Who is Philibert-Gilbert Tremblay from France

Question

Philibert-Gilbert Tremblay lived in France. He is the father of Pierre Tremblay who married in Nouvelle-France, Guillaume Tremblay and Marguerite Tremblay

I would like to find better sources for this man. Could someone with knowledge of France's archives have a look at the profile...The biography needs also a major upgrade.

Comments

As I posted earlier today - The "A'Loys A'Gallien" is not an aka name and should be removed, it is just indicating he is a (son) of Louis, (son) of Gallien. Yes the two wives should be merged. His first name is not hyphenated. From what I understand is the name is not real legible and should be one or the other. The parents of Philibert are listed in the two vol. set of LA TREMBLAYE MILLENAIRE by Paul Mederic & LES TREMBLAY, by Patrick Chevassu. If you are going to say the parents are uncertain then you should provide references to it.

The two books are the main sources for the early history of the family.

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I thought the parents were from the book, but unfortunately the source is not cited properly and some work on the profiles would help making them look more credible. Without any access to the source and no proper citations, it just looks like another ridiculous attempt at finding a noble connection. I know I'm being too harsh, but, really... it takes a second look.

Not everybody has access to Chevassu's work.

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Name is clearly "Philebert" on his marriage record. I think we can move Gilbert to an aka.

Regarding the parents, now that they have been tagged uncertain, I would need a firm source to switch them to confident.

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Phillebert.  I would note Gilbert in the bio only.

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Was there ever a discovery on whether his parents listed are correct and/or how far back his ancestry listed is accurate?

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Ryan, the ancestry that is now on WikiTree has been verified through this work. It does not (should not) go further back. Unfortunately not all the profiles have been cleaned up, but we're confident they represent real people and the parent/child relationships are correct.

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Thank you I don’t have my tree going past philibert, so I have some extra work to do and go through everything. Thank you so much for your response.

Answer 1

Thanks for asking this question, Guy...

This person is an enigma for me as well. I'll try to see if primary sources are available, but... did you notice his ancestry? It goes all the way to a Grand Master of the Knights Templar, Bernard Tremelay..; stated on the authority of "My grande Ma. Therese Tremblay". With a source like this, who can doubt?

 

Comments

Never doubt what Grande Ma says :)

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It does NOT go back to the Grand Master, no one has provided any descendants (with documents) of Bernard.

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I'm convinced the line that goes to the Grand Master is ridiculous, but, unfortunately, it IS on WikiTree.

So, do you reckon we can start by removing any child of Bernard?

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The line is full of errors. Death before son is born, birth and death same year but married, etc...

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The problem is where do we cut? Chevassu is a good genealogist and I expect his research to be serious. But the line to Bernard unfortunately makes the whole look ridiculous.

Philibert's profile should be cleaned up and most of the history of research moved to a free-space page.

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I agree, unless someone has documented children they should be deleted.

Answer 2

I found what I think is the marriage record on pg. 88 on the right-hand page. However it is in latin.

http://gaia.orne.fr/mdr/index.php/docnumViewer/calculHierarchieDocNum/374806/1057:358178:371805:374806/0/0

Comments

Thanks Kyla,

it is the marriage and it is written in french :)

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On the marriage and death records I can read Phillibert but no mention of Gilbert.

On marriage record, I can read the name of girl as Jehanne daughter of Jehan Congnet dit Le Breuil (not Coignet) and Barbe Ca_om__

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oops that calligraphy threw me! haha

Answer 3

Here is his death record: On page 185, right-hand side.

http://gaia.orne.fr/mdr/index.php/docnumViewer/calculHierarchieDocNum/374521/1057:371441:372098:374521/0/0

Comments

Great Kyla,

added the source on the profile.

Answer 4

As Kyla notes in another answer, Philibert's marriage and burial acts are in the Orne archives.  I am struggling to read the marriage record, but I did notice that it seems to agree with what is stated on the profile.  Notably, Philibert's parents are not mentioned.  

In Before the King's Daughters: The Filles à Marier, 1634-1662, Gagné (p.47, under his wife's entry) states that Philibert was a plowman.  It seems odd that this man of seemingly lowly origins would be the grandson of supposed noble Gallien Tramblay, which is currently PPP'ed by EuroAristo.  I say supposed because that profile also seems to lack any sourcing that would definitely classify him as such.  Worse, the classification may be giving the lineage more credibility than it ought to have.

I recommend adding the EuroAristo tag to see if this can be sorted out.  If the Tremblay family was truly aristocratic, then there might be other methods we could use to source the lineage.

Comments

There are, however, two small clues indicating that the family was prominent in the village:

- Philibert is called "honnête personne" in his marriage record

- he was buried in the church itself (dans l'église), which was a privilege.

I have not see the book by Patrick Chevassu, unfortunately, but I would not dismiss it lightly. Chevassu is a prominent genealogist.

Also, the "laboureurs" (loosely translated as "ploughmen") were a higher caste of farmers (loosely explained).

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Greg, I have not seen him listed as a Baron, it was used as a dit name but I think it was because he owned one of the mills and was a big shot.  I cannot find my vol. one of LA TREMBLAYE MILLENAIRE by Paul Mederic, so cannot copy any of it. But if anyone wants a copy see: https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?author=&title=LA+TREMBLAYE+MILLENAIRE&lang=fr&isbn=&new_used=*&destination=us&currency=USD&mode=basic&st=sr&ac=qr  and Chevassu's book - https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a55_t1_83&qi=oqSQDU75Hxz7SmyTC7Zv18rnujk_1497963026_1:208:282&bq=author%3Dpatrick%2520chevassu%26title%3Dtremblay%252C%2520histoire%2520d%2527un%2520peuple  , Maderic also has another book (I do not have) - https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a56_t1_84&qi=oqSQDU75Hxz7SmyTC7Zv18rnujk_1497963026_1:209:283&bq=author%3Dpaul%2520mederic%26title%3Dpere%2520d%2527un%2520peuple%2520%2D%2520pierre%2520tremblay%252C%2520ancetre%2520de%2520tous%2520les%2520tremblay%2520d%2527amerique%2520%2D%2520edition%2520du%2520tricentenaire%25201957 , I do not read French so cannot quote any pages.

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Madame Isabelle Martin,

Croyez-vous qu'il serait possible d'ajouter ce qui suit a la page de Philibert? 

Philibert est mon ancêtre du côté France, et je crois que plus il y aura d'informations pertinentes comme celle-ci, plus vite nous pourrons rassembler la famille Tremblay en son complet.

J'ai un test Y-37 et un test Big-Y-700 qui me rattachent à la famille Tremblay.

Merci!

"There are, however, two small clues indicating that the family was prominent in the village:

- Philibert is called "honnête personne" in his marriage record

- he was buried in the church itself (dans l'église), which was a privilege.

I have not see the book by Patrick Chevassu, unfortunately, but I would not dismiss it lightly. Chevassu is a prominent genealogist.

Also, the "laboureurs" (loosely translated as "ploughmen") were a higher caste of farmers (loosely explained)."

Answer 5

http://www.unicaen.fr/mrsh/prefen/notices/11396pt.pdf

Answer 6

We can clean up the line using the good compilation by James LaLone, available at Habitant.org.