Magna Carta Project Has New Member Openings

+18 votes

The Magna Carta Project Has New Member Openings

Does your family tree have a proven or as yet unproven connection to a Magna Carta Surety Baron?  Do you have a Magna Carta Project Gateway Ancestor (as found in Douglas Richardson’s Magna Carta Ancestry) in your family tree?  Perhaps the WikiTree Relationship Finder has indicated that you are a potential descendant of a Magna Carta Baron. Or maybe you are just curious about the Magna Carta project or have a love of Pre-1700 research. If so, membership in the Magna Carta Project may be for you.

What's required to join? Joining is easy. The main requirements are to have been a member of WikiTree at least 3 months, have a Pre-1700 Badge, and select a Gateway Ancestor (see the table [here]) to be Guardian of. Project members help develop, source and improve the profiles of project-approved family trails from a Gateway Ancestor to a Surety Baron. Although it is helpful if you have some experience researching pre-1700 profiles it is not required. It is a skill that you can learn and improve upon as you work with the project.  Nor do you have to be Pre-1500 certified but it will be of benefit if you are.  Membership in this project will also give Non Pre-1500 members the opportunity to sharpen their research skills and to gain the experience needed to meet the requirements for Pre-1500 certification and badging.

Being a Member of the Magna Carta Project

See this page for requirements. 

The Magna Carta Project is not for the faint of heart, but it offers a unique opportunity to collaborate and learn. Magna Carta trails will take you from British colonial immigrants in the New World (New EnglandEarly Pennsylvania Settlers, the Southern Colonies) to nobles in the British isles from the Renaissance and Reformation all the way back to the High Middle Ages. The research skills needed in each area and era are quite different and can present a challenge and growth opportunity.

Trails from Gateway Ancestors to the seventeen surety barons from whom they descended average fifteen to twenty generations. This means we have several thousand profiles needing our attention—not to mention their immediate families (parents, spouses/partners, and children)—everything from basic date and parentage validation and sourcing, to more elaborate dispute resolution and biographies! Fortunately, the trails overlap as we work back into history, so we can work together on those shared ancestors. No matter what your experience level is today, you'll be amazed at how much you can learn about genealogy working on this project!

Besides Magna Carta Project membership we also have Magna Carta Affiliate Memberships available for those who prefer to work at their own pace or who are not ready to take on the responsibilities of Project Membership and who may want to have the opportunity to develop stronger research skills.   

If this sounds like something you want to be a part of, let us know by replying to this G2G topic.

WikiTree profile: Magna Carta Project WikiTree
asked in Requests for Project Volunteers by David Douglass G2G6 Mach 6 (69.9k points)
edited by Liz Shifflett
I would be proud to be considered for this badge. As I have it presently, I have direct ancestry links to 10 of the 25. I have reason to believe there are two more to consider, for which I'm working on sorting out.

Hi Jerry! The Magna Carta membership badge is for project members, regardless of whether or not they're related to a Magna Carta surety baron. There are participation requirements for project members, but not for Affiliates. If you want to join the project's Google Group (which is how we monitor project profiles), you'll want to be an Affiliate. If you just want to show your Magna Carta connections, you can use a Descendant sticker for that. For more information about Magna Carta stickers, including tailored Descendant stickers, see [this page]. For more information about joining the project as a member or an Affiliate, see [Magna Carta Project 101]. 

Cheers, Liz

P.S. If you're related to 1, you're probably related to all; if you're a lineal descendant of 10, you're probably a lineal descendant of 15 (from all the trails I've seen WikiTree's Relationship Finder return, it seems that 2 are separate from the rest - and speaking of trails returned by RF, please see [this G2G post] about how to assess the quality of the trail).

edit - corrected a couple of typos that made what I was saying difficult to comprehend (what a difference "or" and "of" can make!)

According to relationship finder, I am related to all of the Magna Carta signers.  Is this even possible?  My tree is incomplete, but I do have many ties to early England.

I too would love to help documenting the trails of the Magna Carta Sureties.  I have connections to all but two.

