Wyatt Family, London end of 18th Century, what happened?

+3 votes
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Lend a hand please to discover which pieces of this Aristocratic family drama might be true. [[Wyatt-2734|Douglas William Wyatt]] was born in Paddington, London England Sept 26,1842 birth record is attached on profile. He immigrated to the USA was married and resided in Yonkers NY.

I am surprised I couldn’t uncover more sources and facts on the stories. His Parents are listed as Philip William Wyatt, and Mary Ann Wyatt. (spelled with both single L in name on register. Journalists all used double Phillip).

The family legend in Yonkers was pretty clear. The father of Douglas was reportedly “disinherited” by Douglas’s grandfather, for marrying a lady “below his station in life” and “unsuited to mingle” among friends, politicians, and those with lofty social standing. Sounds juicy and its never too late to smoke out those self centered cold hearted Aristocrats.

Family members believed it was gospel that Douglas Wyatt, was a descendant out of the very significant Wyatt architect family,

In addition to the fathers name being a big clue to sort things out, there were a few other pieces that may help trace the missing pieces. Architect James Wyatt did have a son with name of Phillip William, but Douglas’ father would very likely have been one generation younger than that Phillip b 1789. I couldn’t find any family data for that  Phillip. I was turning up very few records overall. Its hard to believe that this interesting gossip wouldn’t have been covered in some sources. 

 

Relatives believe Douglas had 3 sisters living in eastern NJ towns, Douglas apparently had a sister or sister in law “Aunt Susie” was the one name I found in family notes.

Douglas’ daughter was named Loretta Augusta Wyatt, not a real common name so there may be some relevance to other paternal family members.

Lend a hand and we might get reputations redeemed.

:Recap of the Search, and Story

Great help from those who looked into it. Community all gets a big Cheer.
Found out the exact heritage, found out the family break up.
:Most important, I discovered the enormous magnitude of impact that the Wyatts had on English Society for several generations.
It was the celebrity father James Wyatt, who had cut ties, excluding youngest son Phillip from inheritance. The talented son had been described as the successor "intended to be his fathers help in old age" but he screwed around as a teen and into early 20s. From indulgent permissive parenting, his father went the other extreme and gave him the axe. Nobody to blame but those two.
Phillip William did continue on in the Architecture profession, but as an indication of his status, when his prominent older brother Matthew died, the lengthy Obituary defined the other family, but zero mention of Phillip.

Douglas Wyatt became the grandson of Phillip William the screw up. The Wyatt family was truly a huge force in grand scale Architecture, Building & Construction, pioneering Engineering and Science as well as facilitators of the Industrial revolution. The background and setting are fascinating links to noteworthy people and events

WikiTree profile: Douglas Wyatt
asked in Genealogy Help by Marty Ormond G2G6 Mach 5 (53.5k points)
edited by Marty Ormond

3 Answers

+1 vote
 
Best answer
Born 26 September 1842, Douglas William Wyatt was christened 13 August 1843, Paddington, St. James, Middlesex, the son of Phillip William Wyatt & Mary Ann.

In the UK England census of 1851, Douglas W , born Chelsea, with sisters Susan A (6) and Mary C (4)  both born Paddington, were living at 12 Oxford Street, Stepney with  father Phillip, (31), born Pimlico, Middlesex, who is described as a widower.

His sister's birth are recorded Susan Ada (Kensington 3/325 q June 1844) & Mary Caroline (Kensington, 3/355 q June 1846)

Father Phillip William's marriage to Mary Ann Stent is recorded in Chelsea registration area in 1841. (Chelsea 3/32 q December). Mary Ann's death is recorded in 1851. (London 2/137 q June ). There is an entry for a further marriage of a Phillip William Wyatt in Bethnal Green in1855, to either Caroline Wheeler or Caroline Pearce. (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2DQW-W93)
answered by R W G2G6 Pilot (257k points)
selected by Marty Ormond
Ron that is great start for this search. Gives the structure of family over the several decades. 3  kids and a widower at age 31. I still need to pull up that 1851 census, to confirm ages, was that on family search also?

