I have another question regarding family from Wales.

+10 votes
The immigrant ancestor on my paternal side is Timothy Williams. Timothy Williams, born February 5, 1721, came to America from Wales, as a young man, evidently around 1740, when he first shows up in the parish records of the Church of England in Hanover County, Virginia. I have not been able to locate any information on him in Wales or who his parents were. Strangely enough, while the Williams family used the same names over and over - Thomas, William, John, Richard, Robert, etc. no where have I located another Timothy.

Of Timothy's children I descend from John, born 04 Feb 1746/47 in Hanover County, Virginia. In case Timothy is of no relation, my Williams line has only been traced back to John who was born in America.

Any help with this Williams-37976 line will be most welcome.
WikiTree profile: Doris Smith
in Requests for Project Volunteers by Doris Smith G2G6 Mach 1 (13.4k points)
edited by Living Sälgö

I found John's profile, but can't add anything for him. Have you found any profiles in WikiTree you think might be his ancestors? Maybe we might find something from that direction.

You didn't say when John left Virginia, or what the parish entries of him said (or which parish), but HathiTrust has this register online that might have his marriage or kids, if he was in St Paul's parish:


The following is from a letter from Lewis Brumfield of Yadkin, North Carolina. I do not know the people to whom he wrote but he sent me a copy of the letter.

Timothy Williams, born February 5, 1721, came to America from Wales, apart of England, as a young man, evidently around 1740, when he firstshows up in the parish records of the Church of England in HanoverCounty, Va. He probably came from Llangow, Wales, which is where thefamily of Col. Joseph Williams, of whom more later, came from. Thinthat year. I don't know just what year he died. He is listed in theSurry Court minutes in 1785 as being excused from paying poll tax dueto being aged and poor.  , by 1764 young John Williams was living in eastern Yadkin near the river, because there is an entry in the Salem diary inJanuary 1764 about "an Englishman from the Etkin (Yadkin)," who cameto Bethabara with several skins from which he wished to have two pairsof breeches made.

 [source: Brumfield's Timothy Williams Folks, page 19]  "It is curious that, given the Williams propensity for handing downnames, Timothy did not name any of his sons Timothy, nor did either ofhis sons John or Thomas name any of their sons Timothy, though theyall had large families.
Someone entered the DAR under Joseph Williams of Hanover County, Va/died Surry Co., NC - see http://services.dar.org/public/dar_research/search_adb/?action=full&p_id=A126323

I couldn't find a Timothy Williams that fit. And I couldn't figure out what Joseph's relationship was with Timothy.
Hi Liz - Timothy's son John was a patriot and qualifies a direct line descendant to join DAR or SAR using him.
P.S. I seem to be headed the wrong way (descendants, rather than ancestors). If Joseph is related, you might have better luck looking for his ancestors. Also, some of my brick walls crumbled thanks to distant cousins who contributed info after finding the profile of their ancestor that I'd entered... a collateral for me. You might want to add profiles for Thomse & John's brothers/sisters that you know of.

Good luck!
I am also a descendant of Timothy through his son Thomas and like you, have a brick wall there. Do you have information about Timothy's wife? One source says she was Cherokee,English name Elizabeth, daughter of Moytoy,  but on other ancestry sites I've been told that Moytoy never existed. Have you come across anything similar?
The only thing I've come across regarding Timothy's wife is that she was possibly the daughter of Cherokee Chief Donohoe from the Hanover, VA area and that her English name was Elizabeth. This was from an email from a Steve Williams in California back in 2005.  

Then in 2008 in an email from Paul Williams he wrote this: "I read that she was a Cherokee maiden from the Snowbird Clan."

Timothy is still a brick wall for me, mainly because the information that I've been given by various people does not have sources that I can check for reliability and accuracy.

Hope this helps you some. Have you come across any more information on Timothy?

Not Cherokee, nowhere near where they lived.  “Chief Donahoo” is a myth.  These claims were invented early in the 20th century when thousands of people claimed they had Cherokee ancestors in order to get a share of a four million dollar settlement.  Although their claims were refuted and applications rejected, the claims appear all over the Internet as fact.
Thank you for this. Just about everything I've found regarding Timothy's wife has turned out not to be factual.