Juli Martin Salzman
Would give it a try
Not sure how genuine my lines are, but according to the wiki relationship finder, I'm a direct descendant of 14 of the 15 barons listed, and a distant cousin of the 1 other baron, Geoffrey de Say,  listed.

Looks like I should be interested in this project. :-)
It appears that I’m descended from several surety barons. I’m not sure where to go from here.
I would like to join the project. As one of the statements says, I am related to most of them.

Hi LaNita! You're signed in on your Guest profile, so you would not be eligible to join the project. BUT you have another profile - Washburn-3710. Based on that profile, you still have another month before you'd be eligible to join the project as a badged member. But you could join as an Affiliate.

I tried to propose a merge of your two profiles, but got the following message:

LaNita Daniels has GEDCOM uploads that have not yet been processed. The profile cannot be merged until those uploads have been processed or deleted.

If you have GEDCOM questions, see if anything in [Help:GEDCOMs] answers them. If not, you might want to start a new G2G post asking for help.

Thank you!  I will check on this.


45 Answers

+8 votes
Best answer
I am already a member and among my husband's family this is how we relate to the Magna Carta Sureties....I do truly love this Project

==Magna Carta Ancestors==
:[ '''Magna Carta List''']
:[[Albini-39|William (Albini) d'Aubigny 1160-1236]] 27th great grandfather
:[[Berkeley-510|Baron Thomas de Berkeley 1167-1243]] 22nd Great Grandfather
:[[Bigod-1|Hugh le Bigod 1185-1225]] 22nd great grandfather
:[[Bigod-2|Roger Bigod  1144-1221]]  23rd great grandfather
:[[Bohun-7| Henry (Bohun) de Bohun 1176-1220]] 23rd great grandfather
:[[Clare-673| Gilbert (Clare) de Clare 1180-1230]] 26th great grandfather
:[[Clare-651|Richard (Clare) de Clare 1153-1217]] 23rd great grandfather
:[[Clavering-13| John (Clavering) FitzRobert 1191-1241]] 26th great grandfather
:[[FitzWalter-101|Baron Robert FitzWalter 1162-1265]] 22nd Great Grandfather
:[[Forz-1|William de Forz 1192-1241]] 2nd cousins 23 x removed [[Dunkeld-65|William FitzDuncan (Dunkeld-65) of Moray]] 24th great grandfather
:[[Hardell-1|William Hardel]] Nothing
:[[Huntingfield-11|William de Huntingfield 1160-1221]]23rd great grandfather
:[[Lacy-284|John de Lacy 1192-1240]]  26th great grandfather
:[[Quincy-226|Baron Saher (Quincy) de Quincy d.1219]] 23rd great grandfather
:[[Ros-162|Baron Robert de Ros 1172-1227]] 27th Great Grandfather
:[[De Vere-309|Robert de Vere]] 23rd great grandfather of Walter
:[[Vesci-14|Eustace (Vesci) de Vescy]] 22th great grand nephew to Walter son of [[Vesci-9|William (Vesci) de Vescy]]  23rd great grandfather of [[Pack-530|Walter Pack]]
answered by Andrea Pack G2G6 Mach 3 (31.1k points)
selected by Ken Pittman
Hey Andrea if I counted right thats a direct connection to 15 out of the 17 Surety Barons known to have living descendants today !  Great to have you as a member of the Magna Carta Project.
Hi David:  I do not have the Richardson's book to help with the trailing of gateway ancestors.  I am about to give up on Gov Berkeley.  Is there anoter Baron that I could work on please?
Hi Andrea,

Let's talk about some options.  I will contact you.

Hi Kenneth Pittman:  Thank you for selecting my answer as best.  Did you know that it was a Pack, Pittman, and Swope that teamed up together as pioneers in Virginia/West Virginia.... 

Walter and Ken are 15th cousins twice removed

Walter Pack Sr. and Ken Pittman are both descendants of Thomas Dymoke.


