Proof of Marriage for Elizabeth Beauchamp?

+4 votes
99 views
Hello again,

Continuing down Katherine's children, I've come across an oddity in her daughter Elizabeth. Medlands states that Elizabeth married Thomas de Ufford, information which is repeated on Katherine's Wikipedia page, and yet Elizabeth's WikiTree profile has her as the wife of someone named John Meriet. I cannot find any proof of this, and the only source on Elizabeth's profile is a Pedigree Resource File. Can anyone find any sources for this marriage?
WikiTree profile: Elizabeth de Ufford
in Genealogy Help by Amy Utting G2G6 Pilot (157k points)

3 Answers

+4 votes

It looks like the John Meriet is probably the duplicate of this profile  who married an Eleanor Beauchamp but from the Barons Beauchamp of Hacche, not the Earls of Warwick.

Not sure about the daughter Eleanor Meriet there is no record of her marrying John de la Warre, 4th Lord de la Warre in The Complete Peerage, Vol 4, pp. 148-149 and he didn't have a son Richard Ware, as he was succeeded by his brother Thomas.

Unfortunately there are no sources on any of these Ware profiles to be clear whether they existed or they did exist and someone has made an erroneous connection between the Ware family and the de la Warre family.

Unless someone has more information, I would disconnect Elizabeth Beauchamp from John Meriet, propose a merge with that profile and Meriet-12 and probably disconnect Eleanor Meriet and Richard Ware from John de la Warre, and add some notes to their profiles that they aren't related to John de la Warre, 4th Lord de la Warre and more research is needed to confirm their existence.

Sorry a lot to do to clear up this family.

by John Atkinson G2G6 Pilot (373k points)
+1 vote
In "Ancestral Roots," Eighth Edition by Frederick Lewis Weis, I found the following:

"ELIZABETH BEAUCHAMP, daughter & event. coh., b.  by 1349, liv. 1410, Whympston in psh.  of Modbury, co. Devon; m. (1) Richard de Branscombe,

"m. (2) about 1402 Alice d. 1426 widow succ. JOHN FITZ ROGER (261-36).  Could John Fitz Roger be the "JOHN"?
by
Line 246E.  A bit odd because Elizabeth's widowed mother also marries a Richard de Branscombe.

And Richardson's name is on the line.  But it's practically an old book now.  The version in Royal Ancestry (2013) under ALLYN loses the 1st husband Richard and only has the stepfather Richard.

As John said above, its likely that this Elizabeth is a relative of a different branch of the Beauchamps. This Elizabeth's mother I am fairly certain never remarried, especially considering that she passed away before her husband did and thus would not have been a widow.

+3 votes

I was trying to find out who this Sir Thomas Ufford KG was.  This site knows all about him

http://www.themcs.org/characters/Thomas%20Ufford.htm

but skips his brother Walter.  It also gives Elizabeth a 1st husband, Thomas Legge.  As does ThePeerage.com

http://www.thepeerage.com/p24465.htm#i244647

which gets it from Burkes Peerage 2003, which probably got it off the internet, as was its wont.

But it seems to think Elizabeth was illegitimate.

However, CP XII pt 1 p. 432 is persuaded about Thomas Ufford, citing the Ufford pedigree here

https://fmg.ac/phocadownload/userupload/scanned-sources/tpg2/pp271-277.pdf

pages 273 and 276.

by RJ Horace G2G6 Pilot (501k points)

fwiw, on my home tree I have the following:

LT. Thomas is confidently identified by Beltz with Sir Thomas de Ufford, who was elected a Knight of the Garter in 1360; (149) and it is certain, from the Wills of Robert and William, Earls of Suffolk, that Earl Robert had a son Thomas, who died without issue before his father, and left a Will. The Garter was at this period exclusively bestowed as the reward of military service, and therefore Sir Thomas must have been older than his brother William, who was scarcely 21 in 1360. Sir Thomas de Ufford was one of the brave companions of Sir Thomas Felton, when he was taken prisoner at Navarete on 3d April 1367 in the Spanish expedition of the Black Prince; (43) and it is suggested by Beltz that he was slain on this occasion. (-149) He married Elizabeth one of the ten daughters of Thomas Beauchamp 3d Earl of Warwick, and sister of Isabella Countess of Suffolk. (150) She died without issue before her parents, and was buried, according to Weever, with her husband in the Grayfriars at Norwich. (119)>

Genealogical memoirs of the extinct family of Chester of Chicheley

By Robert Edmond Chester- Waters

"Complete Peerage, 12 (1) (1953): 432 regarding

Sir Thomas de Ufford.  In the Suffolk account, the following

information regarding Thomas is tucked away in footnote i on that

page:

"Thomas is said to have married Elizabeth [Beauchamp], sister of [his

brother] William's 2nd wife (Waters, op. cit., vol. i, page 330,

citing Nichols, Topog. and Geneal., vol. ii, pp. 273, 276."  END OF

QUOTE.