5 Answers

+3 votes
Ancestry in Wales can be very difficult because the registers are so poor.  However the NLW (National Library of Wales at Aberystwyth) provides free access to all pre 1858 wills.  If you have not already done so, I would recommend a search of wills that look relevant.  The Mormon Church did extract a lot of information about beneficiaries and witnesses from these wills.  This information is in an index at the NLW.  I believe it (or some of it) was included in the old IGI. Another good source is a set of large volumes in Haverfordwest Library.  The NLW also has records deposited by many solicitors.


Graham Pratten
by Graham Pratten G2G Crew (770 points)
Are those sources online? I live in Texas, United States.
If you Google the "National Library of Wales Aberystwyth" you should get their site.  They have put all pre-1857 wills online. You can also look at their catalogue of manuscripts.  If you have difficulty yo can contact me at graham@prattens.com. regards Graham Pratten
Thank you Graham. I have been looking at other lines for awhile but this gives me a new place to search.
Familysearch has online the abstracts from the NLW Wills. You can see it here https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-RH92-ZX?owc=waypoints&wc=M6KV-129%3A174219701%2C174786401%3Fcc%3D1876640&cc=1876640 please ignore any errors that come up, click on one of the diocese and the error will go away (not sure why that happens).

I find that by searching for a name on the NLW wills site https://www.library.wales/discover/library-resources/wills and then looking in the diocese and the year on the abstracts I can get the basic information on the will and then decide if I want to decipher the whole will which is available as an image on the NLW site. It just saves a lot of time and effort as the wills can be difficult to read.

The wills are also available on Ancestry so if you want you can get an image of them easier than you can do it from the NLW site.
+2 votes
You have another problem, your ancestor came in the presence period. His father could be William ap something. Expand your problem and possibles.
+3 votes
FreeReg offers a free search of parish records. Unfortunately, the registers in Wales are generally not as complete or as old as those in England. Patronymics are another issue. The change from patronymics to surnames occurred over a long period of time and there were differences in the transition period in different parts of Wales. In addition to the use of ap, "son of", for example Robert ap William, there were other patterns during the transition period. For example, Thomas, the son of Robert Williams, might be named Thomas Roberts.
by John George G2G2 (2.5k points)
+1 vote
You and I seem to have the same elusive ancestor. There is supposedly a book written about this family called "Timothy Williams Folks" by Lewis Brumfeld mentioned in another post here. Unfortunately I haven't been able to find it anywhere. It's at the historical society library where they settled. We also have the story in our family that Elizabeth, Timothy's wife was Cherokee, daughter of Moytoy and Nancy or Quatsy.
by Ann Loomer G2G Crew (560 points)
As noted above, there is NO Cherokee connection in this family.  No one lived anywhere near any Cherokee.  Those are claims invented at the turn of the 20th century and spread and expanded all over the Internet.  The Cherokee Chief known as Moytoy lived in what is now Tennessee (300 miles and a mountain range away) died in 1742, and had one known son who died with no descendants.  Any Internet tree that claims to go back to anyone named “Moytoy” is fiction.
+1 vote
I've managed to find 2 Timothy Williams born within a year of each other to William Williams of Chancefield, Talgarth, Brecknockshire. The first was baptised 17 June 1721. This first Timothy died. The burial record says he was buried 22 January 1722. The second Timothy was one of twins, the second twin being named Titus. The twins were baptised on 11 August 1722. I found these records on The Genealogist site.

Hope that helps.
by Jutta Beer G2G6 Mach 3 (34.0k points)
Thank you!

Related questions

+2 votes
2 answers
+6 votes
1 answer
109 views asked Sep 1 in Genealogy Help by Steve Bartlett G2G6 Mach 5 (55.2k points)
+13 votes
3 answers
116 views asked Mar 27, 2021 in The Tree House by Tracy Ann Williams G2G Crew (530 points)
+4 votes
1 answer
162 views asked Apr 17, 2018 in Genealogy Help by Anonymous Williams G2G6 Mach 1 (11.2k points)
+7 votes
1 answer
270 views asked Dec 19, 2015 in Genealogy Help by John Flynn G2G Crew (340 points)

WikiTree  ~  About  ~  Help Help  ~  Search Person Search  ~  Surname:

disclaimer - terms - copyright