New Black Sheep Project

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New Black Sheep Project

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Several ideas floating around the Project-sphere concern some of our more colorful ancestors. We have decided to start a Black Sheep top-level project to put them all in one place. Right now Terry Wright is putting together a sub-project for the Hatfields and McCoys of family feuding fame; a few other members, including Chris Hoyt and Kyle Dane have put some work into those folks associated with the Salem Witch Trials, which will most likely develop into its own sub-project as well. We're building some steam-who wants to be a part of this fun new endeavor?

We have permission to associate with the IBSSG (Black Sheep Society), and will build a template and free-space page similar to the DAR/SAR ones from the 1776 project. (Thanks, Peter for helping arrange this).

We still need a Leader for the top-level project, but I will help run it for now, until someone else can.

Edited to add: Anyone can participate in the project-whether you have a Black Sheep ancestor or not, or are part of the society or not. We are simply using their criteria for a "Black Sheep" as what we'll use to decide whether a profile shoudl be part of the project.

This is related to a request for the project earlier this year.

UPDATE: I finally finished the project page so we're ready to roll! Check out the page for details on how to join, as well as to suggest sub-projects.

asked Jan 13, 2015 in The Tree House by Abby Glann G2G6 Pilot (734k points)
edited Jan 30, 2015 by Abby Glann

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Well here one my Blacksheep he got kicked out of Friends Meetings. He's my 6th great Grandpa.

Thomas Hartley, son of Edward Hartley, one of the pioneer brothers was born about 1700, died 1787, made application for membership in Buckingham Meeting of the Society of Friends Oct. 1. 1724, and was admitted two months later. In February 1725 or 6 he declared intentions of marriage before this meeting with Elizabeth Paxson, daughter of Henry Paxson of Solebury and on March 1, 1725 or 6 they were granted permission to accomplish their said intentions according to the good order maintained among Friends. On June 19, 1727, his father conveyed to him 100 acres of land, part of the old homestead and at his death devised him another portion therof, in addition to this he purchased adjoining lands and at his death owned about 500 acres of land lying contiguous in Solebury Township north of the present village of Lahaska. His will dated January 27, 1787, devised land to sons, Anthony, Benjamin and William, and daughter Letitia Rice, and to son Joseph One Hundred pounds. Other legacies to grandchildren, etc.

The children of Thomas and Elizabeth [Paxson] Hartley, who were married March 1, 1725 or 6 were:
Sarah Hartley, born 1726, married Jacob Beans.
Mary Hartley, born 1727, died 1746.
Thomas Hartley, Jr., born 1729, died 1746.
Anthony Hartley, born 1730, twice married, many children;
William Hartley, born 1732, married Katharine Fisher in 1757, died 1805 and left issue;
Elizabeth Hartley, born 1734, married 1753 John Fell, left issue.
Martha Hartley, born 1735, married Like William, and had 5 children;
Anne Hartley, Born 1738, married 1757 James Hill and had issue;
Rachel Hartley, born 1740, married 1765 Ephriam Smith;
Joseph Hartley, born 8th mo. (October) 18, 1742, married twice. First marriage May 27, 1765 to Sarah Richards; Second marriage November 8, 1767 to Elizabeth Wasson;
Benjamin Hartley, born 1745, married 1760 to Elizabeth Sincook; (his son Joseph Hartley removed to Ohio);
Mahlon Hartley, born 1749, married 1773 Hannah Moon; they moved to Green County, Pennsylvania, he died in 1824.
Joseph Hartley married "Out of Unity" with Friends to one not a member and was dealt with by Buckingham Meeting August, 1765, when it is tested that he was precautioned by a friend to the contrary and that he married against his parents consent, he was finally disowned by meeting January 6, 1766.

commented Aug 13, 2017 by Billie Keaffaber G2G6 Mach 4 (41.3k points)

Here another Blacksheep Canadate in my family. William H Potts. This already on his profile. Now he was Either in love bad or crazier then loon here. The Basic story goes Solomon P McCauly Shot at him 6 times gun missed fired all 6 times. He wasn't married at time and went married Solomans niece. He was also captured as well. Thanksgiving and Christmas must have been fun in this family lol. There another court case I recently found where he was in with his father in law John Samuel Mcauley so this guy earned his Blacksheep status.

