Have you auDNA tested and is almost all of your ancestry from early colonial America? [closed]

+16 votes
1.5k views
Do you know almost all your ancestry on all branches back to early colonial America? If so, is your GEDmatch ID on your profile?  I'm interested seeing any evidence that you appear to be a closer relative than you actually are with others with almost all early colonial American ancestry.

Thank you and sincerely, Peter
closed with the note: Question should have been "...is ALL your ancestry on all branches known and is it all from Colonial America?"
asked in The Tree House by Peter Roberts G2G6 Pilot (405k points)
closed by Peter Roberts
I have many colonial ancestors.  I am a confirmed descendant of William Brewster as well as the Safford, Noyes, Haynes, Gore, Freeman, Gager, etc.     My DNA is on Ancestry as well as Gedmatch.
On my mother's side of the family, my grandfather had several branches that went back to Colonial New England - actually back to the Mayflower (Warren and Allerton) and one that went back Colonial Virginia.  My GedMatch kit numbers are #A934701 and #A896935.
Most of my maternal side is, and my GEDMatch ID is linked to my profile.  My phased results for maternal side only ID is PT340060M1.
I have found an odd aunt-in-law or two who came here between 1800-1830, but the vast majority of people in my line were pre-revolutionary on both sides of my family and zero immigrants since 1830 (until my sister-in-law). I have hundreds of matches on 23 & Me and GEDMatch and still I know there are gaps. There are family lines in my tree where no one has ever taken a test. I try to encourage people to test because I'd be generous if I said one quarter of my family branches has a DNA test linked to it. Most of the tests I see on 23 & Me are linked to the same half dozen or so families. I agree that I really like Ancestry's test results. DNA cousins whose link I could not identify on 23 & Me, were illuminated on Ancestry. It was very handy.

My and my husband's GEDMatch #s on under my profile. Trying to get my dad to load his 23 & Me to GEDMatch. His side is by far the least documented part of the tree with only about 3 dozens DNA tests all together...and most of those people were easy to link because they were 3rd cousins or closer.
Most of mine are pre rev also. No new immigrantes really since the 1800s.s
Have a look at mine Peter
You have your tree somewhere peter?
Yes I have the full suite from family tree.com including yDNA to 67 markers, full mtDna and auto. Mostly No new immigrant blood after 1650 on my paternal side however his grandmother did come from Ireland in 1880. On my maternal side it's almost exclusively French Canadian circa 1650 Quebec with a little American Indian thrown in and verified via mtDna  A2-C64T.
Yes here too. Most all are colonial era in all ports from Mass Bay to Charleston. Gedmatch ID on profile.
I watched an episode of NOVA on PBS this week. They were exploring ancient caves in the Himalayan mountains. At one point they decided to test DNA from teeth found in caves, attempting to discover if the "people" had come from China or from India. They were from China. But the purpose of the comment is the procedure they followed to test the DNA, which was rigorous. They even wore clean-room outfits so as not to contaminate the sample.

Quite a difference from a sample of spit.

38 Answers

+8 votes
 
Best answer
Peter,

Most of my father's ancestry goes back to early colonial America except for one branch from Belgium. I do have my GEDmatch ID on my profile.         

I'm not sure I understand what you're looking for though.
answered by J. Salsbery G2G6 Mach 2 (24.1k points)
selected by Dave Martin
Unfortunately his mother and his father's father don't appear to have ancestry in that era from those parts. https://www.wikitree.com/treewidget/Pearson-3639/5

I'm looking to see if the level of endogamy (if any) is revealed by the auDNA.

Thanks and sincerely,
His father's mother is connected to early colonial America, with three Mayflower passengers and many, many PGM ancestors.

