Early settlers of America's 13 Colonies - how to make their categories easier to find?

Question

I just posted a G2G question about how to categorize folks who settled in areas "pre-statehood" (see [this G2G discussion]) and said in that post that "The 13 Colonies need a separate discussion." This is that discussion.

My opinion - I don't think, for example, "Category:Rhode Island Colonists" (a category that does not exist), is the way to go - probably better would be by location, under https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Colony_of_Rhode_Island_and_Providence_Plantations (an existing category).

The 13 colonies are covered by a variety of projects (New Netherland Settlers and US Southern Colonies, for example), which I think would be where to find how to categorize American colonists, but it's not that easy.

I think we need a single place to find that info. But where? As a text section on [Category:Thirteen Colonies] on [Category:Colonial America]? Wherever it is, it could be linked to from [Category:US Pioneers and Settlers] (see [this G2G discussion]).

edited title to try to clarify what's being asked

Comments

Are you talking about a single place to explain what categories to use in which locations, like instruction and help pages or free space pages that are shared or maintained by a group of projects?

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more like an index... like the Name Field Guidelines page that collects links to project-specific guidelines.

The Louisiana info should probably be on a Louisiana Families page with a link to that section (Jackie and I are co-leaders of that project, so we probably got a bit more in the weeds than envisioned).

Cheers, Liz

Note - I got my G2G discussions mixed up. Louisiana, not being one of the 13 original colonies, is in [this discussion].

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I personally think they should be classified as ' Colony of Virginia", Colony of Maryland" etc ...I am unsure about MA .. whether Massachusetts Bay Colony/ Plymouth Colony  or Colony of Massachusetts Colony is appropriate, With all, I think to be tedious they could be subdivided  ie Jamestowne, Roanoke  but I don't think it is necessary to categorize beneath the State Colony  The 13

Answer 1

I really like Colonial America.  It conveys information and takes care of all the problems with colonies being held by the French, Dutch, English, etc.

Answer 2

If I understand correctly, in this discussion thread you would like to establish where we could put all the information needed for someone to lookup categories for early colonial settlers.

This sounds like a [[Space:Colonial Settlers Categories]] or [[Project:Colonial Settlers]] page which would list all the higher level categories, like [[Category:Colonial Settlers|Africa]] including how to put a {{Colonial Settler|Rhode Island}} template on a profile that would put that profile in the [[Category:Colonial Settler, Rhode Island]] which would be a sub category of both [[Category:Colonial Settlers, North America]] (or the lower category Colonial America) and [[Category:Rhode Island]]. (substitute the appropriate colony page for Rhode Island).

If there was also a {{Colonial Settlers Project}} template that could be included on any category which might have colonial settlers sub-category, then it could inject the link to the space and/or project page that explains how to add the template or categories to a profile.

But this is just my suggestion for organization and naming conventions.

If we created such a project then it should have the NNS and US Southern Colonies and other related projects added to its trusted list. Is this possible?

Comments

I don't think we need another project, just some place where one can find what project pertains.

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Then [[Space:Colonial Setters]] might be a good place to gather all the helpful information and links to the different country/state settlers categories and instructions on how to add  category page for a state/country/region. Then put a link to the space page on the different country/state settlers category pages.

Answer 3

Based on answers so far...

Is the best option maybe to create a top-level (no people profiles) [[Category:Colonial Settlers]]? This would allow for worldwide coverage ... or to parallel US Pioneers and Settlers/clarify we're talking about the 13 American Colonies:

[[Category:Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers]]

Maybe both? [[Category:Colonial Settlers]] as a category for projects around the world to add to their appropriate pages.

[[Category:Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers]] could be under [[Category:Colonial Settlers]] and be only for those pages relevant to the 13 original American colonies, and the various projects could add that category as appropriate to their relevant category/space pages (such as New Netherland Immigrants and Progenitors).

Text on the proposed [[Category:Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers]] could say something like:

This category is designed to help locate categories pertaining to early American Colonists. See the [https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Colonial_America Colonial America] category for additional information. Pages included below should be those specifically used to collect profiles of American colonists, pioneers, and settlers (pre-USA).

If that sounds ok, I can create a Category:Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers with that text & we can go from there.

Cheers, Liz

 

Comments

you have to watch the name...

colonial america would include central and south america, as well as the rest of north america, not just the 13 colonies that became the United States.

