Anyone with German research knowledge, willing to push this tree back further.

Question

Redirecting this G2G post. I don't have knowledge of German research, so if someone would like to push this family tree back, I have gotten them back to Germany, or Prussia. Thank you.

Matthes Gardy (or Gardi) and Marie Werban (or Werran), sailed from Hamburg in 1857 to Adelaide with 2 children.

Matthes' parents were Matthes Gardy and Anna (Kowla).

Marie's parents were Martin Werban and Ann (Jeitz).

Will also be looking at pushing back on Marie Washusen's family, from Othfresen, Hanover. Parents Andreas Washusen and Johanne Marie Gamblebe.

Question was as below, but we solved it:

Marianne is the mother Matthes Gardy-13.

Matthes' death certificate, listed on his page, says his father is Matthes, and mother Marianne (nee Werban).

I believe his father is listed in the Victoria BDM Index as Matthew Gardy, death in 1898, 2755/1898, but can't find his wife.

A Trove article for Matthes Gardy-13, says he came to Australia from Germany with his two parents when he was 3, ( https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/72635938?searchTerm=%22matthes%20gardy%22 ) which would be about 1858. I wonder if it is a hint in the article, that Marianne died before 1872, because it says that his father was 'one of the first settlers in the Ashens district', but doesn't mention the mother.

I can't find a ship listing as well. I can't find a cemetery listing for either of them, at Murtoa, or Ashens, on Billiongraves or Find My Grave. No listing on PROV or NAA

Any other hints the Australia team can think of? Thank you.

This family isn't in my family, so I won't be buying a certificate.

I'll add a Germany tag to this, to see if anyone may find their departure, birth or marriage in Germany. I wouldn't know the first thing about German research.

Comments

Ewald Otto and Freidrich August have the same mother.

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ETA : GARDY

Marie Christine Auguste

Death

<Unknown Family Name>, Johanne Marie

GAMBLEBE

<Unknown Family Name>, WASHUSEN Andreas

OTHFRESEN HANOVER GERMANY

ASHENS

<Unknown Family Name>

91

1948

23239/1948

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It is possible she died elsewhere.

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Yep. That was Matthes Gardy-13's wife, maiden name Washusen.

I can't find a death in any other Australian state either, and I wonder if it was spelt incorrectly in Victoria.

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I was going to list all the kids, then thought you probably had them -- looking for clues, similarities.

With Mathew the father -- do you have any immigration info?

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I found all the children for Matthes Gardy-13 and his wife. So, you're correct.

I've tried searching passenger lists on PROV and can't find any incoming for them, Assisted or Unassisted. I also tried South Australian Passenger Lists, considering so many Germans came in through South Australia. I didn't succeed, but it may be hiding from me there.

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The newspaper does say he came with his parents, plural, so it's fair to think his mother died in Aus.

Did you check SA's BDM for her?

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Found Arrival.

GARDI Matthias, Marie WERRAN, Christiane, Matthias arrived in SA 1857-09-21 on Caesar & Helene from Hamburg 1857-06-16.

https://familyhistorysa.org/shipping/passengerlists.html

Is it a German thing for wives to keep their maiden names?

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Got it now.

'''Death Index''', Victoria BDM Deaths 7504/1861 in 1861, GARDI Maria, (F)WERBAN Martin, (M)Ann (Jeitz), born Prus, died age 41.

Put an answer up Melanie, so I can give you a star for helping look.

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I just found that, too!

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I figured it was a misspelt name, but it was going to be almost impossible to work out which way it was misspelt.

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And that gives a sibling in Australia that I can look for too. Could open up another whole branch.

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Is it a German thing for wives to keep their maiden names?

commented by Ben Molesworth

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Often, yes.  Mostly they were "renamed" on or after immigration, though, to conform with the Englischer thinking.   Same with Swedish and Scottish immigrant wives.

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Interesting. Of the about 50 ancestors I have, who came to Australia, only one was not from UK. He was from Norway. So, I usually spend all my time in Australian research, or UK.

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We might have found her sooner if I'd not been looking for "Marianne".  It was when I dropped the first name I got the hit.

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Oh well. I was really struggling too. Every time I look at passenger lists in South Australia, it seems to be with a different website. I'll have to save that one, it was easier.

Now I'm on the hunt for Christiane Gardi, who was the other child on the ship. We'll see what comes of it.

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I might change the description to. Looking for anyone who is happy to adopt researching german roots on this family. Once it gets to another language, that's enough for me.

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Now I'm on the hunt for Christiane Gardi, who was the other child on the ship. We'll see what comes of it.

commented by Ben Molesworth

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Variations on that might be Christina, Christian, Christiana. 

Looking for anyone who is happy to adopt researching german roots on this family. Once it gets to another language, that's enough for me.

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You could post to the https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Prussian_Settlement_in_Australia_-_German_Australians 

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http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/Australia/Caesar%26helene1857.shtml has the family as Giardi / Gardi, from Werben, Cottbus Prussia. It has Christiane as 9 years old in 1857. There is a GenealogySA listing for Christiana Gardy marrying Johann Heinrich Jaeger at Grey in 1867, which would be about the right age, so I think she is found.

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There is a GenealogySA listing for Christiana Gardy marrying Johann Heinrich Jaeger at Grey in 1867, which would be about the right age, so I think she is found.

commented by Ben Molesworth

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Great work! 

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Church records for Werben are available at archion.de beginning 1642.  1 month membership is very reasonable.

Mathias & Marie were married 11Feb1854
See :  their record at

https://www.archion.de/en/browse/?no_cache=1#https://www.archion.de/en/browse/?no_cache=1&path=36694-714745-715029

 Berlin, Brandenburg, schlesische Oberlausitz: Landeskirchliches Archiv in Berlin > Cottbus > Werben > Trauungen 1824-1890  image 78  record #4

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Thank you. Very good.

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Certainly. Anyone is welcome to work on these profiles. Thank you for your help. This isn't my family. It was through a second marriage of someone in my family, and another second marriage, and this is the parents of his siblings spouse. So not my family. I'm just pushing any connections to me as far as I can. But I'll try and stick within Australia, where I am a lot more familar with the resources. Hopefully a descendant of this family will find this one day, and be interested in taking over, or at least being thankful for the work we have put into it.

Answer 1

my male family members registered for the draft when that got to America ,there was an old man draft , so you didn't have to be a young man , just old enough to fight in the war that was brewing .