His father's line soon ends at a brick wall. He is awaiting Y-Dna results.
+7 votes
My husband's family is Colonial Virginia except for his grandmother who was Irish.

https://www.wikitree.com/index.php?title=Jones-21365&public=1
answered by Rosemary Jones G2G6 Pilot (221k points)
+9 votes

You've described me, Peter. Roughly half of my ancestral lines are from pre-1700 colonial New England, The other half consists of New Netherland settlers (also pre-1700) and Scots Irish and Palatines who arrived in the colonies primarily in the early 1700s. And my Gedcom ID is on my profile.

I have no doubt that the phenomenon you describe is real.

I have oodles of matches in 23andMe and Gedmatch with people with whom I have no discernible cousin relationship. I assume most of these mystery matches are indicative of shared ancestry in early New England -- or possibly in an English community that sent many citizens to America.  In some instances, I've identified shared ancestry with a match, but the shared ancestry is much too far back to be credible as the explanation for the magnitude of our reported DNA match.

The services truncate the lists of relatives they show us. 23andMe no longer shows people as my DNA relatives unless we share at least roughly 13.5 cM. Gedmatch displays 2000 matches on the one-to-many list; the weakest matches on my list of 2000 match me on segments of about 8.6 or 8.7 cM. 

answered by Ellen Smith G2G6 Pilot (824k points)
Yes, your ancestry fits the bill!  Are any of your matches in WikiTree so we can see that almost all their ancestors are from early Colonial America?
I also have many, many autosomal matches at Ancestry and FTDNA. The ones that can be identified, match in early New England.

Finding my DNA matches who are in Gedmatch and in WikiTree with well-documented ancestry is a tall order. There are more matches in 23andMe than are here, and not many are in WikiTree. Here are two to consider:

  • Lynn Gazis has auDNA on Gedmatch, and I have a good match with her on one segment. Her mother is in 23andMe but not Gedmatch, and I match with the mother on the same segment that I match with Lynn. This is a 15-cM segment. The mother and I map out as 6th cousins (with some uncertainty in some of the details of the genealogy). For 6th cousins, a 15cM match is unlikely, but possible. However, in this instance it's pretty clear (notwithstanding the uncertainty in the details) there are multiple shared ancestors in the generations near the MRCA, so I think it's likely that endogamy has contributed to the match.
  • One of my closest matches on Gedmatch (and the same data are in 23andMe) is with Christopher Child. He is not in WikiTree, but he is a professional genealogist with NEHGS and he has published and blogged about his family history. He and I match on a single segment of over 32 cM, and I have essentially the same match with his father, so the shared ancestry is presumed to be on his paternal line. His paternal ancestry includes people who were probably neighbors of my ancestors in places like Woodstock, Connecticut, but I've yet to run across any reasonably recent shared ancestors. I wrote to him a long time ago on his gedmatch email address to inquire about possible shared ancestors (I no longer have the message), but that was before I knew who he was and before I saw that the match was with his father. I didn't get a reply -- and I now have a pretty good idea that we aren't really 4th cousins, in spite of the suggestion from the DNA match. ADDED: One ancestral pair that I do share with Chris Child is William Lyon and Sarah Ruggles. For me they are 9G grandparents -- not a likely basis for a 32cM matching DNA segment.
+6 votes
Most of my mother's ancestors are from early colonial America:

https://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Smith-Family-Tree-38566
answered by Kay Wilson G2G6 Pilot (149k points)
+6 votes

Peter,

A large percentage of my family is from colonial America and Canada, families moved back and forth between Canada and New England.  The matches on GEDMatch and FTDNA seem to consistently show connections as closer than they are.  I have determined that my parents are 9th cousins - James Rogers (abt. 1615 - 1687) and Elizabeth (Rowland) Rogers (abt. 1620 - 1709) are their common ancestors.  

I always assume that matches are at least 2 generations earlier than suggested by GEDMatch or FTDNA.

DNA cousins that I have identified on Wikitree are listed here - if relationship is known it is shown - Space:Philip_Wayne_Smith_-_DNA_Cousins_-_Smith-40964

 

answered by Philip Smith G2G6 Pilot (240k points)
For the record, Philip and I map out as 8th cousins once removed on two different ancestral lines, and as 8th cousins twice removed on a third line, but we don't have a DNA match.
Ellen,

We now have something to work on - my sister has recently been tested and she is a match to you - on Chromosome 8 and 23 !

