married a John Conyers while the John son of Christopher and Alice married Alice daughter of Thomas Fulthrope so there could be confusion here between Alice Neville's or between the Fulford and Fulthrope, or both. Also, the Earl did have a sister and an illegitimate daughter named Margaret so why not an Alice? You have your research cut out for you!
posted by Ramsey Corbett
edited by Ramsey Corbett
Isaac Taylor
Is this natural daughter Alice Conyers understood to be uterine sister of the other natural daughter, Margaret Huddleston?
posted by Isaac Taylor
Noland-165 Liz (Noland) Shifflett
not by Richardson, and not according to the definition of "uterine sister" ...

Richardson says Alice & Margaret are illegitimate daughters of Richard Neville "by an unknown mistress or mistresses".

Google search of "define:uterine" returns the following definition from "Oxford Languages":

born of the same mother but not having the same father.
"a uterine sister"
posted by Liz (Noland) Shifflett
Cayley-55 Michael Cayley
Isaac, at this stage we clearly cannot assume the same mother and I would guess - no more than a guess - that the mothers were different. Do you have any well-sourced information? Please share it if you do. Otherwise, this waits until someone is able and willing to do some research. As is clear from the Magna Carta section of the profile, this profile needs quite a bit of work and research.
posted by Michael Cayley
edited by Michael Cayley
Anderson-35092 Robin Anderson
Hi! The Magna Carta project has identified this profile as on a 'trail' from Gateway Ancestor Robert Drake to Surety Baron Roger Bigod. We will be updating this profile in line with project guidelines. (See Base Camp, contact person Robin Anderson)
posted by Robin Anderson

Featured National Park champion connections: Alice is 17 degrees from Theodore Roosevelt, 21 degrees from Stephanus Johannes Paulus Kruger, 15 degrees from George Catlin, 18 degrees from Marjory Douglas, 26 degrees from Sueko Embrey, 16 degrees from George Grinnell, 23 degrees from Anton Kröller, 16 degrees from Stephen Mather, 22 degrees from Kara McKean, 19 degrees from John Muir, 15 degrees from Victoria Hanover and 27 degrees from Charles Young on our single family tree. Login to find your connection.

N  >  Neville  |  C  >  Conyers  >  Alice (Neville) Conyers

Categories: Edward III 5th Gen Descendants | Estimated Birth Date | Magna Carta Profiles | Magna Carta Project Needs Development