So there is nothing that runs counter to the oral history repeated by several rekatuves that got this search started. Aunt Susie is right there as sister a couple years younger than Douglas.Douglas is eldest Its possible that one or more children resulted from 2nd marriage.

Still looking to see where Phillip connects to the line of prominent Wyatts. and if a father of Phillip wanted to go to nuclear and disinherit the son whar was the issue.

Thanks Marty
This is the 1851 Census:

Name:    Douglas W Wyatt
Age:    8
Estimated birth year:    abt 1843
Relation:    Son (Child)
Father's name:    Philip W Wyatt
Gender:    Male
Where born:    Chelsea, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish:    Stepney
County/Island:    Middlesex
Country:    England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image
Registration district:    Stepney
Sub-registration district:    Mile End Old Town Upper
ED, institution, or vessel:    16
Neighbors:    View others on page
Household schedule number:    419
Piece:    1552
Folio:    430
Page Number:    71
Household Members:    
Name    Age
Philip W Wyatt    31
Douglas W Wyatt    8
Susan A Wyatt    6
Mary C Wyatt    4

Vivian's finding of the 1841 marriage of Phillip William's confirm he was the son of a Phillip William Wyatt, an architect. This record of a Phillip William Wyatt born 5 March 1785, christened  June 1785 St. Mary, Maryleborne, the son of James Wyatt & Rachael is interesting (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J3CQ-QC3).

This is the Marriage registration for the 1841 marriage (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2D46-2HG)

This is an interesting link to the Wyatt family for which James & Phillip are noted.  (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyatt_family)
That is outstanding. The link to  James Wyatt and Rachel being parents of Phillip William Sr is just what my request for help was aimed at. And that 1785 is a slightly different birth date than I sketched out, so the source is very important clarification and is has accuracy instead of just conversation. WikiTree community could NOT make it happen without this type of help.
+1 vote

Philip William Wyatt, of full age, Bachelor, Clerk, of 19 Draycott Place, Chelsea, son of Philip William Wyatt, Architect & Mary Ann Kent, of full age, Spinster, of 77 Alfred Place, New Road, Chelsea, daughter of Henry Kent, Stone Mason were married 31st October 1841 at the Parish Church of St. Luke Chelsea, after Banns. Philip William Wyatt signed; Mary Ann Kent made her mark. Witnesses: Augustus Wyatt; Sarah Kent (both signed).

 

Philip William Wyatt, of full age, Widower, Clerk, of 6 Salisbury Place, son of Philip William Wyatt, Deceased & Caroline Wheeler, of full age, Spinster, of 6 William Street, daughter of James Wheeler, Deceased were married 20th October 1855 at the Parish Church of St. Simon Zelotes, Bethnal Green, after Banns. Philip William Wyatt; Caroline Wheeler (both signed). Witnesses: William Hall, Mary Dear (both signed).

Both marriages available on Ancestry London, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921

answered by Vivian Egan G2G6 Mach 4 (46.4k points)
Wonderful additional stuff Vivian,
I am going now to check the source that you attached that lists the Phillip William Wyatt (1779) architect as father of Phillip Jr at the time of wedding. and grandfather of Douglas. Phillip b 1779 would be son of James b1746, who is son of Benjamin b1709., son of John b1675.

I will get started on some initial profiles that include Douglas his spouse, projected landing spot in the wyatt family that has lots of history, and a few candidates for the notables project.

Particularly important would be to search out Birth records if possible for the SIblings of Phillip Wm Wyatt Jr., I dont have a mothers name for Phillip Jr, the wife of Phillip Sr.  I am going to predict that the Augustus, or Agusta Wyatt who was witness to the marriage certs, was probably a sibling. that is the first indication I have seen that the middle name of Loretta Wyatt came from this paternal family group.

