Can someone create an external link template for DAR?

Question

It has been pointed out that https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Template:DAR-grs is not an approved template.  See https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/985761/how-do-i-show-that-i-am-a-member-of-dar?show=1124829#c1124829

We clearly have MANY profiles with this template, and if we need to change it to a new template, can someone do this?  

Thank YOU!

Answer 1

There are currently two new stickers being worked on for DAR (members and patriot ancestors). However, the source template is not used in the same fashion as a sticker, so recoding it to display as a sticker, or having EditBOT change it from one template to another is not feasible in this case.

So the DAR-grs template would need to be officially retired and manually changed to one of the approved stickers.

Edit: Sorry, my mind is all over the place today. This source template could be changed to an External Link Template. I can look into that now.

Comments

Steve, why isnt it approved, if DAR themselves asked for us to use it? Ive corrected some templates that were missing parameters thinking that was the best option.

Also, if this is a proposal, we should probably have the Yes i agree or No i dont agree answers to upvote, right?

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Hi Jonathon, please see: Should templates for sources be officially recommended?

In short, Sources are part of our content and it makes it harder for others to collaborate on profiles. Instead of Source Templates, External Link templates were approved instead (and can be achieved herein).

In regards to voting, that is not necessary for templates.

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Thank you Steve, I was unaware of that conversation and the distinction between source templates and external links.

 Re: voting, those prior discussions clearly included a vote, and if no vote was necessary, why the recommendation for the separate post as a proposal?

In any case, I have a better understanding of the DAR issue and the usage and will adjust my own habits accordingly.

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Hey Jonathon, as I mentioned in my edit above, my mind is a bit all over the place this last week. I am just back to WT after a long break and still trying to get caught up in multiple areas. Just a slip of the tongue really 

Answer 2

If I remember correctly (I was not involved in the interactions), DAR said they did not want Wikitree to deeplink to specific records on their website (I don't know why). If that is the case, an external link template would not be appropriate here, because the only link it could add would be a link to the DAR homepage.

The DAR Source template was created to appease DAR. It appears that it may be impossible to both (1) appease DAR and (2) maintain strict enforcement of the Wikitree rule against Source templates.

Options appear to include (1) seeing if DAR has softened or  will soften its policy on links (given the time and effort that was expended to get approval for the current template, I don't believe that this will be a popular idea with anyone who was invoved), (2) acknowledge that the DAR template is an exception to the general policy against Source templates (I think this is entirely justified; for one thing, the template was created and approved before the policy existed because of the need to satisfy DAR), and (3) call the template an External Link  template, even if it isn't one.

Edited: The current template does in fact include an external link to the record for the patriot, not merely their name and database number. But it does include more content than just a link.

Comments

Honestly, the DAR policy is ridiculous. They cannot stop anyone from taking the full URL to a DAR ancestor profile and putting it on any website. They don't own the URL. If anything, they should be thankful that we are trying to drive more traffic to their website.

The DAR can, however, completely rearrange the display of their data and change the URL to a profile. This is what happened with Find A Grave.

In the end, a WikiTree template is nothing more than a shorthand that includes text and a link. If DAR changes their layout, we can change the link.

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An external link should still meet their requirements. Their pages state that:

The databases contain DAR proprietary information which should under no circumstances be redistributed to others, assembled, reproduced, published, or posted in any form whatsoever with the exception of the following: (i) DAR membership and supplemental applications; (ii) citation in genealogical scholarship; and (iii) citing a DAR patriot name and number in publications and on third party websites.

This is how the External Link would be formatted, to cite the DAR patriot name and number, such as:

DAR GRS: Jacob Rup, Jr., #A100000

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The DAR fussed a lot about citation format before approving the current template. WikiTreers spent quite a few months getting it approved. I just checked the behavior of the current template by creating it for one of my ancestors. It is basically an external link template, but it also generates other details required by the DAR. The template {{DAR-grs|A022160|Asa Clark|30 April 2018}} results in:

Daughters of the American Revolution, DAR Genealogical Research Databases, database online, (http://www.dar.org/ : accessed 30 April 2018), "Record of Asa Clark", Ancestor # A022160.

Removing the name of the organization and the access date might make it fit the WikiTree rules on allowed template types, but that would be a foolish thing to do. It would create a lot of extra work for members wanting to cite the DAR database and it could offend the DAR. 

Far better to either call the existing template an External Link Template or make it an exception to the WikiTree policy on Source Templates.

Following unrealistic orders without questioning them may be the right way to behave in military service, but WikiTree is not the military.

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DAR seems to have updated their policy. Please see 

https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/1129476/dar-sticker-new-nsdar-guidelines-re-national-numbers