Is there some way to honor those who were not buried?

Question

I find someone, every once in a while, a person who was cremated or not buried in an actual cemetery. In the interest of honoring these souls also, is there some place to list them like the others?

Comments

Thats a very good idea, as more and more people are being cremated or headstones age and are gone with no records.

---

Thank you. I was thinking maybe by county or something. I am not sure on logistics or things like that, I just want to be able to include all.

---

I notice there is a Buried at Sea category, but no Lost at Sea one, i.e. no body was found, so no body was put into the sea as part of a service. Though I imagine some kind of service was held, so is this more of a philosopical difference?

Tim

Answer 1

I have seen several memorials on Find-A-Grave for people who have not been buried in a cemetery.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/190434455/lucy-bailey-crouch

Comments

Right, Kevin.  They can still have a FindAGrave memorial.

---

I have created several memorials on Find-A-Grave for people who were cremated. I really enjoy reconnecting families that have passed on, and when the disposition of their remains is not known, you can still create a memorial and reconnect them with their parents, spouses, and children.

Answer 2

We can honor them with obituaries.  We can honor them with nice profiles.  We can put them in other categories.

But I would never put my mother, for example, into a category "Cremated in Sacramento, California" (even if there was one).

Edited to clarify.

Comments

Nobody said you had to do such a thing. It's a personal decision.

Answer 3

Cremation has 3 subcategories:

Cremated, Ashes Scattered 

Cremated, Ashes With Loved Ones 

Cremated, Disposition Unknown

Comments

I have added the ashes scattered category to a number of my family's profiles, because it is what was done.  

To Julie -- if cremains are en-niched, or buried after cremation, is that the same as being buried for the non-cremated?  If we add a category for the memorial gardens/cemetery where the ashes were en-niched/buried, why is that different from noting "ashes scattered"?  

I scattered most of my late husband's ashes in a place he loved in his country, because the family decided that would be what he would have chosen.  I retained some of the cremains in a small urn (and a memorial container that is not an urn) for future disposal in my country, because of his often expressed love for my land, and the desire that we would one day live there.  That latter was not to be, but to honour the wish to live there, we thought scattering a portion of his ashes there would honour his desire.

Is it somehow distasteful to note by way of a category on his profile that his ashes were scattered, and also retained by loved ones?  How is it distasteful?  Why is it?

edited to correct keyboard errors

---

Melanie, after this discussion began, I went back to my mother's, father's, and sister's profiles and added statements that they were cremated.  I don't mind talking about cremation.  Had any of them committed suicide, I might even have said that.

If someone is cremated, and their remains are placed in a cemetery, especially with other family members, then it seems useful to include that information on their profile, and I see the usefulness of cemetery categories (and geographic categories in general).  Likewise, I see the usefulness of FindAGrave memorials, even for cremated people.

The only thing I object to is the category.  It just seems pointless.  Why stick my mother in a category with people who were cremated in Idaho, or Japan, or anywhere? 

---

Julie - I add those categories for the benefit of those who do see some use in them.  Where possible, I like to know where my family lie buried, if they were buried, or what was the disposition of their cremains if cremated -- especially after learning that some cremains were never given to the families and to this day reside in some funeral parlour, or were mass interred in a common hole in the ground, or simply dumped in a garbage skip; or the family was only given part of the cremains (the small urns usually seen in movies and tv shows would barely hold a small animal, let alone the 6ft, 180-200lb adult male of the story); or the supposed cremains included handles and other objects not of their loved one.

Admittedly, it would make more sense to my mind to at least use a country, but I'm not a Cemeterist and have no idea why the Project has chosen to categorise as they do.

I have noted more than one suicide in a biography, but draw the line at adding such a category, because I see no benefit in it.

I also understand this can be a sensitive subject for many, and so apologise if my blunt words above cause distress, or offense.  I do not mean them to.

---

Why not categorise by  location of  crematoria? The vast majority of people in the UK (77% in 2017) and several other countries are cremated not buried. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_cremation_rate. Crematoria retain records and like burial places are  a location most likely related to the person's last residence. Sometimes this can be the only record. (whilst in France, I went to the  cremations of several  British people who spent their last years there.)  