I have several cases where my siblings - all of whom are clearly siblings based on the DNA tests - have matches with early ancestors that I do not have, and I match some that they do not match.

Seems like if you want to solve early DNA connections it is necessary to test all family members. (Probably something the testing companies like to hear but not something that makes research easier.)

Phil: I found those matches with your sister, but they are too weak to be seriously considered in genetic genealogy:

  • 5.2 cM and 1084 SNPs on chromosome 8
  • 4.7 cM and 521 SNPs on chromosome 19
  • X chromosome: longest segment is 10.4 cM and 759 SNPs -- but that match doesn't count because none of those cousin relationships that you and  I share is on a line through which I would have received any X chromosome material.

Also, my sister has a match with you of 4.6 cM and 487 SNPs on chromosome 2.

Although they are too weak for inclusion in a serious analysis, those  matches might still be of interest for Peter's analysis of endogamy, since we know we have multiple lines of shared ancestry in early New England.  :-)

he is my grandfather it says, and he has a few wives! she was one many

Jorden

porter

Sherman

haven't looked to see which is my grandmother!

https://aprilsworld.com/OurFamilytree/individual.php?pid=P57139&ged=tree2

that link is to

James RogersAge: 87 years1589–1676


here is his fathers

https://aprilsworld.com/OurFamilytree/individual.php?pid=P56077&ged=tree2

Thomas Matthew “Mayflower Compact” RogersAge: 46 years1565–1611

+5 votes
Most all of my ancestors on my mother's side go back to colonial America a number going from NJ to Washington County, PA and then Licking County, Ohio.  These include, Evans, French, Clark and Prudden.  There are a lot of intermarriages in these lines too. And yes, my auDNA GEDmerge ID is on my profile.
answered by Dave Dardinger G2G6 Pilot (359k points)
+5 votes

Most of my ancestors are from colonial America on both my father's and mother's side.  On my father's side I am descended from Abraham Estes through both my grandfather (James Douglas) and grandmother (Ruth Bunch Douglas), making them 7th cousins, once removed.  All of my ancestors with few exceptions were Western European most coming to the colonies from England and Scotland in the 17th and 18th centuries.  My auDNA results indicate very little interracial mixing.  I have auDNA tested with FTDNA and my Gedmatch ID is T824570,

Sounds like an interesting project Peter

 

answered by David Douglass G2G6 Mach 6 (69k points)
edited by David Douglass
David,

I have some distant Douglas ancestors and I just compared our GedMatch numbers...we are at an estimated number of generations of 7.4 and we have one matching segment of only 8 centimorgans on chromosome 12.  I am Eddy-1839 (Virginia Eddy Combs).  My Gedmatch # is T890152 and my connection to the Douglas family is through 2x great grandmother, Lydia Maria Knowles whose mother was Phebe Douglas Austin, daughter of Ebenezer Austin and Phebe Douglas.  I'll be checking the relationship tool to see what WikiTree comes up with as our common ancestor.
Hi cousin!
I just found out how everyone is sharing family lists.  Here's mine:

https://www.WikiTree.com/index.php?title=Special:FamilyList&x=11063722,aa0a

I'm sure I have lots of cousins out there, but so far I haven't found too many gedmatches with WikiTree members
sounds like names I have seen!
+6 votes
Yes, Peter, almost all my ancestors came to New England in the PGM or shortly thereafter.  I have done a DNA test, presumably auDNA, with Ancestry.com, and it is on my profile.  I see a fair number of WikiTree-indicated connections on profiles as far back as the 18th century.

I'm still uneducated about DNA, however.  What should I be doing to further what you are doing?

