Help with dead end on maternal line (Mt haplogroup K1a2b) filles du roe?

+2 votes
351 views
My mitochondrial DNA K1a2b is uncommon and the few matches are primarily French Canadian ancestry, specifically Antoinette Lefebvre, one of the filles du roi.  This was a big surprise to us as my mother has done our genealogy for many years.   Our most distant direct maternal ancestor is Elizabeth Turner b. ~ 1806 in Ohio. She married John Hunter in Fairfield County Ohio, had many children and later moved to Shelbyville Illinois.  We have never been able to find her parents via research or DNA.  Of course, we do not know Elizabeth's mothers given name or maiden name so we have hit a brick wall.  I have tried to find any descendants of Antionette Lefebvre who may have moved into the Ohio River valley at any point, but to no avail.  Is there anyone out there who may have information or suggestions on trying to break through the wall?  On Antoinette's descendants?  Thank you!
WikiTree profile: Antoinette Lefebvre
in Genealogy Help by

3 Answers

+6 votes

Hi Lisa,

Your link to Antoinette Lefebvre sounds rather tenuous: There are lots of people with the K1a2b Mt Haplogroup. Eupedia suggests a connection to Germany for that specific branch. And to try for a connection of around 120 years suggests at minimum 4 generations.  

I'm quite confused by this statement:

My mitochondrial DNA K1a2b is uncommon and the few matches are primarily French Canadian ancestry, specifically Antoinette Lefebvre, one of the filles du roi. 

One would normally not consider Antoinette Lefebvre one of your "DNA matches", solely based on your mitochondrial haplogroup:

In genetic genealogy a match is considered to exist when a comparison of the DNA test results of two persons suggests there is a high probability of them sharing a common genetic ancestor within a relevant period of time.

So I'm confused how you have jumped to her. Do your autosomal DNA matches link to Antoinette specifically as their most recent common ancestor (MRCA)? If so, that's a long way back. There's probably a closer MRCA.

Also worth considering is how you are connected to Elizabeth Turner: Is it probable that you have cousins with whom you share autosomal DNA that you inherited from her?

What DNA tests have you, and other family members connected to approaches have you taken to Elizabeth Turner, taken? What approaches to analyzing your DNA data have you employed? 

If I might suggest some approaches:

All of those can help you bridge these kinds of connections. 

P.S. First, you may wish to edit the title. It currently reads "filles du roe", rather than the intended "filles du roi". And I would suggest linking your post to your Elizabeth Turner, rather than Antoinette. 

by anonymous G2G6 Pilot (128k points)
+2 votes
Sorry, this is one case where you really need to find records for Elizabeth Turner to work up the tree, Antoinette Lefebvre has oodles of descendants.  Me included.
by Danielle Liard G2G6 Pilot (385k points)
+4 votes

Hello, Lisa,

I am assuming that the MtDNA test you did was at FTDNA, and many on your list of close matches have listed French Canadian ancestors, especially Antoinette Lefebvre, as their most distant MtDNA source, and that is why you are interested in making the leap to her in your tree.

 

First, JN Murphy and Danielle Liard are correct in their advice on how to proceed.  There are far too many possible lines of descent from Antoinette for you to be lucky enough to strike on the right path, assuming that your maternal line really does come from her. 

 

There is plenty of historic evidence for French Canadians in early Ohio, and for that, among many sources, here’s one you may find helpful.  http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/w/Canadian_Ohioans

 

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by Rita Carpenter G2G3 (3.8k points)

that's a nice reference there Rita.  laugh

Hi,

I am intrigued that everyone thinks they match with Antoinette Lefevre. I also match her DNA, but I know my ancestors do not track back to France.  They all track back to the UK as per FTDNA.  What about Abigail Shaw Bryant, b.~1624, d.1694, Plymouth, MA?  Is she not showing up as a match to your DNA as well?

If I could add a caution about the interest in "matching Antoinette's DNA" - the only way to do that would be to have a Full Sequence test result that exactly matches someone else who has a Full Sequence mtDNA test result *and* is a well documented female relative of hers.  That means not just matching the haplogroup but also all of her additional mutations.

And further, if you discover you match her exactly, you still haven't proved you're a descendant.  You've only proven that you have a common maternal ancestor with her, but that ancestor could have lived thousands of years before Antoinette.

The K1a2b haplogroup is very old.  From Behar's report, "Its age is between 5,100 and 13,900 years (Behar et al., 2012b)".  That's long before France, long before modern Europeans, possibly in Neolithic times.

Unfortunately, matching someone with mtDNA is usually not very helpful.  You will still match at least hundreds of thousands of others, and probably millions of others.  A perfect match does help make sure you're on the right track, and a haplogroup non-match conclusively says there's no connection within thousands of years (at least on the paternal or maternal line).

The Abigail Shaw Bryant that I posted about above is not likely related to Antoinette Lefevre as they appear to both have been born in the same era but with entirely different histories.  Abigail was apparently a pilgrim.  To sum up, I think many in North America are leaping to conclusions when they track to Antoinette without evidence.  I live in QC, and the fact that someone has a French Canadian last name is no indication of French heritage.  There are legions and legions of Irish and Scots here, many of whom are showing no connection to French ancestry for five the generations that FTDNA guarantees. Many had their names changed to French names when they arrived in Quebec as orphans.  In fact, my own great grandmother lied about her last name.  She told everyone her last name was Pitre, when in fact it was Pitts.  My elder family members have recently confirmed she lied about her age all her life.  I have also retrieved official government documents which verified her last name was Pitts.

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