Working on the Magna Carta project is awesome 


+6 votes
Yes I would like to join the Magna Carta group, I have multiple gateway ancestors and more than half of the group are Great Grandfather's thru several lines, thank you
answered by Ed Trowbridge G2G1 (1.9k points)
Ed thanks for joining us !  I think you will find the work we do in the Magna Carta Project very interesting. rewarding and perhaps a bit challenging at times (in a good way).  But the project is a researchers paradise and you will not only have fun but will get a real sense of accomplishment researching and developing the profiles of these important historical figures.  You will find that your research skills and knowledge increase as you get into the world of researching medieval profiles and extend those skills to more recent times.  It takes a wide range of sources and research skills to prove a Magna Carta trail.  Don't worry if your not yet an expert, you will have plenty of resources and experienced researchers to help along the way.

Best regards and thanks again

David D
+7 votes

I am directly descended from all listed signers, and  John, King of England (22nd GGF)

I would like to join the Magna Carta Project

  1. William d'Aubigny (26 GGF)
  2. Hugh & Roger le Bigod (22 and 23 GGFs)
  3. Henry de Bohun (23 GGF)
  4. Gilbert & Richard de Clare (25 and 26 GGFs)
  5. John Fitz Robert (28 GGF)
  6. Robert FitzWalter (23 GGF)
  7. William de Huntingfield (27 GGF)
  8. John de Lacy (25 GGF)
  9. William de Lanvallei (26 GGF)
  10. William Malet (25 GGF)
  11. William de Mowbray (23 GGF)
  12. Saer de Quincy (22 GGF)
  13. Robert de Ros (27 GGF)
  14. Geoffrey de Say (23 GGF)
  15. Robert de Vere (22 GGF)
answered by Nathan Hall G2G Crew (410 points)
edited by Nathan Hall
Hello Nathan

Thanks for your interest in joining us in the Magna Carta Project.  We will get you badged and up and running here shortly.

In the mean time review the following page.  Let me know if you have any questions

Best regards

David Douglas

Hi Nathan:  I had taken the liberty of using the relationship finder between you and my grandson Hell Cousin!!!

Nathan Hall and Joseph Pack are both descendants of Edmund Lilly 1st.

1. Nathan is the son of Mary (Flowers) Hall [unknown confidence]
2. Mary is the daughter of Josephine (Sigman) Flowers [unknown confidence]
3. Josephine is the daughter of Robbie Jewel (Coles) Sigman [unknown confidence]
4. Robbie is the daughter of Robert Jonathan Coles [unknown confidence]
5. Robert is the son of Leticia Shepherd [unknown confidence]
6. Leticia is the daughter of Thomas C Shepherd [unknown confidence]
7. Thomas is the son of Jonathan Shepherd [unknown confidence]
8. Jonathan is the son of Mary Ann (Lilly) Shepherd [unknown confidence]
9. Mary is the daughter of Edmund Lilly 1st [unknown confidence]
<!-- it's the last --> This makes Edmund the seventh great grandfather of Nathan.

1. Joseph is the son of Robert Joseph Pack DNA confirmed
2. Robert is the son of Walter Pack Sr. DNA confirmed
3. Walter is the son of Winnie Henderson Pack DNA confirmed
4. Winnie is the son of Samuel John Tilden Pack [confident]
5. Samuel is the son of Samuel Augustus Pack [confident]
6. Samuel is the son of John R. Pack Sr. [confident]
7. John is the son of Frances Katherine (Lilly) Pack [confident]
8. Frances is the daughter of Robert Lilly Sr. [confident]
9. Robert is the son of Edmund Lilly 1st [confident]
<!-- it's the last --> This makes Edmund the seventh great grandfather of Joseph.

+6 votes

Good morning!

This is Claudia A. del Valle from Bahia Blanca, Argentina. I would like to join the project. Having checked my relationships to all the Magna Carta Barons, it showed uncertain relationships with all of them.

A street in my city was named after my grandmother Maria Antonia Arnold. As from there I became very interested in my American and English genealogy. 

So, I would be very happy to join this project. I might not be able to fully understand how this works, but I am ready to make mistakes, and be reviewed at any time! 