Halsey Bullen-506
answered by Halsey Bullen G2G2 (2.2k points)
To further what I'm trying to do, please register at https://www.gedmatch.com/login1.php and follow GEDmatch's instructions to upload your AncestryDNA results there, then add your GEDmatch ID to your DNA Tests page in WikiTree.

Thanks and sincerely,
+4 votes
Yes, most of my ancestors except for one set of great grandparents who came here around 1870 were from the Great Migration.  And my Gedmatch ID is on my profile.  Would love to know who shares dna with me...I have to say that I've found far more "cousins" through the WikiTree relationship tool than through Gedmatch.  I'm in the process of creating a spreadsheet with my Gedmatch "matches" and would welcome more info!!

Ginni Combs  (Eddy-1809) I forgot to log in before I answered your question!
answered by

Hi, Virginia. It looks like you are Eddy-1839 

Yes, sorry!  Eddy-1839!
+4 votes
About half my ancestry was early colonial America, both New England and Virginia, probably New Jersey and Maryland (not yet proven).  FTDNA, Ancestry, and GedMatch numbers all on my profile.  

As for "endogamy", oh, yes.  Most extreme case so far:  a predicted (ISOGG statistics) relationship of 2nd cousin 1r -- paper trail relationship of 6th c 1r, genetic relationship of 5th c 1r (we're double cousins through brother/sister marriages).  He is not interested in doing genealogy right now, not interested in having info on WikiTree, not willing to upload to GedMatch.  (I was lucky to get the info I did). Currently trying to locate a second possible paper trail match.
answered by Gayel Knott G2G6 Mach 2 (20.9k points)
Wow!! That sounds like a great data point for Peter!!

Warning: He might want to try to talk you into researching this cousin's genealogy to get it into WikiTree.
At least two of his lines are already on WikiTree (with a couple of connections I've added), and I'm working on some more.  The biggest problem, for me, is that this line is a mess (in more ways than one -- lots of cousin marriages (but not as far as I can tell in my direct line); lots of questionable research.  From DNA perspective, I have one chromosome that is also "a mess" -- long story, drives me nuts).  I have several pedigrees, have been putting some on WikiTree, working on others.  Will start doing communication blitz after holidays.  The temptation is to rush around looking for possible connections (like rushing around grabbing similar names in traditional research).  Trying to do one small step at a time, but takes a lot of time.  In the meantime, lots of hypotheses.  :-)
I have many actually maybe 100s, :)

My line is very royal it says! it goes to the first royals, the after Rome! actually it says it goes to Rome and beyond! But who would believe that?

my DNA is Beauchamp and bletso in moms side! farmer on dads side!

they are the same people!
+3 votes
My Dad's side mostly and my mom's side, only through her mom.  We've got many kits for our family.  See the many GEDmatches from my profile.
answered by William Foster G2G6 Mach 4 (50k points)
+3 votes
I have taken the  auDNA test. I'm the 9th grand daughter of Mary (Allerton) Cushman,  (Allerton-6) and of Rev. Thomas Cushman Sr, (Cushmans-8.) Mary was the last surviving Pilgrim on the Mayflower. Thomas was her spouse, Plymouth Elder and also the son of Robert Cushman.

 

Robert (Cushman-136,) my 10th GGF, was the individual who secured funding for the pilgrims voyage to the new world. He was scheduled to travel on the Mayflower but when the Fortune encountered issues he gave up his seat on the Mayflower to assist. He traveled to the Plymouth colony shortly after and continued to assist with on going funding. His son Thomas was left with Governor Bradford to take care of in his absence. In addition to these early colonial ancestors am also directly related to Mayflower passengers Isaac Allerton (10th GGF,) Mary (Norris) Allerton (10th GGM) and Degory Priest (11th GGF.) Of course like those responding, I also have many "cousins" and relatives from that time period.
answered by Cynthia Rushing G2G6 Mach 3 (31.2k points)
I have a slew of Colonial ancestors.  My DNA has been attached to GedMatch, FTDNA, Ancestory.com, Heritage.com.etc.  I am related to the Hopkins, Houghs and Hatfields.
Note to whoever flagged this answer:

