Do Scottish Women belong to Father's or Husband's Clan?

Question

In dealing with the Scottish, about half are women.  In assigning to Scottish clans, are the women assigned to the clan into which they were born or to the clan into which they married? 

Also, when assigning women to a clan, do they also get a tartan?

Comments

Being Scottish and of Scottish heritage, I know within my own family and as commented in the thread, when a man and woman marry it was customary for the couple to take the name of the higher standing clan. Sometimes therefore the man marries above his station and takes his wifes name, this has occurred in my tree just to make things more complicated.in modern times certainly amoungst us common folk we take the mans name or keep our own, the man generally does not change but there are always exceptions to the rule. Just a wee point, the only quick tip i have for ranking a clan is the more colours and strips in a tartan the higher the clan, hope this helps.

Answer 1

Hi Vic

The authority for the Scottish Clan System is the Standing Council of Scottish Chiefs (http://www.clanchiefs.org.uk/).  In summary: "Every person who has the same surname as the chief is deemed to be a member of the clan.  Equally a person who offers alliegence to the chief is recognised as a member of the clan unless the chief decides that he will not accept that person's allegience."  There is some discussion going on at the moment regarding the Equality Titles Bill introduced by Lord Crudwell, for England, and Lord Digwall, for Scotland, coming off the back to the change to inheritance bill but that will only really effect chiefs.

Thus women belong (not assigned) to the clan of their birth name and their position in the clan relates to this.  They may chose to adopt the clan of their husband  on marriage or, in some cases, he may chose to adopts hers (history is littered with this).  If she marries again she faces the same choice.  In I would think by far the majority of cases, especially if their is no title of land associated with it, she is likely to simply adopt the surname and thus belong to that clan.

Yes if a woman belong to a clan she gets to wear the tartan and she is allowed to wear the clan badge as a broch, generally worn on the left side.  This is likely to change if the change to hereditable title gets passed as there will be instances of women being Clan Chiefs in the future.

 

Answer 2

Clan membership goes through the surname, except when a married woman takes that of her husband's surname, and then on to her children. Children who take their father's surname are part of their father's clan and not their mother's and yes the women get a tartan. If they're single it's their father's clan, if married their husband's clan.

Sorry I forgot to add that there is a good page of resources for Scottish Clans on WikiTree the url is

 http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Scottish_Clan_Project_Resources

and also at

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Category:Scotland

Comments

Thanks, Billy.  Just to clarify, if a Mcfarlane woman marries a Macgregor, she becomes a member of the Macgregor clan and also takes that tartan.

What if she marries several times?  She starts out with her father's clan and tartan.  When she marries for the first time, she takes he first husband's clan and tartan.  What happens when she remarries?  Do it make any difference whether there are children from a marriage?

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Hi Vic,

You're right with the McFarlane example, if she marries several times the pattern remains the same for each new husband.

The childrenof the new marriage would have their biological father's clan surname and unless the other children of a previous marriage chose to "take on/adopt the new clan name" (Similar to an informal adoption with no paperwork.) which would need approval of the clan chief at that time,  they would retainthe originall father's clan name and tartan.

You do have to be aware that there are at specific periods in time that some clans would not intermarry due to blood feuds, eg Campbells and MacDonalds (Glencoe massacre)

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... and do not forget that some sons give up their fathers clan and adopt their father in laws clan name and so they change clan and their wives do not. Often these were the second or third sons who no advancement to Lord or Earl in their own line but through marriage they could gain greatly if they changed clan.

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Thanks for adding that Rhian, it had slipped my mind.

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You guys are awesome.  Thank you so much!  Great question Vic!

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Billy or Eugene, For women who marry, how many clans to we assigned them to?  Father's and all of the husbands' clans?

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They are only assigned the last clan name they had, or that is the way I do it.

Lots of information here.

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Rhian is right the women are only assigned the clan of their current last name.

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Great discussion on clan names for married women here - I still have a question that I would appreciate some clarification on...

My situation - My mother's maiden name is McLane and she descends from the McLeans of Duarte so that would be my ancestral clan.  However, for 25 years I was married to a Ross and my husband and I claimed Ross during our marriage.  Now that the marriage is ended, I have given his family back the tartans, pins, and other things we had accumulated that related to Ross because it was his family and not really mine.  But from what I've been reading, it sounds like I could continue to use Ross or go back to McLeans if I wanted to since the divorce - am I thinking correctly here???

And to add to the trouble, I've remarried a Kidd  descendant and I have yet to figure out what clan that falls under so do my husband - since I originally wrote this my husband tells me Kidd is Norwegian/Viking in origin, not Scottish so would not be clan so I just need clarification on whether I stay with my McLean's, or since I was Ross for 25 years do I stay there?  What is the protocol with divorce???

Answer 3

In Scotland, traditionally, women continued to use their maiden name even after they were married. 

According to the Lyon Court:

Who is a member of a clan?

Every person who has the same surname as the chief is deemed to be a member of the clan. Equally a person who offers allegiance to the chief is recognised as a member of the clan unless the chief decides that he will not accept that person's allegiance.

Answer 4

Why not their mother's?

Answer 5

The simplicity of a tartan speaks of the age of the clan, the more simple the pattern, the older that design. Some patterns of tartan are modern creations from the time of Robert Burns and Sir Walter Scott. These are Stuart or McDonald, although there are others, these modern tartans which have been worn the world over by dignitaries for all occasions. Family tartans are often loomed in the quantity for the purpose if it is a very rare design and can be very expensive and of high quality virgin wool, run on vintage machines that are housed in heritage buildings. Essentially, like everything, there are vastly different qualities of tartan depending on its use and provenance. Each bears very subtle meaning.