I found this story on ancestry but the paper copy found before at Hackercreek pioneer descendants at lewis county WV

William H. Potts 10th Virginia Cavalry Regiment Company G (Confederate). The 10th Virginia Cavalry included the Jackson Rangers (G) from Jackson County. Soldier's Rank in: Private. Soldier's Rank out: Private, Film Number M382 roll 44.

I have his muster roll records. He was captured by his future wife's uncle Solomon P. McCalley (Could he had been found dating Lucinda McCauley?) He must have been exchanged (released) since service records show he served in many of the major battles in the East. He was one of the two soldiers that survived/stayed for surrender at the end of the war at Appomattox, VA (Lynchburg, VA).

Could there have been a tension caused by the Civil War between his father Nixon Potts, who joined the Union Army about the time West Virginia became a new state and William, who joined the Confederate Army near the beginning of the war, when the state was Virginia?

The 10th Virginia Cavalry was organized in 1861 as part of the Wise Legion. The regiment served in western Virginia during its first year of service. Colonel James Lucius Davis led his unit into North Carolina in 1862. Reorganized for the war, the regiment served at Yorktown, Williamsburg and in the Seven Days Campaign around Richmond. Assigned to General J.E.B. Stuart's command, the 10th helped to defend Richmond during General Robert E. Lee's first invasion of the North. Davis' troopers guarded the crossings along the Rappahannock River during the winter of 1862 - 1863. The 10th saw hard service in the Chancellorsville Campaign, at Brandy Station, Aldie, Hanover, Gettysburg, Hagerstown, Williamsport, Leetown, Martinsburg, Raccoon Ford, the Buckland "Races", and Mine Run in 1863. Following the pursuit of General William W. Averell into western Virginia, the regiment participated in General Fitzhugh Lee's raid to Moorefield, and in the bloody fighting at Spotsylvania Court House, Haw's Shop, Nance's Shop, Sapora Church, Sapony Church, Charles City Road, Reams' Station, the Cattle Raid, Stony Creek and Belfield in 1864. The 10th picketed Robert E. Lee's extended lines south of Petersburg during the winter of 1864 - 1865. The regiment fought gallantly in the final battles at Dinwiddie Court House, Five Forks, Amelia Court House, Farmville, and Appomattox Court House. The survivors escaped to Lynchburg where they were disbanded on April 11, 1865. List of Companies that composed the 10th Va. Cavalry:· A - Caskie's Mounted Rangers/formerly Fry's [Caskie's/Fulcher's Co.] · B - Carolina Rangers [Clement's/Grimes' Co.] (North Carolina)· C - Capt. William W. Flood's Co. [Flood's/Richerson's/Wingfield's Co.]· D - Wise Mounted Guard [Hawley's Co.] · E (1st) - Jennings Wise Hussars [Tucker's/Tichenor's/Wise's Co.] · E (2nd) - Capt. William E. Hinton's Co. · F - Albemarle Rangers [Timberlake's Co.] (Albemarle Co.)· G - Jackson's Rangers [Kirtley's/Phelphs' Co.] (Roane Co.)· H - Valley Rangers/Rockingham Cavalry [Brock's/Poage's/Dovel's Co.] (Rockingham Co.)· I - Henrico Light Dragoons [McGruder's Co.] (Henrico Co.) · K - Texas Rangers or Rosser's Mounted Rangers (Rosser/Dickson/Graham] (Franklin Co. and men from Texas & California) From Roane County, WV Genweb site:

Company G, 10th VA Confederate Calvary CAPTAIN: PHELPS, Edward 1st Lt.: ARMSTRONG, Virgil S. ROACH, Jesse HARTLEY, Strawder-killed at Petersburg VA CAIN, Thomas POTTS, William RUNNER, Solomon D. GOFF, Hezekiah STALEY, A.B. FLESHER, Kelley HALL, John HALL, Perry PARSONS, Henry PARSONS, Ballard BAILEY, Arthur G.-surgeon-a Phycs. & druggist in Spencer after the war.