Claudia A. del Valle

answered by Claudia del Valle G2G Crew (690 points)
+5 votes
out of the 15 Magna Carta Surety Barons on the Quick Link. I'm related to 14 of them, threw my fathers lines, I would like very much to help and find out more
answered by Rose Jackson G2G Crew (720 points)
+6 votes

Hi David (and Liz) -- I'd like to join this group.  Very solid professional work being done here and I'd like to learn from the best.

I've started a discussion about a Questionable_Gateway_Ancestor and have been enjoying delving into the sources with those who have responded.

Thanks for your consideration.

answered by Peter Wetzel G2G1 (1.5k points)
Peter I've been following your G2G discussion with interest.  Happy to have you join us in the Magna Carta Project.  We definately have some of the most knowledgeable researchers on the subject of Magna Carta and medieval genealogy anywhere but we are always on the lookout for new promising talent.

The work that the Project does is fun but can be personally challenging.  But it is also an oppotunity to stretch the boundries of your research skills and expand upon your knowledge of medieval sources and history.  It's a learning experience for everyone that becomes involved.  

I will send you a private message with the necessary information you will need to get onboard and started on this interesting endeavor.  We will get you badged as a full member so you can join in on the action,  In the mean time read over the following information and be deciding which Gateway Ancestor you would like to take on in the position of "Gateway Guardian".  That is where everything begins with the work we do in the Magna Carta project and the base that we build upon.

*[ Magna Carta Project Main Portal]

*[ Magna Carta Project Membership Requirements]

*[ Gateway Ancestors and their lineage]

If you have any questions feel free to contact me or Liz Shifflett, our fearless leader.

David D
+5 votes
While exploring the relationship finder, I discovered that I am, most likely, related to all fifthteen of the Magna Carta signers. That would guarantee that I am a descendant of the Royal family of England.
answered by Howard Rankin G2G6 Mach 2 (22.6k points)
Hello Howard

I ran a line (using Relationship Finder) to Albini, Bigod and deClare and found that your potential line, in each case, goes through Richard Norcross (Norcross-12) to the Surety Baron.  Norcross is not one of the known "Gateway Ancestors" found in Douglas Richardon's, Magna Carta Ancestry with recognized direct ancestral trails to one of the 17 Magna Carta Barons (who have living descendants).  Norcross's Magna Carta line is as yet unproved but he may be in a category that the Magna Carta Project refers to as a "Questionable Gateway Ancestor".    Richard Norcross is not currently listed as a Questionable Gateway Ancestor" but it may be worth researching his connections if you have an interest.

For more information about the Magna Carta Project and what we do as members take a look at the following:


David Douglas
Hi Howard! I just signed you up as a project member based on your recent G2G question:

Then I realized you had already posted here. Had you and David decided on affiliate membership instead? Affiliates join the project's Google Group and help keep an eye on project-managed/-monitored profiles that are of interest to them but don't have any responsibilities to help the project achieve its goals or participation requirements. Let me know if you'd like to be a Magna Carta Project affiliate instead, or you can simply add the Affiliate sticker to your profile:

{{Magna Carta Project Affiliate}}

Cheers, Liz
What qualifies a person to be a Gateway ancestor?


That's a good question.  A Magna Carta Gateway Ancestor is an early immigrant to the American colonies that has a recognized direct line of descent from one or more of the 17 Magna Carta Surety Barons who are known to have had descendants.  There are about 240 known Magna Carta Gateway Ancestors that have been recognized and documented by genealogist, Douglas Richardson in his work, ''Magna Carta Ancestry''

The Magna Carta Project exists to categorize and improve profiles of the twenty-five medieval barons who were surety for Magna Carta and the profiles of the 240 proven American colonial Gateway Ancestors who were their descendants.  Our efforts also include documenting the lineages that connect them.

Please see:  [ Magna Carta Project Portal Page] for more information



+4 votes
The relationship finder has connected me as a direct descendant to at least three names on the board. I am a direct descendant of the Stuart/Stewart clan (King Roberts II/II) as well (through my maternal grandfather). Would be interested in participating if you have the room.  thank you
answered by Scott Orme G2G Crew (670 points)

Thanks for your interest in the Wikitree Magna Carta Project.  I posted more information on your profile about the Magna Carta Project and our two levels of membership.  Take a look at the information regarding membership and participation requirements and let me know if you have any questions. We still have membership openings and we will be happy to have you join us at either participation level.

