What is the correct LNAB and names for John Cleves III (b. 1490.)?

Question

There is a pending merge for John III, Duke of Cleves

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Von_J%C3%BClich-Kleve-Berg-1

merging into

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Cleves-28

I am hesitant to complete the merge because I want to be sure we get the name right first.  I think the distinguishing facts are tied in with what the Duchy was called and what ones his family controlled at his birth or later on.  

So far his last name is seen as Cleves or Kleve and then also as von Jülich-Kleve-Berg.

He was the Duke of Cleves and the Count of Mark and in 1521 became the regent of the  United Duchies of Jülich-Cleves-Berg. 

So if anyone has any input on the proper LNAB and Current Name fields for this merge please chime in.

Answer 1

Thank you for this question Erik. The Euro Aristo project recommends using patronymic names (house names) rather than territorial names, in order to group members of a family together with the same name and make them more easily searchable. We also leave out particles such as von, zu, van, of, de...

In the case of  Johann I would go with Kleve, as he was German (members of the French branch of the family would be Clèves). That is for basics, but the house name of the Cleves family is actually Mark (von der Mark, La Marck in French), themselves descendants of the Berg family if Wikipedia is correct.

You could also check this previous discussion (about more recent French Cleves): https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/346640/proper-lnab-for-members-of-the-cleves-family-

As you can see, it is hard to reach a concensus for this family.