More info in Driver, Robert J. 10th Virginia Cavalry. Virginia Regimental History Series. 1992. 10th Virginia Cavalry, by Robert J. Driver, Jr., 1992. 973.7454 C582 no. 10.

commented Aug 14, 2017 by Billie Keaffaber G2G6 Mach 4 (41.3k points)

8 Answers

Answer 1 · 2015-01-13T21:04:32+0000

That is great news! It is my understanding that participants will need to be actual members of IBSSG. Membership there is free, but you need to be a direct descendant of an ancestor who is known to have committed any one or more of the following:

Murder
Kidnapping
Armed Robbery
Treason
Theft of any item of fame
Membership in a famous gang, well documented
Political Assassin
Member of the FBI's Most Wanted List
Political Expatriate
Extreme Public Embarrassment
Involvement in Witchcraft Trials
Bigamy (outside the Mormon faith, which condoned it at one time)
Persons expelled from normal society
Convicted felons (documented)

Sincerely, Peter

P.S. There is also a One Degree Rule: If a person lived in the family domicile of an ancestor, and the actions of that individual affected the family, as if they were a ancestor, or member of the immediate family, then that individuals acts can be used for membership qualification under this rule.

answered Jan 13, 2015 by Peter Roberts G2G6 Pilot (705k points)

Answer 2 · 2015-01-30T15:24:00+0000

I sincerely hope the Black Sheep project moves forward. I continue to believe that Sons of the American Revolution is a good model for WikiTree's relationship with IBSSG. That is to say, members of SAR use the SAR logo on their WikiTree profiles. Members of IBSSG have permisson to use the IBSSG logo. I suggest that anyone who is a descendant of a black sheep can be a member of the WikiTree's Black Sheep project, but to use the IBSSG logo in WikiTree requires you to be an official IBSSG member.

I also believe IBSSG's guidelines for what constitutes a black sheep ancestor are good ones for the WikiTree's Black Sheep project to follow.

Answer 3 · 2015-01-30T15:33:59+0000

How about the perpetrators of the Holocaust? The Holocaust project has been considering whether a category for these folks should be added to the project. Although, on one hand, it seems appropriate to have a category for the evil mongers, on the other hand, the purpose of the Holocaust project is to honor the victims and survivors, which makes it questionable to include those who inflicted all the atrocities on them.

Answer 4 · 2015-02-12T04:07:38+0000

I hope someone can use West-246 as an ancestor for this project. I just updated his profile for the Magna Carta project. First tried to poison his uncle to speed up his inheritance. Then found guilty of treason for participating in a conspiracy against the Queen. Interesting fellow!

Answer 5 · 2016-02-25T02:36:30+0000

Hi,

I have a convicted murderer (executed) in my ancestry, one bigamist, a woman murderer who is 1st cousin 8 times removed, (very famous case hers, still spoken of 250 years later) and another bigamist who was not my ancestor but ''married'' with an ancestress. I've tagged them with the Black Sheep category and appropriate sub-categories also. I had done this previously, and was just checking the various sub-categories out when I discovered the actual Black Sheep category had been removed from the profiles.

I've put them back, with the following reasoning: The various sub-categories are just that, but if a person doesn't know what the person did, is just searching for bad boys and girls with the name x, the Black Sheep listing would be self-evident to look at first. I worked on another project where there was a main category like it, (passengers etc of Empress of Ireland, which sank in 1914), then sub-categories are added to the relevant profiles, ie First class passengers, crew etc etc.

Thoughts?

By the way, I omitted the Black Sheep project logo on these, when I tried it I found it way too large. Has this been changed?

Answer 6 · 2016-02-25T11:28:13+0000

After my comment here I started thinking on the whole ethical side of having a black sheep category. Here are some thoughts that crossed my mind:

Half if not all of mankind would in some or other fashion fall under this category
Because we with the luxury of hindsight appropriate the right to judge according to our current values the lives of [some if not all] of our ancestors
Which implies pre- and post-[re][sub]classification of all those lives according to our current classification of what constitutes deviant behaviour
Which to me seems a bit unfair (proportionate fair humor aside [as the German saying goes: "Humor ist wenn man trotzdem lacht" - in English: Having a sense of humor means looking on the bright side.despite and through the worst of circumstances] - bordering on cheap entertainment?) and perhaps even sacriledge [Honor thy Mother and thy Father ...]
Making me feel uncomfortable ...
Bringing me to the question of What does it really add to this platform ...?
Do we really have the luxury of time and resources for this category - do we really need and want it?

answered Feb 25, 2016 by Cape of Good Hope Project WikiTree G2G1 (1.1k points)

