Adding gateway ancestor not in Richardson?

+6 votes
239 views

In the past, the Magna Carta project allowed proposals for additional gateway ancestors not covered by Richardson:  https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Gateway_Ancestors_-_Magna_Carta_Project#Additional_Gateway_Ancestors_.28to_be_confirmed.29  That page is now considered to be in legacy status and the new page, https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Gateway_Ancestors, refers only to people found in Richardson.  Is there still a method to propose other gateway ancestors?

in The Tree House by Kerry Larson G2G6 Pilot (160k points)
retagged by Darlene Athey-Hill
Is there a reason that it needs to be a project approving it? Maybe it would be more interesting to explain the proposed gateway.

Obviously as individuals we do look for new leads all the time, and occasionally we might even decide to disagree with Richardson on a point.

I asked so that I would know what hoops needed jumping through if the project did consider non-Richardson candidates.  Just nice to have a seal of approval.  The person I'm considering is on the National Society - Saints and Sinners list based on Gary Boyd Roberts newest book, The Royal Descents of 900 Immigrants.

4 Answers

+6 votes
 
Best answer

The Magna Carta Project no longer has the subproject that actively researches trails for Gateways not documented by Richardson. But anyone can suggest a gateway for inclusion in the project. The profile for the proposed Gateway and profiles on the trail should be developed using the project's checklist, with clear primary proof for the trail's parent/child relationships until the trail hits someone that is documented in Richardson's 2011 Magna Carta Ancestry or 2013 Royal Ancestry.

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Magna_Carta_Project_Checklist

Cheers, Liz

by Liz Shifflett G2G6 Pilot (458k points)
selected by Traci Thiessen
Thanks Liz.  Looks like I've got some work to do.
Thanks Liz

The Baron makes sense because I guess he was the one who left the area and our gateway to the world....just can’t keep up with him

It is funny because according to house records in Latvia, he did go to America in their lingo.

But It is unknown yer whether this would have bee his Baronin’s cousins in Maryland - but more likely that it referred to his marriage and service in the Caribbean - which more predominantly in their mind as America as Courland settler Tobago at one time with an uncles there in about 1640.
+6 votes
There is no longer a project or team members that research/work on trails for Gateways not documented by Douglas Richardson.
by Darlene Athey-Hill G2G6 Pilot (435k points)
Too bad.  Thanks for the answer Darlene.
Didn't a new gateway ancestor get added recently - an Australian link?
Melanie - Over the years I had several people look into documenting an Australian trail, but I don't believe one has ever been submitted for review. The project's scope is for immigrants to America prior to 1700, but for immigrants to Australia we could change the date - I never did get around to researching what date would be appropriate... it would depend on the major immigration wave(s).
+3 votes
The issue with Richardson is this makes it only an American game - of which he has made an impressive contribution but no one individual is capable of handling it all ...and the concept of a gateway ancestor is something to which the rest of the world is oblivious.

For example, the Anglo-Irish are teeming with ancestral links to Magna Carta, and a few of them are still there today.  

To walk beyond Magna Carta specifically, to the general concept - how would we ever address such a label.

Classically, in Americana - they are people that crossed the pond generations ago and a long time ago.

So how would I and many of my peers look at Euristo?

In my particular case, my fourth great grandfather, the last baron in our family  is in the Baltic Noble register...and I have at their satisfaction completed out the rest of his entire career to his grave - and a growing extensive biography for the historians among them.

We don't clamor to join Aristocratic societies - because in our world you are noble or aren't - and we aren't American

But if you were to posit a gateway ancestor who would it be?

His daughter apparently the only one with children was born in England, her mother - his first Baronin (but translated back to Baroness in English) born in St. Kitts also with such ancestry.

His grandson, my second great grandfather and the only surviving male line was born in Northern Ireland.  His father also has proven Magna Carta as well does his wife in the Hunt side.

Referencing back to Ireland, there are several other lines with very solidly proven or most like scenario (like all others are unlikely) Magna Carta ancestry

His oldest son was born in Cashel, his oldest son was born in Dalkey, his oldest son was born in Vom Nigeria (his mother has proven descent from Richard More) and his son me, born in Montreal, Quebec, his son born in British Columbia, his son born Nova Scotia.

