Revisting Jacob Barentszen Cool/Kool/Van de Cuyl

+9 votes
425 views

There was previous discussion about this Jacob and what his LNAB should be and the decision was that he should be van de Cuyl because he would have adopted "van de" when he left the Netherlands. http://www.wikitree.com/g2g/68470/ok-to-make-van-de-cuyl-the-final-wikitree-id-for-jacob-b-1580

There are a couple of issues though:

  • It does not appear that Jacob ever left the Netherlands.
  • His patronymic is actually Arentsen as explained on the profile: http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Kool-248
  • The van de Kuyl seems to have been applied to him at because there was some assumption somewhere that he shared relations with Cornelis Barentszen VanDerCuyl-2
  • Nowhere that I could find is his son Barent referred to as anything but Cool or Kool, Cool appearing only once in his baptism records, Holland Dames having him as Kool and NYGBR listing and indexing him as Kool in the list of Small Burghers in v. 141.1.
  • Duplicates are being created because people are not making the connection to van de Cuyl. These are not junkie, spammy dupes.

The reson why I'm posting this is that there are a couple of duplicate profiles with the Kool as LNAB and didn't want to just match them and leave it.

I'm not a descendant. smiley

The PPP profile is Van_de_Cuyl-4

WikiTree profile: Jacob Arentsz Cool
in Genealogy Help by Carrie Quackenbush G2G6 Mach 7 (73.5k points)
edited by Carrie Quackenbush

The way to go when researching pre-1811 baptisms, marriages, and deaths in Amsterdam:

 Search the Amsterdam archive.

 Note the church (if any) AND the source reference of a relevant hit

Go to www.zoekakten.nl, and there

  1. choose province NH (Noord-Holland)
  2. choose Amsterdam
  3. choose record type in the left column
  4. search for the source reference in the resulting page (in the leftmost column)
  5. Found? Skip to #11 below
  6. Search for the name of the church in the resulting page (in the leftmost column)
  7. Found? Skip to #11 below
  8. Scan the resulting page visually looking for relevant entries
  9. Found? Skip to #11 below
  10. Bad luck, maybe the source was not filmed...
  11. Clicking the lefmost column takes you to the Familysearch microfilm
  12. Search the microfilm for the right image, with a strategy of educated guesses or some kind of binary search

Note

Sometimes the rightmost column in the resulting page contains a link to an index of the film, allowing you to get a better starting point for searching

   

 

Here is the image of the marriage of Jacob & Aeltje:

"Netherlands, Noord-Holland Province, Church Records, 1523-1948," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1971-31161-9403-36?cc=2037985&wc=SM93-HZS:382016701,382015502,382164801 : accessed 19 June 2015), Alle Gezindten > Amsterdam > Huwelijksaangiften 1581-1606 > image 282 of 539; Nederlands Rijksarchiefdienst, Den Haag (Netherlands National Archives, The Hague).

The Amsterdam archive says:

inschrijvingsdatum: 27-01-1596

naam bruidegom: Arentsz, Jacob

naam bruid: Dierics, Aaltje

bronverwijzing: DTB 664, p.184

opmerkingen: Huwelijksintekeningen van de PUI.

It looks like the image says Jacob was 27 years of age then: on second line it says something like 'xxbij jaren', and in the page header it says  'xxbij January 1596' being the date of the following marriage banns. Note this is the Roman type of numbering (x = 10, etc.).

No KOOL in baptism images of Jacob's children: what is said after his name is his occupation, which in all cases I looked at is something with ships (barges):

Aeltjen - Varensman = Someoone who works on a ship/barge

Pieter -  Veerman op Rotterdam = Sailor going with his barge to Rotterdam and back

Lievijn - Veerman op Rotterdam

Dierikien - Schuitenvoerder = Someone who steers a barge, viz who makes it his profession to carry loads, formerly in Amsterdam decidedly someone who with his barge transported loads within the city or to ships.