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Olof Bergh (Bergh-143): armed robbery of a sovereign nation's ambassadorial ship, theft of the jewels & gold (gifts from the King of Siam to European nobility), tried for treason, expelled from society & imprisoned on Robben Island, slave owner, kidnapping the king of Siam's ambassadors. You name it, he did it!. It's all on his profile on WikiTree. He's famous, or actually, infamous for this. However as no-one appears to be embarrassed by it & no-one is hiding this information; he doesn't seem to fit your profile for black sheep status. Read the books: "Rogues to Riches", "Kites of Good Fortune". The rogue appears to be a much beloved figure of South Africa's rich tapestry i.e. we appear to forgive & accept him. I am struggling with the concept of applying a different era's morality to judge people and am struggling with primarily identifying people in death by their worst traits, however I do accept your argument that if peoples' profiles are not going to be created because of ongoing shame, then I can see a role for your project..

commented Feb 26, 2016 by Anton Eugene Bergh G2G6 (7.5k points)

Steven, I think what Anton is saying (and Ronel to the bottom) is that coming from a society that was treated as the black sheep by the whole world from the late 50's / early 60's until 1994 (only 2 other countries were also banned from the United Nations, while racism and discrimination, authoratism was still rampant in many parts of the world), we have learned the deep wounds that labeling causes - it is a double edged sword. We are still raw and very much conscious that this process of healing is far from over (we are aware of the history and the daily politics that still stems from the first settlement in 1652). Of course Olof would fit that category, but then so would every other official of the VOC and many a God-fearing settler who had slaves to till the land and heed the cattle. And that would also imply every buccanneer and pirate and slavetrader and Dickensian character who ever walked this planet and so many others - going back to the 17th century - it was a different era - an age where (the last vestige of) serfdom was not necessarily a coloured matter (it soon became that) but a question of being at the wrong place at the wrong time, and by standing. It was the beginning of what we know today as capitalism, Stocks [ed. correction: shares] in this brand new global company called the Dutch East India company could be bought by the barmaid in Holland, the local prostitute, men of standing, labourers (the evidence is still there) - it was a booming free for all and it brought immense wealth to the Netherlands over the backs of so many people, not even necessarily slaves. It is specific for that time, but the cruelty and suffering is of all times. So yes and no. It all depends on one's point of view and how one defines a "black sheep". What we are all doing in this project is to find closure in giving our ancestors a decent narrative, and we do not need a Black Sheep project to do that - it is already in the bio's. Being collated, documented, slowly narrated and of course sourced. In a fashion that respects the narrative as well. Even if they (our "naughty" ancestors) weren't as innocent as we would like to see them. I know this sounds like moralising drivel, but as Ronel says - we shouldn't label shame, and - regarding those who are ashamed of their forebears and really can't face or want to face their own demons in the light of all - all of us - that went before us, if this Black Sheep project is meant to write the narratives of those profiles that nobody want to touch, then it has a (temporary) purpose.

commented Feb 26, 2016 by Philip van der Walt G2G6 Pilot (171k points)
edited Feb 26, 2016 by Philip van der Walt

I suspect there are several different reasons for the Black Sheep Project. Here is why I took interest in the Project early on.... Some family historians are proud to note they are a "Plantagenet" or "Mayflower" or "Revolutionary War" etc. descendant. However one of my personal goals has been to find evidence supporting my family's legend that we have pirate ancestry from the Bahama Islands. I'm still searching.

I'm not alone: "People are very excited by criminal ancestors...When we did a survey asking what sort of relatives they hoped a search would throw up, black sheep came out No 1, way ahead of royalty or aristocracy." http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2013/feb/20/have-you-got-criminal-ancestor

Here is another resource:

http://familyhistorydirectory.com/criminal-ancestors-records/

commented Feb 26, 2016 by Peter Roberts G2G6 Pilot (705k points)

!!??!! WHERE did the idea that the Blacksheep project is hunting for naughty ancestors come from??? I know no one on the project who is actively looking for dirt. Although, there are a few of us who are fascinated by "true crime" stories who profile the perps.

The IBSSG, after whom the project is patterned is aware of the emotions that get churned up when a genealogist discovers a Blacksheep. The state on their site:

"So you'd like to join IBSSG, but you still burst into tears when you think about traumatic events in your immediate family....you still can't accept that someone you should have been able to trust, could hurt you so bad....or, how could Great-Grandpa have DONE such awful things? And you're not sure you can bring them out, into the light of day?

IBSSG, recognizing that not everyone is ready to revel in Great-Uncle Fred's "dirty deeds," announces a corner of the pen, just for Tender Lambs, who need the safety of anonymity, or are grieving..." http://ibssg.org/blacksheep/ Tender Lambs Corner

On this site, the blacksheep has to be publicly tried and convicted of his or her crime and dead 100 years or notorious. Let's face it, once you've been convicted, wrote a book about your crimes and sold the movie rights to Hollywood, the cat's out of the bag.

commented Feb 27, 2016 by Michele Britton G2G6 Mach 2 (20.7k points)

Philip, thank you for writing this and sharing a perspective that I, on this side of the pond, didn't know existed. I am truly sorry that you have experienced these feelings and pray that you soon are able to move past them.