The  two categories 'cremated disposal of ashes unknown'  and Cremated ashes scattered'  are potentially vast. The location that families scatter ashes is often very personal. Writing about it in a biography seems more appropriate than an amorphous category  . (caveat: In at least one faith, Hinduism, the place of dispersal is important.  In recent years some sites  on the River Thames seem to have become recognised sites for scattering ashes)

---

Hey, Melanie, I imagine if anyone is causing distress it is more likely to be me...and I imagine also that there's not much more to be said.  I had not intended to stray into questions of religious or spiritual beliefs.  I'm probably repeating myself, but I'll say one more time and then shut up:  I don't object to providing any of the information you mention.  I just think it belongs on the profile, where people will see it, and that the categories are not adding any useful information.

---

It can tell us that we can stop looking for a burial. And as several others have noted, cremation is much more common than not in many countries.

---

Well, sorry, I guess I'll comment again after all.

The profile biography itself can tell us if we need to look for burials.  I suppose every person's habits are different, but when I am interested in a profile, I read the biography.  I may not even look at the categories.

---

I’ve got ‘Cremated, disposition known’: one part in Illinois, one part in Iowa, one part in North Carolina, and 14 small parts fused into glass beads made into earrings for friends and descendants. I don’t need a category.

---

The glass beads--what a cool idea!  I'll have to look into it and hope it's not too late to order Christmas gifts.  (And hope it doesn't creep out any of my relatives!)

---

My son, who doesn’t wear earrings, was a bit creeped out at the idea, but everyone else was thrilled. I think there’s also beads, etc., for pet ashes.

Answer 4

There are records for cremations in the UK, on Ancestry, or more accurately a link to Web: UK, Burial and Cremation Index, 1576-2014, data from Deceased Online.

I have used it successfully when I have been unable to find a burial for a more recently deceased relative.

In Canada where I am, obituaries will sometimes provide information about older burials on private land, or ashes scattered on private land.

Generally when I cannot find a source , I add that information to the biography.

Comments

For the record, I'm not saying that we shouldn't note that someone was cremated, or link them to an index of whatever source exists that, we hope, will give us some clues about their lives and relationships.

But what I am saying is that a WT category adds no useful information.

Answer 5

There is nothing to prevent someone who is cremated from being buried in a proper grave.  My father's family bought 6 plots side by side, two for my grandparents, two for an aunt and uncle, and two for my parents.  My father was the last to die, and by that time a tree had taken root and grown in the plot reserved for him.  We were instructed that we were not to displace the tree;  he would be cremated instead, and his ashes buried beside it.  My father's body is now where it was intended all along, acknowledged on the tombstone prepared in advance, and there is also a very special tree.

Comments

Quite right, Jack, and in those cases a cemetery category seems appropriate.

---

Jack you are correct, my FIL died in 2016, he was cremated and his ashes have been on his widow's mantel since then.

His ashes will be buried in the same grave as his parents, with his death added to the headstone. There were delays because unfortunately several other family members died in 2016, and then 4 years later when we finally were making arrangements, Covid happened, we hope to have his ashes buried in what remains of this fall, or perhaps in the spring after the ground has thawed.

---

Hi hun,

Yes and when that is the case we put them in a category for the cemetery they were buried in. With the ones who are not buried however that is harder to do. I am thankful that Natalie posted those for me. That was what I was looking for.

---

I agree, my father and brother were both cremated and their ashes buried in a plot my other brothers bought for the family.  My mother was also cremated and her ashes buried next to her last husband's.

Answer 6

I've wondered about this also. I've seen a Find-a-Grave memorial that was someone who was cremated. However, I  did not save the link, and I have no idea how to find these in Find-a-Grave or create them.

It would seem to me that here at WikiTree the location would either be the death location or the last residence location as someone could die far from where they live.

These should probably correlate to Find-a-Grave similar memorials if anyone knows how that works.

Comments

My father has 2 memorials at FindAGrave. One was created by someone unrelated, for the cemetery where he was cremated. The other was created by me, for the location of his ashes 230km away. What would be the purpose of making a WT profile correlate with the former memorial?

---

Well, the location to which the memorial is associated is up to you.

In genealogy, we want to find memorials for people to learn more about them. To search we put a name and the most probable location. If we search for John Zachary Smith in the state or county where records indicate he may have lived near the end of his life, we may find the memorial if the memorial location is in the state or county. If someone takes his ashes to the Grand Canyon and puts the memorial there, we probably won't find him.

I guess it all depends on the objectives.

---

Why do you assume that
a) I have control over other people? I don't.

b) I haven't already tried to have the wrong memorial deleted? I've recently requested it for the 2nd time.

c) I don't know why people would want to look up accurate records? I'm not that clueless, thank you.

---

Sorry if I offended. None was intended.

I thought this was just a discussion looking at ideas for memorials without burials.

I was just trying to look at all the angles.