David Douglas

Project Co-Leader
+4 votes

Liz I would like to join the Magna Carta Project

answered by Linda Barnett G2G6 Pilot (240k points)
+4 votes
i am pre 1700 certified and would like to become a Magna Carter Project Member id also like to become Pre1500 Certified here on Wikitree
answered by Al Scott G2G2 (2k points)
+3 votes
It appears that I may be related to at least 15 of the Surety barons. I have a line through the my great grandfather Turbyfill that goes back to the Plantagenants.
answered by Ken Pittman G2G Crew (470 points)
+3 votes
Thank you David for your help. I don't have the needed reference books apparently.
The Turbyfills, my great-grandfather's name, were supposed to have been with William the Conqueror in 1066. Is Willoughby-596 a valid connection to the Plantagenants? Thank you again for your help.
answered by Ken Pittman G2G Crew (470 points)

Hello Ken 

I found this on Sir Henry Willoughby, linked to Margaret Willoughby-596 as her father.  The following information comes from BHO (British History Online) a source that I have found to be reliable for the most part.  

"Sir Henry dying without male issue, in 1649, the title became extinct: he had four daughters; by his first wife, Elizabeth and Anne; by his second wife, (the coheiress of Darcy,) Catherine and Elizabeth."

Note that the information from BHO which agrees on the death date (1649) of Sir Henry WIlloughby, indicaties he died without male issue, but had (4) daughters, Elizabeth (1), Anne (2), Catherine (3) and Elizabeth (4).  There is no mention of a daughter named Margaret.  

citing: Daniel Lysons and Samuel Lysons, 'General history: Baronets', in Magna Britannia: Volume 5, Derbyshire (London, 1817), pp. lxiii-lxxv. British History Online [accessed 8 March 2018]. 


Thank you, David. I found a list of gateway names online. I am checking them now. The first three I chose at random and received feedback that I am a distant cousin to all three through the Duvall family on my end of things. I am going to check my id against more of these people this evening. Thank you again.
+3 votes
I am finding a relation to  Sir Robert De Ros. died 1227.

Married to Isabel, daughter of Scottish King William the Lion.

Appears to be via my Kendall line, Francis Kendall from Woburn, back through Jordan de Kendale.

New at all this. I have my Dads DNA but in midst of registering him with Kendall DNA project.


Joan Kendall ( Massachusetts)
answered by Ernest Kendall G2G Rookie (290 points)
Thanks for your post Joan and your interest in the Magna Carta Project.  The Project is open to all interested Wikitree members that currently are Pre-1700 certified (  Some experience with researching Pre 1800 profiles is helpful but not mandatory.

Thanks for joining Wikitree.  We are happy that you did.
+3 votes
Hello, I'd love to join this project. I've been researching my family history since I was a teenager. I have a special fondness for medieval ancestors. I have a number of Gateway Ancestors who descend from the Magna Carta Sureties. I'm also eager to help. Thanks.
answered by Maureen Deegan G2G3 (3.6k points)
We have you badged, set up and ready to go Maureen. Welcome to the Magna Carta Project !
+2 votes
I believe that I have them all 23 or 24 (depending on the genealogy of one) of the supporters and sureties and King John.

Most of my related ancestry is continental rather than colonial as on my father's paternal side, I am technically a first generation North American.  

I am proven Y to Curragh Chase to the de Vere Hunts as outlined in Burke's Landed Gentry of Ireland 1912 (even including a rare name in Ireland, my fourth great grandfather Baron Pfeilitzer) , so have all that can be harvested from the 15th Earls of Oxford.

I have excellent documentary and partial autosomal proof of my Cork Ireland ancestry that goes up to Maunsell-Gascoigne- Fairfax and on the way picks up Ann Lloyd Yale Eaton.