Fantastic stuff! The cheat-sheet should help save some people from having to scroll though old microfilm for hours.
Carrie,

after Jaco'bs name I think it's  says vaarman op  R = sailor on Rotterdam
Indeed! Jan also determined that it said "veerman op Rotterdam". Sure makes a whole lot more sense than 'cole slaw man of Rotterdamn'...
Oops! Didnt see Jan's response.
Knowing what the members of this family did to earn an living is more interesting than figuring out their LNAB. Thanks, Jan!
Jacob was a Captain of the Yatch New Ampsterdam for the Dutch West Indies 1920 till his Death he still owned several yatches
while at the Ulster County Court House Historican Office these are some of the ways I have found the Cole name spelled one of them is as the speeling you are talking about except the Van De on it.

Coole, Koley, Kool, Kohl, Kuhl, Cuyl, Coel,Cooil, Kole, Coley, Colet, Koel, Cole

3 Answers

+4 votes
 
Best answer

This was an interesting discussion, but it failed to reach a conclusion. The various profiles for Jacob still need to be merged. I think Carrie's initial question pretty well summarized much the consensus that came out in subsequent comments.

I perceived consensus for the following conclusions.

  1. He was not a "van de Cuyl." That [[Van_de_Cuyl-4]] profile should be merged to the selected LNAB. Before that can happen, its project protection will need to be removed.
  2. He used the patronymic Arentsz (or a variant spelling such as Arentsen). His patronymic was not Barentszen or a variant thereof.
  3. His children, including Barent, the immigrant to New Netherland, were not baptized with the last name of Kool or Cool (and most definitely not van de Cuyl). Barent's [[Van_de_Cuyl-3]] profile is another one that should be merged away once its PPP protection is removed.

None of the duplicate profiles I have seen for either man has the patronymic for its last name, so the only choice we have for LNAB is between Kool and Cool. I'd give the edge to Kool because (1) that's the only LNAB spelling available for Barent Jacobsen and (2) there's reason to think that the name would have been spelled with a K in Holland, if it came from Holland.

Any objections?

by Ellen Smith G2G Astronaut (1.2m points)
selected by Philip van der Walt
I'd say you are right. Choose one, merge the duplicates. One can always revisit at a later date.
Hi, I just returned from a 13 week trip to the New York Start Historical Society, New Jersey State Historical Society, Ulster County Historian at the County Court House, and the Walpack NJ Historical Society.

What I have found in researching the Kool/Cool/Cole/Coley and many more different spellings what that.

1) the Oldest know record of Jacobus Bartsezen Kool that has his knew signature with his spelling on it is at the New York Historical Society and it is spelled K_O_O_L in that way in his own hand wrighting in 1630.

2) Jacobus Bartsezen Kool name was strating to be used as Cool when his youngest Son Jacobus Bartsezen Kool was born in Kingston and when both Father and son were on the Ulster County Tax records together one as Kool and one as Cool.

3) The Cool name was used more with Corneulis, Leendart,  the other Stuck with Kool till the switched over to Cole as they all did in the early 1700's

I have hundreds of New Amsterdam records written in Old Dutch dating back to 1610. these are some of my most prized papers.
+4 votes

According to the Holland Society Yearbook, ''the Cole family claimed to be the oldest family of Holland descent in New York. The first ancestor in this country was Barent Jacobsen Kool, who was born in Holland before 1610 and came out with Minuit in 1625 as an officer in the West India Company. From that time to the present his family always had a representative in New York. His name appeared in a 'Condition and Agreement' between Jacob Van Curler and the Indians on 8 June 1633, and he retained his connection with the government until 1664, when he settled in Kingston.'' According to the author of The Barent Jacobsen Cool Family, the Dordrecht line of Kools going back to Adriaen Kool in the year 1450 has no connexion whatsoever with our JACOB ARENTS, also known as Jacob Arentsen Kool. 

