Appears to conflate two people named William Saunders

Question

This profile appears to conflate two people named William Saunders. This one is the father of William Saunders of Banbury. He is supposed to have been born in Hodnell, Warks, and died in 1481 in Charlwood, Surrey. The Visitation of Essex provided for his son says he was of Surrey. But this William Saunders lived in Banbury, Oxon, at least back to the 1450s and died there in 1478.

In a Chancery case dated by TNA to 1452-54 he was William Saunders, of Banbury.
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7440656
Original:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no19/C1no19%20nos%201-250/IMG_0237.htm

In a Common Pleas case of 1460, he was William Saundres, of Bannebury, Oxon, woolman.
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no796/bCP40no796dorses/IMG_1609.htm

His will, details of which are provided by Anonymous Baker in a question linked to this William's son, is from 1478 and describes property in Banbury. 

His sons William and Richard were the executors of his will, as shown in a Common Pleas case from 1484. The plaintiffs are William Saunders, of Banbury, and Richard Saunders, of Banbury, sons and executors of William Saunders, of Banbury, merchant.
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT3/R3/CP40no890/bCP40no890dorses/IMG_1462.htm

There was a William Saunder/Saunders in Charlwood in the 1450s, but he can't be the same person as in Banbury.
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/69cd7820-f385-4eb8-be0e-2471d27688d8

So, William Saunders should be detached from Thomas Alexander Saunders of Charlwood, Surrey. There are no sources given for this connection. (Also, in Charlwood, William's father was Thomas, not Thomas Alexander. See TNA record above)

Comments

I think the issue is that there is a missing generation between

 William Saunders-282 (who is not of Hodnell Warwickshire but of Charlwood Surrey and is the son of Thomas Saundre and Joan Odworth) and his wife Joan Carew-41 and

William Saunders-92 (of Banbury) and his wife Jane Spencer-204.

The missing generation is (yet another) William Saunders, who is the son of William and Joan, he marries an Alice possibly Olney and dies at Banbury "William Saunders sen. of Banbury Oxon, merchant" in 1478.

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I can see how that might work:

William Saunders of Charlwood, gent, born there about 1405, son of Thomas, recorded in Charlwood 1442 to 1470 (TNA). Presumably died in Charlwood. Richard Saunders of Charlwood, son of Thomas, born about 1410, recorded in Charlwood 1446 to 1478 (TNA). There's a Richard Saundyr of Charlwood, gent, in Common Pleas, 1495, but this must be the next generation.

William Saunders of Banbury, born 1430 in Charlwood, died 1478 in Banbury. Recorded in Banbury 1452 to 1478. Sons William and Richard, his executors, born about 1455 in Banbury.

Some questions: Are there any records of William Saunders in Charlwood after 1470? Did he leave a will? Is there any direct evidence that he is the father of William Saunders of Banbury?

On edit, from BHO for Charlwood Church: A MS. in private hands contains a list of inscriptions taken down 15 December 1622: Thomas Sander and his wife Johanna (in the church porch, no date); Johanna Sander, 1470; Margaret wife of John Sander, d. 1477; Richard Sander, d. 1480; William Sander, d. 1481 (husband of Johanna above); Agnes (wife of Richard above), d. 1485; James Sander, third son of Richard Sander, d. 1510; Nicholas Saunder (d. 1553) and Alice his wife, father and mother of Sir Thomas Saunders, King's Remembrancer of the Exchequer.
 

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According to this book by The Charlwood Society, page 46, Stephen was the father of Thomas, the father of William.

On the next page, "William's eldest son had migrated to Banbury, but Richard, his second son, remained in Charlwood."

http://www.charlwoodsociety.co.uk/resources/The%20Free%20Men%20of%20Charlwood.pdf

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The Charlwood Surrey descent is:

* Stephen Sanders

* Thomas Sanders and his wife Joan Odworth who married before 7 December 1406.  Thomas made his Will in 1442 leaving property in Charlwood, Horley, Nuthurst and Horsham to his four named sons: (1) William, (2) Richard, (3) John and (4) Thomas.

* (2) Richard received tenement called Oddeworth + other lands, he married Johan at Porte; (3) John received tenement called Pages + other lands, had a son called Thomas who died before 1474, this Thomas had a daughter Joane who was born before 1472; (4) Thomas received tenement called Saundreplace + other lands.

* (1) William (died 1481) received the "capital messuage with garden and appurtenances which the testator was inhabiting in Cherlwode, which sometime was Stephen Saundre's + another tenement and lands in Charlwood, Horley, Nuthurst and Horsham.  He married Joan Carew (born before 1431-d 1470).  Known children (i) William (died Banbury 1478); (ii) Richard (died Charlwood 1480); (iii) Henry (died c 1518 Ewell); (iv) Joan (died after 1513).

* (ii) Richard married Agnes Courtenay; (iii) Henry, youngest son, inherited his mother's share of Batailles in Ewell, married Joan Lepton, made his Will September 1518; (iv) Joan married Richard Hunsterton

* (i) William, eldest son, married Alice (possibly Olney), made his Will 1478 and died in Banbury Oxfordshire; their sons - Richard (https://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/berks/vol4/pp319-332) and William who married Joan Spencer, was "of Banbury" when he made his Will in October 1492 and requested burial within the parish church of Our Lady in Banbury "near unto the burying place thereof of William Saunders, my father", four daughters at the time he made his Will, memorandum 1493 to include the child his wife is now pregnant with.

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I noticed you have been trying to get some movement on this case since January. You have compiled a complete family history, miles better than what is there now. I can add a few details from Common Pleas and Chancery cases. All that's needed is for a pre-1500 to fix the genealogy as it now stands.

Answer 1

One day, I am sure, the genealogy will be corrected - as and of themselves this part of the family are not 'notables' but they are the ancestors of 'notable' and 'project protected' profiles.

Comments

Michael Cayley has been working on these profiles and has made some improvements.

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Saunders-279