So please tell me who is the gateway ancestor there?
by Lloyd de Vere Hunt G2G6 Mach 2 (26.8k points)

The Magna Carta Project differentiates "Gateway Ancestor" and "gateway ancestor". From [the Project glossary] - column headings are "Term", "Short Answer", "Project Page(s)":

gateway ancestor (lowercase) any ancestor, usually the immigrant ancestor, who is descended from royalty or other notable (such as a surety baron) n/a
Gateway Ancestor as used by the project, one of the 200+ immigrant ancestors listed by Richardson in his Magna Carta Ancestry Category:Gateway Ancestors

So, I would say the gateway ancestor is someone from whom most of folks in the group you're looking at are descended and who is descended from a royal or other notable.

if you read the list in

 https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Gateway_Descendants_from_Edward_III

It says 

Australian Gateway Ancestors

Australian Gateway Ancestors Status and comments
Augusta Suffield

So should this be with with a small g instead of a Capital G or is this a sub project for Australians. Just getting confused here.
Immigrant in 1839. Unpublished but traceable in each generation. See G2G. Proposed by Mark Hutchinson.







 

Thanks for your response.

So I am the immigrant I guess, so I am a "gateway" ancestor, small "g." or dad or grandpa is

The real funny thing is that my dad and grandfather didn't become a Canadian citizen until I was a teenager.

 Well you have to start somewhere.

Lloyd - I think if it were my family, I would consider the baron the gateway - think of the gateway in this case as the person that opens the door to royal connections.

Will - The Magna Carta Project was created using Richardson as its main reference to give it an established, fairly easily accessed body of work (Magna Carta Ancestry 2nd ed. is on Google Books, snippet view). The project uses Richardson's definition of a Gateway, and the door that opens is at the American shore.

The Descendants of Edward III Project is also using Gateway Ancestor (capital), but in a different sense - to refer to Gateways to a specific person - Edward III.

Sorry about the confusion caused by uc/lc and different projects using the same term to mean different things. Whenever you encounter the term, consider the context. If it's in the context of the Magna Carta Project, whether the term is uc or lc (Gateway Ancestor or gateway ancestor) makes a difference. Other groups or projects may use the same term - either uc or lc - to mean something different. And pages using the term will generally adhere to normal styles for capping headings. So... back to "consider the context". Hope that helped instead of causing more confusion, as my last reply seemed to.

Cheers, Liz

Liz,

The current Gateway Ancestor for Linage Societies today is the first Ancestor of Royal Linage to arrive in North America, so this does not necessarily mean the United States.

My approved Spanish Gateway Ancestor Juan Montes Vigil, approved in 2019 by the Order of the Crown of Charlemagne was the first in North America (1611 Mexico) rather than my first ancestor of this line to arrive in New Mexico, USA in 1690.

From what I understand, there are several in Canada like this also.

This is used by all the Major lineage Societies, as I have joined the OCC, OMD, MOC, DTK and OTC.

Both the MOC & DTK fall under the same umbrella as The Baronial Order of Magna Charta. Note, Juan Montes Vigil, Mexico listed under "V" as a Gateway for MOC. With the OCC he is listed under "M" for Montes Vigil.

https://www.magnacharta.com/gateway-ancestors/
0 votes
My Proven Gateway Ancestor is too new to be in Richardson's works yet. Juan Montes Vigil was verified & accepted as a proven Gateway Ancestor in July 2019 by the Order of the Crown of Charlemagne in the United States. I was approved as a life OCC member in August 2019 through him.

Juan Montes Vigil is the First Spanish Gateway to be accepted by lineage Societies, and has not been used for membership in the OCC, OMD, MOC, DTK and OTC.

Juan Montes Vigil connects to Alfonso IX of Leon who connects to most European Royal Houses.

He is listed under "M" for Montes Vigil

https://www.charlemagne.org/Gateway.html
by Cfv Smith G2G1 (1.2k points)

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