Help with Quebecois connections to the tree - Nicolle Wallace of The View and Emmanuel Etienne of Montreal

Question

Hey, Global Family Reunion members (and everyone else, too!)

AJ is working to set up an interview with the hosts of the television talk show, The View. Nicolle (Devenish) Wallace isn't connected to the tree yet, but I think I've got a French Canadian lead to work from. I've been poking around online, and it looks like it would be an easy connection to make and verify if you have access to the Drouin Collection. 

Here's the family in question: Emmanuel Etienne.

We also need proof that this is the Emmanuel Etienne who married Nicolle's great-grandmother May Hands in London, England in 1917. 

Here's why I'm leaning toward it being the same man:

There is a record in the BMD index for an Emmanuel A. Etienne who died in England in 1941, and was born in or around 1881.

I couldn't find an Emmanuel Etienne in the 1911 or 1901 Census of England, so it looks like May's (then future) husband was not counted, or not from England.

Emmanuel's wife Clarinda is listed as widowed in the 1921 Canada Census, but I was unable to find a record of Emmanuel being killed during WWI, or a death record for him in Ontario. (Of course, he could have returned to Canada ill, and been sent to a Veteran's hospital in another part of the country, and died there.)

Can someone help figure out if these two Emmanuel Etiennes are the same man, and connect him to the tree?

Comments

Can we prove the Cantin/Quentin line from Thérèse Cantin back to Denis Quentin? I attached a baptism for a Marie Thérèse in 1799. It seems plausible that there could be one woman baptized in 1798 who could be the same person in the Portneuf area who is shown born 1799 in St Raymond, Portneuf in the 1851 census and then born in 1805 in St Augustin, Portneuf in the 1861 census.

Is this too big of a leap without more ties between generations?

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It looks like the Therese in those censuses is a different one from the wife of Athanase Jobin, because she is marked as single in the 1861 census. Also, Portneuf is almost 200 kilometers from Montreal (where Athanase was living), which seems like a huge distance for a husband and wife to live apart. Unless Therese left Athanase and went to live closer to her family?

Athanase and Therese's youngest living child was Julie, born around 1843, so the next step would be to look for a death record for Therese between 1843 and 1851 to rule out the Portneuf Therese.

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Thanks, Erin! I've attached another Drouin baptism for another Marie Therese Cantin at http://www.wikitree.com/photo/jpg/Cantin-55-1

Is it better to remove them both from her profile, since we don't know if either one is Athanase's wife?

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Thanks, Karen! Just leave a comment on the image that you're unsure if the Therese in the baptismal record is the same woman who married Athanase Jobin. If it isn't her, we can always create another profile for the person who is in the record.

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I wonder if this patent is by Clarinda's Etienne? It's from 1908 in Sudbury.

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I bet it is. What a neat find!

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For Emmanuel Etienne of Ontario, his son's marriage announcement of 1926 and his wife Clarenda's obituary of 1959 make no mention of him. She is simply Mrs. Clarenda Etienne.

Answer 1

I added baptism info for the Emmanuel profile in question. What else can I look up?

Comments

Oh, and the birth date was off by a year in the military record, so I changed it to the date in the baptism record, which I would assume is more accurate.

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Thanks, Roland. 

I've also seen a few trees that have Emmanuel's grandfather Athanase Jobin as a descendant of Francois Madeleine Jobin (who is already connected to the tree). Would you be able to look into that and source the steps to Francois? Thanks!

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Could someone help transcribe the blurry baptism from Ancestry's copy of Drouin? It's at http://www.wikitree.com/photo/jpg/Jobin-77

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Can you post the ancestry link to the Drouin image?

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I didn't make much progress on this last night, but I can try again this weekend.

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http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=drouinvitals&h=15151016&ti=0&indiv=try&gss=pt&ssrc=pt_t73687093_p36291736923_kpidz0q3d36291736923z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid

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I found a better image on FamilySearch.