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Category:Colonial America already exists and is defined. It was mentioned in this G2G discussion as a possible place to provide information where to find categories that would have colonists of the 13 American Colonies, which are difficult to find currently.

All I am trying to do is figure out how to help people find such categories. If not

[[Category:Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers]]

What?

[[Category:Categories for Colonists - including Pioneers and Settlers and Administrators - of the Land Areas that became the 13 Colonies, which in July 1776 Declared Their Independence from Great Britain]] 

I think that I am not up to this task at this point.

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less clunky than my frustrated "please everyone" suggestion... would this structure of TOP-LEVEL (no people profiles) work?

Category: Colonial Pioneers and Settlers

     Category: Colonial American Pioneers and Settlers

             Category: Colonial Pioneers and Settlers, pre-USA

Answer 4

Colonial America seems to be the way to go, but considering the number of original colonists from England and the rest of Europe, wouldn't the numbers overwhelm the category.

Comments

I was talking about a top-level category that would not include people profiles, just links to where existing categories/space pages of such people could be found.

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I think this is fine. I just thought a space page would be a good place to collect the help information for finding / creating the lowest level categories where profiles are to be added.

Answer 5

After reading through the comments, it seems that "Colonial America" would indeed refer to both North and South America, which is probably too broad.  

I would suggest a high level Category: Colonial North America.  It would be nested under North America under Regions under Categories, and also under World History.

Under Colonial North America would be nested (in addition to where they are already nested) the existing top level category for each colony, i.e. Province of Maryland.  

Under Colonial North America could also be a high level category for Colonial North American Settlers.   

The individual Settler category for each colony, would be nested both as at present under the colony (i.e. Province of Maryland) and also under Colonial North American Settlers.

Commentary about how to categorize people within the colonies could be under Colonial North American Settlers.

One feature of this suggestion is that it does not distinguish between the colonies which eventually became the first 13 US States, and the other colonies which did not, so Spanish Florida and Cuba, French Louisiana and Quebec, and British Bermuda would all be under.Colonial North America.  In the world of those days, nobody had yet heard of the United States, and their interactions were based on other factors.

I would suggest Settlers rather than "Pioneers and Settlers" because the words overlap so much, and distinguishing between them (Pioneeers went but didn't settle?) is likely to be confusing.  I would suggest, however, that only the first generation to settle in a colony would be categorized under a settler category.  I moved from one place to another in Maryland three years ago, but I don't think that makes me a "settler"!

Comments

Wow. That's a lot of thought. But you're setting out guidelines to categorize the people and that's not what's needed.

I obviously am out of my league and withdraw the question.

For my own reference, if anyone is still interested, I'll post a different question inviting projects to say what categories should be used for early settlers. For example, you could post

* https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Maryland_Colonists

Or not... you could post what folks are supposed to use instead.

Thanks everyone for expanding my education yet again :D

Cheers, Liz

Answer 6

I would describe the proposed new feature as a "guide to Colonial American projects and categories" (that's not intended to be a comment on the name, only on the function). As such, I think it is best developed and maintained in Project space or as a Free-space page, not as a Category.

Although I have recently come to the disturbing realization that a lot of categorization in WikiTree has been guided by a philosophy that understands wiki-categories only as spaces for creating and maintaining hierarchical lists, that is not what Categories in a Wiki are designed to do.  If the goal is to create an organized guide to Projects and Categories, that should be done on a page where the content can be created and edited all on that same page. It is a mistake to try that with a category -- remember that anybody can put their content into a category by editing a profile to include the category. That could defeat the purpose of the list (particularly if people add pages that have privacy protection and cannot be easily removed). For that reason and others, the elements in a category cannot be managed as if they are an organized list (and it's a mistake to try to treat a category page as a list page).

Comments

Well, that had me asking, what is the proper use of categories? And in fact, Wikipedia says, hierarchic lists, and topics; use the starting page to define which it is. 

But do we have a malignant over-abundance of lists that ought to be topics?  How do we decide whether a category ought to be a topic rather than a list?

It occurs to me that many of us are very focused on individual profiles, rather than the context that they're embedded in -- the locations, the history.  But focusing on profiles results in categories which are undeveloped, and which are basically lists.

But it seems to me that embedding the profiles in their contexts is a huge strength of Wikitree. Maybe we could make a bigger deal out of developing topics? 

Answer 7

Don't know whether to close this question or not. It's not heading to a conclusion that fits what I was hoping to do, but it has excellent suggestions and food for thought.