When i created the profiles for Barent Jacobsen Kool and his father Jacob Arentsen Kool (also known as Jacob Arents) NO OTHER PROFILES POPPED UP for me to connect to. Please let that be clear. My great-grandmother was a Cool. Hers is the very last generation mentioned in the book ''The Barent Jacobsen Cool Family'' by Richard H. Benson, Boston, 2001, which i purchased in that same year. I have used his book always, esp. if there was conflicting information, as his book is very well researched and has original sources listed. I donot know how much of this book is now at internet. I have tried, when possible, to look up the Dutch sources, as i read Dutch having lived here in the Netherlands many years. Van de Kuyl has never come up in any sources named in this book. Kool / Cool on the other hand is the surname used by Barent Jacobsen's descendants in America, anglicised also to Cole. The surname Cool(e), Kool(e) exists in the Netherlands today, though i have no idea whether they are related to the Cool/Kool family in New Netherland / New York. This name is known in Germany as Kohl. In New York the name Cool / Kool was some times written as Kohl in church records. En fin, perhaps for the profile of the progenitor of this family - Jacob Arents(en) Kool/Cool - it might well be best to use his patronymic as his LNAB: thus, JACOB ARENTS, with other surnames Arentsen, Kool, Cool. That would avoid the problem being discussed. His son Barent Jacobsen Kool/Cool and descendants should only be known by some variation of the surname Kool/Cool. Thus, ''van de Cuyl'' as LNAB - in my convinced opinon - is to be ruled out. In order to have ''Van de Cuyl'' as an alternaive surname for Barent Jacobsen Kool and his descendants, it would seem to me that the onus is on those who wish to do so, to prove that he or anyone in his family was ever called by this surname in any contemporary or later document. The two names mean different things: van de Cuyl/Kuyl means ''from the hole'' whereas Cool/Kool means - at least superficially - ''cabbage'', ''coal''.   

by Albertus Robert Casimir Jung G2G6 (8.9k points)
edited by Albertus Robert Casimir Jung

Here's some lore that likely includes a bit of "family tradition" of the Kool/Cool family. This is from the 1894 book History of the Reformed Church of Tappan, N.Y., by David Cole (who was a Kool/Cool descendant):

The Holland name was Kool. After the surrender of 1664 it passed into Cool. Persistent mispronunciation of it from the time of this change compelled the family to adopt the spelling used at the present time. [By present spelling, he means "Cole."]

The furthest back Kool ancestors of whom we have knowledge now were Jacob Arentsen (Kool) and Aeltje Dirks of Amsterdam, Holland. They never came to this country.

The first Kool ancestor who came to America was their son Barent Jacobsen Kool, baptized in the Nieuwe Kerk of Amsterdam May 18, 1610. In 1633, at 23 years of age, he was an officer of the West India Company in New Amsterdam and signed official documents still extant. It is believed that he had come over as early as 1626. He married Marretje Leenderts. His family was one of nine which occupied Government houses on Brugh Straat (Bridge Street). The New York Church Records give him as still in the city in 1665. After this he removed to Ulster County where his name is on public lists till 1689. From this date it can be no further traced. He had nine children, all born in New Amsterdam. Some of them went with him up the Hudson and settled in and around Kingston where they have some descendants still living to day.

His oldest child Jacob Barentsen Kool, baptized before 1639 when the New York Church Records begin, married Marretje Simons. Both became members of the Reformed church of Kingston, founded in 1660. They had eight children.

There are several more generations of genealogy related to members and a minister of the Tappan church. I share this mostly because of the comments about the name.