"Québec, registres paroissiaux catholiques, 1621-1979," index and images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-27974-8447-38?cc=1321742&wc=9RLH-3Y9:15298201,15298202,15819801 : accessed 18 Oct 2014), Laval > Saint François-de-Sales-de-l'Ile-Jésus > Baptêmes, mariages, sépultures 1761-1805, 1847-1876 > image 214 of 559.

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Merci, Roland! I placed your source before the Ancestry one since the image is much better. I thought of deleting the Ancestry source, but it does have his name, so that's something.

Do you think we should proceed with the assumption that the Laval baptism is for the same Athanase who married Thérèse Cantin? That would allow us to add his parents. Also, the 1851 census we've attached states the birthplace as Pointe-aux-Trembles, but I suppose that could be incorrect. It doesn't seem like you'd baptize a Pointe-aux-Trembles babe in Laval on his birthday.

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I wonder if Pointe-aux-Trembles would have been considered part of the same diocese as Laval at the time. Laval is diagonally across the Riviere des Prairies from Pointe-aux-Trembles, and Google Maps gives a 25 km drive from the center of one to the other. 

Here are two bulletin board postings that assume that Athanase Jobin who married Therese Cantin was the son of Antoine Jobin:

Rootsweb message posting

Genealogy.com Genforum posting

 

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I spent some time with the Drouin Collection and connected Athanase back to François-Madeleine Jobin as Erin suggested. This line looks pretty good to me. What do the rest of you think? This puts Emmanuel Etienne five generations from François, who is 26 degrees from AJ.

I see on FamilySearch they have registers from Pointe-aux-Trembles dating from 1674. There are five parishes in Laval, although one (Sainte-Dorothée) wasn't founded until 1869.

I'm in favor of accepting Athanase as the son of Antoine Jobin and Mary Reignier, it just made me want to stop and think and hear from someone who knows the area and its history. I'm only 1/16 Québécoise and my folks are from Indiana and Illinois. 

In addition to all of you, thanks are due to Mme. Debbie Olejniczek, my high school French teacher. 

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It is interesting that the disappearance of Clarenda's husband Etienne is not mentioned in the local newspaper indices at all, neither as an obit, nor in the social notices. Nelly R. of the Thunder Bay area is going to check with Dave Nicholson who spearheaded the indexing project, after she reads Clarenda's obit to check for mention of Emmanuel. Another possible source is the local Henderson directory which lists residence and occupation of each head of household, sometime each adult.  Those are available in the Thunder Bay archives, and apparently less easily available on microfilm.

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Karen, you are a powerhouse. Thanks for getting in touch with the Thunder Bay folks. I can't wait to hear what they know.

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Pointe-aux-Trembles and Laval are part of the same diocese, which was probably the Montreal diocese.  They are however distinct parishes.  The oldest parish in Laval I believe was St-François-de-Sales de l'île-Jésus (actual island name on which Laval city is located), Pointe-aux-Trembles is also quite old, dates back to the 1600s or so.

Answer 2

There is an Emmanuel Edmond Étienne who marries Marie Louise Clarinda Bélanger on 14 March 1899 in Notre-Dame basilica of Montreal.  He is listed as a minor on the record, and she is of age.  His parents are Joseph Étienne and Domitilde Jobin, her parents are Joseph Bélanger and Célodine Gohier (noted as deceased)

I do not find him in 1881 census for Quebec, although I do find a Joseph Étienne who could possibly be his father.  If so, he is of native Montagnais descent, as that is the language he states as his.

Etienne, Joseph
Sexe :
M
État civil :
M
Metier :

Religion :
Catholique
Langue :
Montagnais

Âge :
40 ans
Lieu de naissance
Québec
District :
#76 Chicoutimi & Saguenay
Sous-district :
#ff-2 Territoire non-organisée
Page, ligne
11, 16

I do not find this man in the 1901 census for Quebec.  This is all from Drouin collection