My research indicates that Sir Thomas de Ufford was born 22 July 1332

[see Ellis, Chronica Johannis de Oxenedes (Rolls Ser. 13) (1859):

437].  He married Elizabeth de Beauchamp, daughter of Thomas de

Beauchamp, K.G., 11th Earl of Warwick, by Katherine, daughter of Roger

de Mortimer, Knt., 1st Earl of March.  They had no issue.  In 1354-6

the king paid 3s. 6d. for wine sent to him [see MSS. of the

Corporations of Southampton & Lynn (Hist. MSS Comm. 11th Rpt., App.,

Pt.  III) (1887): 219].  On his wife’s Elizabeth’s death, she was

initially buried at Campsey Priory, Suffolk, but on 19 June 1362, her

body was exhumed and reburied at Grey Friars, Ipswich, Suffolk [see

Gransden, Legends, Traditions & Hist. in Medieval England (1992): 284-

285; Weever, Ancient Funerall Monuments (1767): 487].  In 1367, by

command of Edward the Black Prince, he went on an expedition through

Navarre into Spain.  SIR THOMAS DE UFFORD was taken prisoner at

Navarete 3 April 1367; it is suggested by Beltz that he was slain on

this occasion.  Whatever the outcome, he died testate before 29 June

1368 (date of his father’s will) [see Beltz, Mems. of the Order of the

Garter (1841): 127-129 (biog. of Sir Thomas Ufford); Top. & Gen. 2

(1853): 271-277 (Ufford ped.); Waters, Chester of Chicheley 1 (1878):

327-336].

That Sir Thomas de Ufford was his father's son and heir apparent in

1362, is proven by the record of his wife's reburial which took place

in that year [see Gransden, Legends, Traditions & Hist. in Medieval

England (1992): 284-285].  There Sir Thomas de Ufford is specifically

styled "heredis et filii comitis Suffolchie."  This record published

by Gransden may be viewed at the following weblink:

http://books.google.com/books?id=_5TcZNIlSh8C&printsec=frontcover&dq=Gransden,+Legends,+Traditions+History+in+Medieval+England&hl=en&ei=UUIvTKesBMP7lwfBq9zOCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAA#v=snippet&q=Robert&f=false

Weever, Ancient Funerall Monuments (1767): 487 specically states that

Sir Thomas de Ufford's wife, Elizabeth, was "daughter of the earl of

Warwick."  I presume he took his information from her monumental

inscription then in existence.   For Weever, see the following

weblink:

pg. 487:

http://books.google.com/books?id=Um0DAAAAYAAJ&pg=PR13&dq=Weever+Ancient+Funeral+Monuments&hl=en&ei=t1cvTOSiMsH7lwfYr7m8CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CEQQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=false

Additional evidence of Elizabeth's marriage is found in ancient

Beauchamp family windows of St. Mary's, Warwick, which windows record

the arms of the various husbands of the daughters of Thomas de

Beauchamp, Earl of Warwick.  These windows are mentioned in passing in

Complete Peerage, 12 (2) (1959): 374, footnote h.  The evidence of the

Beauchamp windows and Thomas de Ufford's marriage is further discussed

in Topgrapher and Genealogist, 2 (1853): 276, which discussion may be

viewed at the following weblink:

http://books.google.com/books?id=EKhWAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA276&dq=beauchamp+windows+Ufford&hl=en&ei=tlMvTLvREMH_lgfQ8cWSCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCUQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=beauchamp%20windows%20Ufford&f=false

The Beauchamp windows are also discussed in Stapleton, De Antiquis

Legibus Liber: Cronica Maiorum et Vicecomitum Londoniarum (Camden Soc.

34) (1846): ccxxxv, which may be viewed at the following weblink:

http://books.google.com/books?id=49k_AAAAcAAJ&pg=PR235&dq=beauchamp+windows+Ufford&hl=en&ei=tlMvTLvREMH_lgfQ8cWSCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8&ved=0CEcQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=beauchamp%20windows%20Ufford&f=false

Stapleton falls into Dugdale's error of morphing Elizabeth de

Beauchamp, wife of Sir Thomas de Ufford, with her sister, Isabel de

Beauchamp, wife of Sir Thomas de Ufford's younger brother, William de

Ufford, 2nd Earl of Suffolk.  In actuality, two Beauchamp sisters

married two Ufford brothers."

Douglas Richardson, post to gen med, July 1, 2010

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