Additionally, I have some ancestry following Gary Boyd Roberts up the Mauduit line - Peter Lawford is a sixth cousin, twice removed from this family.  I had to revise his contention about Whitney's wife but the rest still stands

Finally, up my father's mother's line, I have Richard More, with several automsomal matches up that tree.

There are a couple of other lines through Ireland that may add to that when I can connect them.

I will be visiting Curragh Chase and Castle Hedingham and other key points in a trip to England and Ireland in September.
answered by Lloyd de Vere Hunt G2G3 (3.1k points)
edited by Lloyd de Vere Hunt
+2 votes
i have found many magna charta ancestors and would like to have the badge, can i join please?
answered by Raymond Nichols G2G2 (2.1k points)
Hi Raymond! Welcome to the project :D
+2 votes
Love to join in the fun. Ill work on a guardian shortly.

I know I have a few connections, but I think a couple may be by marriage, still trying to sort out some tenous merges
answered by Robert France G2G2 (2.3k points)
Welcome to the project Robert!
+3 votes

I would like to be a member of this Magna Carta group.  Being new, I've got a question. I've compiled an ancestral path from myself to William Mowbray through my Gray ancestors, then Frost, Rice, and Howard, to Elizabeth Woodville and Edward IV, then Ferrers and Mowbray. All generations sourced with Find A Grave and Wiki Tree, so it appears accurate. The only Richardson Gateway ancestor in my tree is Elizabeth Coytemore, but the path through her is longer so I don't reference it. I've documented this family tree, and can email a copy.  Thanks for your consideration.  Bud Warder-49

answered by Gordon Warder G2G3 (3.7k points)

Hello Gordon

Send me the trail between yourself and William Mowbray so we can do a quick look see.  Unfortunately, Find a Grave and even Wikitree (but some of the actual sources cited may be) are not strong enough sources to "prove" a Magna Carta connection or trail.  Your Wikitree family tree is not yet complete enough to run a trail to William Mowbray from your personal profile.  Once your family tree is more complete Relationship Finder should be able to plot a prospective trail.

If your Gateway Ancestor does prove to be (Coytemore-1) Elizabeth Coytemore Tyng then you very well may have Magna Carta connections as she is a proven descendant of several security Barons.

Since you have Pre-1700 self certified you are eligible to join as a Magna Carta Project member.  We would welcome your assistance in developing, improving and researching the trails between the almost 240 known Magna Carta Gateway Ancestors and their Magna Carta surety Baron ancestor,   You may join at one of 2 different participation levels.  I have left you more information regarding the two levels on your personal Wikitree profile.   Let me know what level you are interested in participating at and we will get you started.

Thanks for your interest !

David Douglas







Hi David,

I would appreciate your quick review of my family tree.  It is in pdf format, and needs to be attached to an email.  How can I get it to you?  

Thanks much for your assistance!

Gordon Gray Warder Jr "Bud"
I will send you my email address in a private message.  I will be happy to make a quick review of your Mobray line.  Please include dates of birth and death along with locations if known.

Best regards
+3 votes
I'm a descendent of at least 9 of the 17 surety barons.  I've read the guidelines, traced one of the completed lineages (whew), am a member of FMG, and am pre-1700 badged.  Maybe I can help, would be glad to try.  Thanks.
answered by Robin Anderson G2G6 Mach 2 (26.4k points)
edited by Robin Anderson
Hello Robin.

Thanks for your interest in the Magna Carta Project.  From your message I would say that you have a pretty good idea of what we are looking for in a Magna Carta member.  I am impressed that you have already traced at least one of your lines.  

We have two levels of membership, full membership which has participation requirements and the affiliate membership with similar goals but relaxed, self paced participation.   Let me know what level sounds good for you and we will get you signed up.

Have questions ? Contact me or Liz Shifflett
+3 votes
I am interested in joining the project.  I am possibly descended to a number of Barons through the immigrant Joseph Peck.  This is a line I used for membership in the Colonial Dames of the 17th century and working on documenting the two additional generations to Joseph Peck as a supplement (and Coat of Arms).  I'm interested in this project to help others find gateway ancestors in their trees.
answered by Sarah Krans G2G1 (1.1k points)

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