I did finally figure out how to ask the question so I'd get the answers I needed!  Check it out: https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/419830/help-find-right-category-does-your-project-have-early-settlers?show=419863#a419863

Thanks everyone!

Comments

in that new question (which is getting the answers I was looking for!), the discussions have led to perhaps a better solution (or just a different option to a solution to a different problem that covers this one too)...

I posted [on that thread] the following suggestion:

I wonder if Category:First Families would work? Then at least all the first families/first citizens categories/pages (and any other project/category/page that self-identified as pertaining to "First Families" whereever) would have a place to go & be found.

That would also work as a solution for the related question: https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/418765/comments-wisconsin-pioneers-settlers-suggestion-categories

 

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and an update. Discussion in the Categorization Google Group = no for Category:First Families as a solution.

Answer 8

Kathy suggested Colonial America.  Its description is far broader than the 13 British Colonies that formed the first confederation of the United States.

Colonial America and other categories are under Category:US_History​  described on its page as

Historical Regions

• New Netherland

• Colonial America

• Thirteen Colonies

• New England History

• Louisiana Purchase

• Confederate States of America

• Northwest Territory

• Southwest Territory - "Territory of the United States South of the River Ohio"

• Washington Territory

• Republic of Texas

• Gasdsen Purchase

• Mexican History includes all categories relating to Mexico's territories 1821-1848

• Spanish History includes all categories relating to the Kingdom of Spain's "New Spain" territories (1492-1898)

Ethnic History ...​

Military History ...

Historical Events ...

People

• American Artists

• American Founding Fathers

• American Heroes

• American Outlaws

• Native Americans

• Native Hawaiians

• US Ambassadors

• US Pioneers and Settlers

• US Political History

• US Secret Service Agents

It would seem to me that the natural place to put colonists would be under the section of subcategories for people. US Pioneers and Settlers is subcategorized here as well.

Notice that there are some brief explanations on this page concerning what fits into which subcategories.  

This would be a natural place to expand the explanations of how to categorize groups of people living in these places in these periods of United States and pre United States history.

Other category pages have varying levels of explanation on the category page.  See the following examples:

Category: Sweden - considerable explanation 

Category: Region Nordjylland, Danmark (2007-nu) - somewhat different type of arrangement but also includes explanation of what the subcategories are.

It has been suggested that the help pages on categorization be rewritten to update them and make corrections where there have been some changes in how we categorize.  The categorization help pages would be another logical place to either put explanation on how to categorize settlers, pioneers, colonist and the like or put a link there to explanations on the U.S. History Category page.  

Similar links could be put on the pages for the U.S. History Project and the various other projects that cover colonists in smaller areas.

Answer 9

I guess I'm a little confused as to what is the problem we are trying to solve.  We want to make categories easier to find?  or information on groups and events easier to organize and find?

If it is the second, then a project might do the trick.  Not a new project per se, but sort of a highest-level, blanket project which could include all the existing projects - for organization.

For a name, we have the project, US Southern Colonies.  What about US Northern Colonies ... and maybe US Western Colonies (or Territories), too?

Comments

I expressed myself poorly in this one. I figured out how to phrase the question to get the answers I needed in this one:

https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/419830/help-find-right-category-does-your-project-have-early-settlers

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Oh, I didn't get that at first.  Thank you, Liz!

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We have already completed US Southern Colonies which started on East Coast.  We used maps to identify.  And soon there was a subproject of US Southern Colonies named Nueva Espana which covered territory colonized by the Spanish.

The key word was colonized.  Those early Colonies were the precursors of Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Colorado,Utah, Nevada, California and Mexico  When Mexico won its independence, the colonies were then  governed by Mexico.  As the Colonies progressed they won their independence either by a Revolution or the USA acquired the territory.  The dates they became states were established as the end of the project.. 

This project was completed at least two (2) years ago.  The first colony to rebel was Texas in 1836 and it was  Republic of Texas until after the Mexican-American war (1848).  

My point is all colonists are important to the nation we know it today.  

But it might need a project to pull the northern colonies together that could be US Northern Colonies, or something..  Wisconsin, Michigan, the Dakotas, Kansas, Indiana, Illinois, etc and others I have missed, Ohio, .  All are important.

NOTE  I do add US_History project covers  all states from beginning to current history as we know them.  

First you need the data,   then work on the Categories, I would think.