Thanks, we have a great start
Vivian this is first time that I have used this particular Marriage data base. thanks for teaching me something very important and helpful. One of these days I will be much more proficient  searching in England

. ****Bachelor, Clerk, of 19 Draycott Place, Chelsea, son of Philip William Wyatt, Architect & Mary Ann Kent, of full age, Spinster, of 77 Alfred Place, New Road, Chelsea, daughter of Henry Kent, Stone Mason****Mary Ann had a prior marriage apparently.
for EuroAristo implications, this overall line of the Wyatts from Staffordshire and Kent hasn't been covered in the tree as far as I can see. I have this line above going to John Wyatt b1675. and will start adding some profiles

The London Wyatts apparently spoke often of their descent from those in the Courts back at time of Thomas Wyatt. I won't predict right now, how much of that is accurate

But I was thinking about the history of the Wyatt Rebellion, involving Thomas the Younger. Interesting contrast if the Douglas Wyatt  connection moves in that direction.

Douglas believed his father had been disinherited. don't know the religion of the Phillip William Wyatts but Douglas and family were very solid practicing Roman Catholics. And then very quickly added the blood of the Tudors to the line. For the living descendants of Douglas, Henry VIII is a second cousin and Queen Mary a 3rd cousin.  That is interesting, in light of the Wyatt rebellion to remove Mary from the throne. to prevent any more liberal treatment of the Catholics.

As I predicted this is a really interesting family drama
wrong place
+1 vote

Phillip William Wyatt  was involved in a scandal, in 1811, one that was published and I would have thought the 'talk of the town'.

 I think he is  the right person if you are descended from the architectural family.

'Mr Wyatt is  the son of a gentleman (I dare say well know to you), the architect to his Majesty.'

'Report of the cause between Hugh Doherty Esq. plaintiff and Philip Wm Wyatt esq defendant for 'criminal conversation' with the plaintiffs wife.'

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=20pgAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA85&lpg=PA85&dq=Philip+William+Wyatt&source=bl&ots=DoQcul70Vi&sig=rmpnse8vsr68Dx8Rk_2SM1qnzcg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAmoVChMIgOW724a6xwIVCbUaCh1Ofwjs#v=onepage&q=Philip%20William%20Wyatt&f=false

Complicated story. Ann Holmes fell in love with Doherty against her parents wishes. They put her in an asylum from where she escaped,  eloped with Hugh and married him  . She accused her husband of maltreating her, it also appears that her father sued Hugh Doherty for debt and he ended up in debtors prison.

They seem to have got back together but then she elopes with Philip Wyatt  The pair considered that the first marriage was illegal because Ann was underage and didn't have parental consent (it wasn't). They  went to Gretna Green and married there. and then set up house together. Mr Doherty is suing Philip Wyatt for seducing his wife. 
 .It seems that Philip was found guilty and had to pay damages of 1000 pounds .This was not nearly the full amount possible in these circumstances but was still a considerable amount of money.

 Did this then lead to divorce and did he then marry the lady? (could he? I don't think there were civil marriages until later)

(edit see comment below ;  if you look at page 1 of the link there is some more background, which complicates the story further )

Philip  obviously  managed to get back into 'society' later since  he is recorded as having large country house commissions in the 1820s and he  collaborated with his brother on several important buildings https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Wyatt

 

There is  also a Philip William Wyatt applying for a marriage licence . This is much later and only 5 years before  wiki says that Philip the architect  died

The problem is that he is described as a bachelor and this marriage is too late for the father of someone born in around 1820.

26 Aug 1830

Phillip William Wyatt of the Parish of Saint  George Hanover Square,  in the county of Middlesex, a bachlor  of the age of twenty one years and upwards

Have prayed a licence for the Solemnization of Matrimony in the Parish Church of Acton in the same county.

Between him and Isabella Grant of the same Parish of Acton a widow.

Ancestry.com. London and Surrey, England, Marriage Bonds and Allegations, 1597-1921 [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2011

There is a whole hoard of Wyatt family architects http://www.victorianweb.org/art/architecture/misc/wyattdyn.html

answered by Helen Ford G2G6 Pilot (188k points)
edited by Helen Ford

I've found that there was a divorce granted in 1814. The whole story is summarised here http://www.naomiclifford.com/hugh-doherty/2/

 

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