I can only speak for myself, but I never looked at your country as anything other than a sovereign nation that made different choices than that of my own. And certainly never looked down on it or its people even during the rabid news coverage in the 90s.

But getting back to the project. I don't think I would put Olof's profile in the project because it states that he was pardoned of the crimes he confessed. If he was pardoned in his time by his contemporaries, who are we to say he was a bad guy? I wouldn't be working on his profile anyway because I have no context for the culture in which he lived.

Rather, the blacksheep are the bad guys who were known to be bad guys by the measure of their own time, society and natural law. In some cases, they know it themselves. I finished a profile of a blacksheep executed for murder in 1929. Two books, a movie and countless articles in periodicals chronicled his crimes. He himself, before his execution wrote an autobiography that included this:

"In my lifetime I have murdered 21 human beings. I have committed thousands of burglaries, robberies, larcenies, arsons and last but not least I have committed sodomy on more than 1,000 male human beings. For all of these things I am not the least bit sorry. I have no conscience so that does not worry me. I don't believe in man, God nor Devil. I hate the whole damn human race including myself."

That is a pretty far cry from a capitalist or industrialist tempted into doing wrong. And yet, during my research, I ended up feeling sympathy for this vile man. Reading about his early life and conditions from a 21st century vantage point, I couldn't help but have wondered how differently his life and those of his victims might have been had anyone at all had extended love to him.

commented Feb 27, 2016 by Michele Britton G2G6 Mach 2 (20.7k points)
edited Feb 27, 2016 by Michele Britton

Answer 7 · 2016-02-26T17:06:27+0000

Black Sheep of the family

My personal view:

I know this will not change anything and that you will go forward with your project, but I feel as member of WikiTree I should speak my mind.

I don’t believe in labelling people nor do I stand in judgement of them.

The death penalty was abandoned and one of the reasons was: Proof of innocence years after the crime was committed. ie: The system are not full proof, witness lie, corruption and bribery play a roll ect. We are dealing with imperfect humans, bringing about imperfect results.

Labelling: Why? The crime was noted in the bios and all the detail and evidence was provided with sources: Is that not enough? Must attention been drawn? And why?

Tread lightly: Do not hurt others, don’t label shame. There is no need for it.

answered Feb 26, 2016 by Ronel Olivier G2G6 Pilot (123k points)

Ronel, your philosophy brings you to the conclusion that there is no need for calling attention to the purported misdeeds of black sheep, and who those people were.

I grant you that there is some case for some people to sometimes be unfairly called out. That happens, but so do many unfortunate things in life, some of which are much worse, and much more prevalent when innocents become victims.

My own philosophy puts me firmly on the side of the overwhelming vast majority of innocents, and against the perpetrators, or black sheep.

So my philosophy is to particularly call out and shine a very bright light on perpetrators of darkness and evil. Therefore, we are at polar opposites in our opinion of whether there is a need. I say that not only is there a need, but it is an imperative that this be done.

commented Feb 26, 2016 by Steven Mix G2G6 Mach 4 (48.1k points)

Steve, I agree with the need to shine a light on evil for a slightly different reason. If the profile is well written, it will give the reader a window into the mind of its subject. In this way perhaps we are helping to explain how individuals who commit hienous crimes are created. Hopefully, that will spark a desire to eliminate the most common contributing causes and mitigating circumstances. The tree is an illustrator that these crimes don't happen in a vacuum and the perps don't appear full-grown from the head of Zeus. I think it's possible that we could learn a bit about the dynamics that create crime in order to create better plans to avoid doing so in the future....at least in cases where that is possible.

commented Apr 20, 2016 by Michele Britton G2G6 Mach 2 (20.7k points)
edited Apr 20, 2016 by Michele Britton

Answer 8 · 2016-04-20T19:42:07+0000

I have a black sheep, but I have not documented his line. It's beyond embarrassing; people tried to arrest him on numerous occasions and he hired Pinkerton men to protect him when he visited his family.

He was a farmer. When he died his estate was worth $30 million.

Sigh. I understand he did build a church.

PS, my two emails to the IBSSG were not answered either.

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