Proposal to re-identify (or not) John Bate and wife Dorcas (16th century, England)

+7 votes

In the several months WikiTree-ers have been collaborating about John Bate / Bate-37, none of us has been able to devise a reasonable identity for such a historical person born in the early 1500s. The same is true for his wife, Dorcas Bate/Bate-75

This proposal seeks to learn whether or not we should

(a) Re-identify John Bate / Bate-37 (married Dorcas) as the duplicate of Rev. John Bate, Bate-642. The latter man is known to have succeeded Rev. Stephen Bachiler as the Vicar of Wherwell.[1] Bate-642 had known wife Dorcas and was of Wherwell in 1633 when he wrote his will.[2] (He presumably died there.) if we seek this option, comments about his earlier disputed identity will be included in the narrative. Ditto for his wife, Dorcas.


(b) Mark the profiles of John Bate / Bate-37 and Dorcas Bate/Bate-75 as "questionable" and proceed to create a new profile for Dorcas, the wife of Rev. John Bate, Bate-642, etc.


In our earlier collaboration, we showed and agreed that 

  • He was almost certainly not the John, son of Andrew Bate, Bate-37 of Lydd, and so that relationship was severed. (Andrew's son John has been shown to be John Bate(s), Bates-3600. See this G2G.) 
  • The once reported marriage vital data attributed to this couple, John Bate and Dorcas Bate, was shown to be that of a different couple (John Bate, Jurat, married Mary Bennett at Lydd, Kent, England, 15 June 1579 [3]). 

Even if the marriage date had not been disproved, it was unlikely that a couple who hadn't married until 1579 were the parents of the once associated son born almost forty years earlier, John Bate/Bate-3. The latter man is in turn reported the father of Rev. John Bate of Wherwell (Bate-632, who died of Wherwell, 1633) and father-in-law to Rev. Stephen Bachiler. The parent-child relationship between John and Dorcus and that son, Bate-3, was severed following a recent G2G; Bate-3 remains marked as "questionable." Once a decision has been made about John and Dorcas Bate (forcus of this post), more  G2G work will be done on Bate-3 and his wife, the also "questionable" Ann Bray/Bray-379.


[1] "…on the ninth day of August 1605, John Bate, a clergyman, was appointed Vicar of Wherwell," in Eleanor Campbell Schoen, "Our Fascinating Ancestor, Stephen Bachiler," 1999; reprinted with permission at Lane Memorial (Hampton, New Hampshire) Library (accessed 2014). 

[2] Charles Batchelder, "Batchelder/Bachilder Genealogy, through Rev. Stephen Batchiler's son Stephen Bachilder," 1985, Carl W. Brage, ed., p. 2; digital images, Lane Memorial (Hampton, New Hampshire) Library ( : accessed 2014).

[3] Alfred C. Bates [and H. G. Somerby], “Lydd Parish Register,” The Bates Bulletin, Series 3/Volume 1 (1917):6 (in particular part), ''Internet Archive'' (accessed 2014).

WikiTree profile: John Bate
in Genealogy Help by GeneJ X G2G6 Mach 6 (60.3k points)
edited by GeneJ X
The son born 40 years earlier ,do have a estimated birth date , what county in

England,any of his childrens name ,or his wife name.

Thank you for your interest in helping out, Wayne. 

We've separately determined that the now severed son has a questionable identity. His profile is available as Bate-3

Proceeding to implement option (a)!

Please log in or register to answer this question.

Related questions

+5 votes
1 answer
1.1k views asked Apr 28, 2014 in Genealogy Help by GeneJ X G2G6 Mach 6 (60.3k points)
+5 votes
1 answer
+7 votes
1 answer
+5 votes
2 answers
+5 votes
0 answers
165 views asked Apr 28, 2014 in Genealogy Help by GeneJ X G2G6 Mach 6 (60.3k points)
+3 votes
2 answers
182 views asked Oct 19, 2014 in Genealogy Help by GeneJ X G2G6 Mach 6 (60.3k points)
+1 vote
2 answers
55 views asked Oct 5 in Genealogy Help by Geoffrey Raebel G2G6 (7.0k points)
+3 votes
1 answer
72 views asked Aug 11, 2017 in Policy and Style by Cynthia B G2G6 Pilot (128k points)

WikiTree  ~  About  ~  Help Help  ~  Search Person Search  ~  Surname:

disclaimer - terms - copyright