In this online forum, a "flag" indicates there is something about this item that violates WikiTree standards in some way and should be removed by "the management" (such as offensive language or disclosure of another person's sensitive personal information). Please don't use flags for any other purpose.
I know that John Beauchamp had shares in the virginal company, that is how it worked. You bought shares and you got tickets! and future profits!, also his son was Christopher martin and his son was captain john martin who died in Jamestown! in failure!
I am also a direct descendent of Mary Allerton and Robert Cushman and I have been able to match with a cousin back to Lydia Harlow - granddaughter of Mary Allerton through my mom. My GedMatch Kit # is A934701 and my mom's is #A896935.  I am also connected to Richard Warren through Lydia Harlow's other grandmother.
+2 votes
My WikiTree family tree is about 75% complete since the American revolution.  One grandparent appears to be mostly descended from Mayflower Pilgrims, two others have Mayflower ancestry with completely colonial family trees, and the fourth born 1883 in Atlantic Canada seems to be mostly pre-potato famine Irish.  AncestryDNA estimates me as 26% Irish, 14% British, 14% Scandinavian, 6% Iberian, and 37% western European; while 23andMe estimates 67% British Isles, 10% French & German, 5% Scandinavian, and 17% broadly northwestern European.  I have many genetic relatives on both databases, but few have a similarly complete family tree from which to identify shared ancestors.  I would be most interested to have a more complete description of the mathematical basis of the evidence you hope to find.
answered by AL Wellman G2G6 (7.9k points)
AL, are your DNA test results posted on Gedmatch? You and I map out with oodles of common ancestors at generations 11 through 14, but nothing closer. I wondered if we had a DNA match due to all those distant ancestors we have in common (that's the sort of thing that Peter is interested in). I didn't see a Gedmatch ID on your profile here and I couldn't find your name in my 23andMe DNA relatives list.
Perhaps I should explain my interest in mathematical basis. My perception of the model of human DNA inheritance begins with chromosome cleavage during meiosis followed by genetic recombination. The simplistic assumption of 50% from each parent is merely an average value for grandparents, and within a few generations preferred locations for chromosome cleavage make it more likely great grandchildren will inherit chromosome segments on an "all or nothing" basis rather than 50% of what their parent inherited.  I was wondering if Peter was postulating a median chromosome segment length and probability of inheritance based on some average number of times early colonists might appear in the family tree of a given individual.  (as opposed to, for example, the probability genetic recombination might duplicate the sequence of a shared ancestor)
I think you may be correct, as I find that My tree matches what my DNA says. But I know I have Indian, and in America. But it shows very little, like it cant get past that Irish! it must take so many generations to build a 100% Irish ancestry?
+2 votes

Don't know what exactly you are looking for but my father's family is all New England.

The Halls were from Portsmouth, RI ,many Quakers, lots of cousin marriages of some level or other, three lines back to the 1630s William Hall.

Grandmother Pomeroy back to Eltweed. The family spent years in Somers, Connecticut, at least two Pomeroy cousin marriages.

The Soules go back to George and intermarried with John Alden's line, at least one first cousin marriage.

The Shepardsons go back to the Great Migration but they moved around a bit more.

I have several matches on Ancestry that match on trees, but some that don't match yet even with large trees. Cousin circles go back to Parker Hall and Daniel Shepardson. There was a circle back to John Pomeroy but that disappeared.

Wikitree has matches too.

Peter and Sue are 15th cousins twice removed. We are not that close.

answered by Sue Hall G2G6 Mach 7 (78.6k points)
edited by Sue Hall
+2 votes
Sent you a private message, but I have 3 Mayflower lines that have been isolated in Nova Scotia for many generations, and the rest is R-M269, a major Htype for older Celtic peoples.  All lines trace to pre-revolutionary America.
answered by Mark Dunham G2G Rookie (260 points)
+2 votes
Three quarters of my ancestors are from Colonial America, mostly New England, some Pennsylvania/New Jersey Quakers, all from England.The other quarter are from Ireland in the 19th Century. My Gedmatch ID is in my profile.
answered by Henry Chadwick G2G6 Mach 4 (43.1k points)
+2 votes

Other than a bit of NA ancestry, most of my ancestors trace back to the colonial days. Most are from Colonial Virginia,  some others from New England and the in between states.

