Clean-up of "Susannah of the Pamunkey Tribe" [closed]

Question

Now that the profile for Totopotomoi (Pamunkey-1) has been cleaned up, I'd like to remove the two people listed as his children.  I recommend detaching Susannah from parents Totopotomoi and Cockacoeske and merging her with Swann-869. Susannah of the Pamunkey Tribe seems to only exist in unsourced Ancestry trees and Internet messages. I have not found any contemporary record which mentions or names any children for Cockacoeske and Totopotomoi as a couple. Cockacoeske ruled the Pamunkey after Totopotamoi died.  She had a son by an English man after Totopotamoi's death. When she died in 1686 Susannah was most definitely alive, but the title of queen went to a niece, which also strongly suggests that Cockacoeske had no daughters.

Susannah was the second wife of Cornelius Dabney, Cockacoeske's English interpreter.  They had several children, and after Cornelius' death in 1693 Susannah married a man named Anderson. There is a lengthy and detailed article on the Dabneys (found at JSTOR). There is no mention anywhere of a Native American connection.  If Cornelius Dabney married the daughter of an Indian Queen it surely would have been noted in the colonial records.

Susannah wrote a will in 1722 naming two sons, Cornelius Dabney and David Anderson. and two daughters, Mary Carr and Dorothy Trice, and a grandson, William Anderson.
https://www.genealogy.com/forum/surnames/topics/trice/529/

Thanks in advance

Comments

Thanks for your work on this, Kathie. I support these next steps.

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Kathie, go ahead with your proposed action; the profile manager of Of-the-Pamunkey-Tribe-1 hasn't been on wikitree since 2015.

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For the multiple profiles of Susannah, aka Dabney and Anderson, should Swann-336 be considered the lowest numbered profile and the correct LNAB, or should a new profile for Susannah Unknown, aka Dabney and Anderson be created?  I believe I've found at least five profile in need of merging, just wondering which way they should go.

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I think she’s really Susannah Unknown, so creating a new profile for her with no parents, her two husbands, and her known children then merging everyone else into that good record makes the most sense to me.

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I agree that Susannah Unknown seems to be the best way to go given the current information we have.  I believe I have all of the duplicate profiles of Susannah are now linked to Cornelius Dabney-13, so all of the potential merges should be easy to find, but the PPP would have to be removed from Susannah Of_the_Pamunkey_Tribe-1 and added to the new profile of Susannah Unknown.

Should Thomas Swann be linked as an uncertain father of Susannah Unknown?  What about Betty West/Powhatan/Pamunkey/etc as the mother?

And lastly, Kathryn, would I be stepping on your toes if I created a new profile for Susannah Unknown, and/or do you think it would be wise to wait on some more input from other members on this thread?

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PPP has been removed.

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No one is stepping on my toes.  I stumbled across these people when cleaning up Native American profiles and have done only a little research to support detaching them from the wrong parents.  From my brief research I am confident that Susannah has no Native American  connections, no  Cockacoeske, no Betty as mother or sister.  I also think Swann is unlikely as a parent.  The Swann family seems to be pretty firmly located in Maryland. Thanks for working on this.

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Also, I proposed a merge of Thomas Pamunkey west into Totopotamoi, Pamunkey-1 to get rid of him.

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Susannah Unknown-432160 has been created and linked to her spouse and children.  I've also initiated merges for the duplicate profiles.

Should Susannah's and her husband Cornelius' profiles be project protected, as well?

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I protected Unknown-432160.

Not sure Dabney needs protecting unless he has disputed origins as well. PPP doesn't prevent spouse attachment; we just have to keep an eye on him.

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And there isn't any that I found  saying she was a swan

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Steve, the Swan theory (disputed) is addressed on her profile; she's listed as Unknown.

Answer 1

I'm sorry to say, when it comes to Native American princesses, especially of the Powhatan tribe, nothing ever seems to get cleaned up or disconnected. In one case, I saw some descendants defending their fictitious ancestor by saying that no, there's no documentation that this person ever existed, but "it means a lot to the descendants" to believe in her.

Comments

Wikitree's Native American project has a sub-project focused on identifying and addressing / fixing "mythological" individuals and connections.  Kathie (above) and Jeanie Roberts are two volunteers taking this on.  It's slow going but we are finally making some progress.  If you see more that need fixing, please bring them to the project's attention.  

Descendants who seek to maintain these myths have other options besides wikitree for their trees.

Answer 2

Regarding the five Susannahs:

Pamunkey-2  - "Thomas Pamunkey west" is a mythical person, no Pamunkey connection

Swann- 869   -  No parents listed, no evidence she was ever named "Swann"

Swann-964   -   This family lived in Surry County, VA. The name of Thomas Swann's first wife is unknown, it was not Betty West.  Their daughter Susannah married a man named William Marriott in 1659.  William died in 1681 and I found the following about Susannah:
SUSANNAH SWAN(N), born 26 October 1640. She died on 25 November 1660 without issue "Having been married to Major William Marriott eight months and twenty two days - and was buried at Swann's Point". Major William Marriott made a contract of marriage with Susannah Swan on 7 March 1659/60, promising to bequeath to her £100 sterling in the event of his death (Surry County Records, Book 1, p. 159).

if that is accurate, she can't be the wife of Cornelius Dabney;

of_the_Pamunkey_Tribe-1 -  no evidence of any connection with the Pamunkey

Swann-336  -   similar to Swann 964. 
 

Comments

Thanks, Kathryn. These seems to suggest that all of the Susannah's (wife of Dabney) need to be merged into Unknown-432160

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I agree.

Answer 3

Just want to post a big “THANK YOU”  to everyone who has worked, or who is working, to clean up these profiles.

Answer 4

Can you tell me how to access the article on the Dabneys you reference at JSTOR? I do not know what that is. I am a direct decendent. thanks, Robin

Comments

The article is actually attached to Cornelius’ profile. “Origins  of the Dabney Family.”

Answer 5

Where did you find she was a Swan

Comments

This is a very old thread. She wasn’t a Swan, she is Susannah Unknown Dabney Anderson.