Thanks very much, Ellen, for the above quote from David Cole. May i please use it at some of the Kool/Cool profiles? It is rich in the important details that it contains, confirming family knowledge and tradition. Also, i have corrected the information for Jacob Barentsen Kool under Children of Barent Kool. Indeed, according to the ''Barent Jacobsen Cool Family'', page 19, his son Jacob was ''born abt 1638, either in Amsterdam before his parents sailed for New Amsterdam, or after they arrived, before the records of the Dutch Church began''.
Of course you can use that quoted statement (or at least excerpts from it that are relevant in a particular context), Albertus. The book that I quoted from is in the public domain, I found it on the Internet (there's a link in my post), and of course this website is about sharing and collaboration -- I posted it here for everyone's information and use.

I didn't reply immediately because I was trying to figure why you were asking -- if there was some subtext to your question that I should be sure to reply to, or if you were just demonstrating your commitment to politeness in all things. I've finally concluded that mostly you are being polite, but also that you may not be able to access the link I posted. If you'd like a copy of the document (or of the pages about the Kool family) or a complete bibliographic citation, just let me know.
Thanks, Ellen. I just came back from Paris. I had no subtext in asking your permission to use the quoted statement from the 1894 book, other than being polite. I thought that you might first want to post the quote and its source on our Kool/Cool forefathers' profile(s). By giving your permission to use it, i can now post it myself. Thanks again! Albertus
to add to this thread, there is a website that gives to access to out of print and out of copy write books. The website is run by the National Archives and is very good wealth of information.

If you go to the home page and search for  Kool/Cool/Cole or other varient of the names and scrool through the site you will find all the Books written about the Kool and Cool Family back in the 1800's these are great resources. You can also type in Kingston Ny and find the church Records along with alot of the other Old Dutch Reform Churches.

You can also find about 80% of all the old County History that had been written in the 1800's

I have listed the site below

Archives.org
+1 vote

As there are no baptisms (they seem to be all patronymic) of the children of Jacob Arentsen Kool, actually showing the word Cool / Kool, I would suggest that the patronymic for this generation be considered as LNAB.

There might be a glaringly obvious explanation for the Cool part of the surname - the bio of Kool-248 cites a source that says ''Father works on ship between Amsterdam and Rotterdam.'' The Coolsingel is a very famous street in Rotterdam. It used to be a waterway (or moat if you will) and was filled up in 1923 to make a road. The name Coolsingel is closely connected with the Ambacht (Shire in English) Cool. This neighbourhood was heavily bombarded in 1940. Anyhow, it is clear that the name Cool was already associated with the family of Jacob Arentsen and him faring up and down from Amsterdam to Rotterdam, this name must have stuck somehow.

All circumstantial I know, but I would only start using Cool in any which way of spelling when it first appears on a baptismal record ....

by Philip van der Walt G2G6 Pilot (158k points)

Yes Philip , I agree, have been checking archives and added some info to the profiles (Bio's ) and Cool indeed seems to be the most common/ used version in Holland, although sometimes Kool also is used. 

And Ellen absolutely right no van der Cuyls or Barentsen , so Arentsz indeed is the much better patronym yes

indeed, you are correct Bea. I remember reading this feed of Ellen, Carrie, Michelle and Jan wondering why everyone got so excited about the occupation / barge thing, and now it makes total sense to me that it is connected to the Cool neighbourhood in Rotterdam (which Rotterdam annexed in 1813). Perhaps coleslaw was some of the produce he/they (for it seems to have been a family business) had to ferry ... smiley

And I can just image how Cool could have become [van der] Cuyl because even to this day this is how Dutch words are pronounced by the English and American speaking peoples.

Found baptism records for the children, added them , he is mentioned to be a ferryman on or at (don't know how you say this exactly ;)) Rotterdam , they didn't seem to use LNAB Cool or Kool , son Barent just was born with Patronym and very likely his father (both parents) as well . Son Barent was baptized 1609-03-12 ,added the info (birth etc) to the profiles and corrected the Birthdate (baptismdate) as well
Thanks Bea!

Thanks and Jan also found a lot of records so that's great, will add some images to the profiles and add the sources Jan found as well :) Love this... all working together on these  families smiley So thanks everyone !

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