I have a few dna cousins I met here on WikiTree. My GedMatch # is on my profile. I would love to meet more family members.

answered by Susan Wilson G2G6 (6k points)
Susan and I map out as 14th cousins (not at all close), with a most recent common ancestor born in England in 1503. But Gedmatch shows that we do have a [weak] DNA match: 6.5 cM and 469 SNPs on chromosome 19.
Good to meet you, cousin! So far my WikiTree dna relatives have a Friends/Quaker history in their family. It would be interesting to me if you could tell which Mayflower descendant is your ancestor.

Although unproven, only because I do not know who the parents of my 3x grandmother were (Gardner-6544) Richard Gardner (Gardner-127) is presumed to be her ancestor. Because of that one ancestor, I have many family ties with northern Friends, many of whom eventually migrated to Virginia and North Carolina.

One thing I have noticed is that no matter how far back our common ancestor is, there is always something we have in common. Photography and appreciation of nature, weird sense of humor, are examples.

It will be interesting to see which others in this conversation we have in common.

GedMatch 512933

I'd like to add that there are many people I connect with thru Relationship Finder, with no dna match.

Hi, Susan. That mapped 14th-cousin ancestry is much too distant to be at all likely to show up in autosomal DNA, and our DNA match is borderline, at best. I figured that the fact that you and I have a DNA match might possibly be an indication of the phenomenon that Peter is exploring -- that is, situations where people with ancestry in colonial America have shared DNA that isn't attributable to specific shared ancestors, but might be due to the interrelationships in the colonial population.
+2 votes
I have all sorts of endogamy in my tree and plenty of Colonial America.  You are welcome to take a look at my tree and my Gedmatch #
answered by Emma MacBeath G2G6 Pilot (510k points)

Emma and I map out as 12th cousins, with MRCAs of Mayflower immigrants Thomas Rogers and his wife Eleanor, and no other common ancestors anywhere close to their generation. We have three very weak DNA matches:

  • 2 segments on chromosome 5: 4.3 cM (402 SNPs) and 4.5 cM (440 SNPs)
  • 1 segment on chromosome 13: 4.1 cm (418 SNPs)
@Ellen...Goodness!  You linked me to ANOTHER Mayflower family!  Thank you.  I just keep racking them up :-)
I didn't connect you, Emma -- those people were already connected to you as ancestors. They are in generation 13 in your Family List. :-)
I meant thank you for pointing it out.  I immediately went to my tree and followed the line. :-)
+2 votes
Isaac Young is my 6th Great Grandfather (paternal side) - he came as part of the Oglethorpe Expedition in 1736. I have a Gedmatch # on my profile. Also my brother & sister have Gedmatch ID #'s.

Also I might have some ties to Stephen Hopkins of the Mayflower, but I don't have a good enough paper trail for a high confidence level on that yet.

My maternal side came to the USA in 1905...

Mike Young (Young-12878)
answered by Mike Young G2G Crew (540 points)
+2 votes
I fit your bill. Paternal side is mostly New England colonial, mostly English, but some early Dutch/Palatine/French incursions.One side got caught up for 200 yrs as part of fairly closeknit 7th Day Baptist community in NJ and WV with loads of endogamy, so high rate of matches coming up there. About 80-85% of my dna matches are on my paternal side: my maternal side all came in the mid-1800s from Alsace, Scandinavia and Ireland, underlining our American dna bias. I am on GEDmatch, 23andme and FTDNA as noted on my profile page.
answered by Thomas Randolph G2G2 (2.5k points)

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