There's a big hole in my generation 6 and they're all Irish. [closed]

+10 votes
509 views
What are the best resources for tracing Irish ancestry? I've broken the back of the main task - entering all know direct ancestors - and am now adding cousins, uncles and so on. But those three Irish near-ancestors are annoying me since it leaves a big hole in my Ahnen chart.

The trouble is that even though I know (by family rumour) where they came from, there are too many candidates. Peter Byrne? That's like looking for Dave Smith. Annie Walsh? Begorrah, we all know one of those.

Any advice on sorting this out greatly appreciated.
WikiTree profile: Henry Byrne
closed with the note: CASE SOLVED - see last comment on original post
in The Tree House by Robert Judd G2G6 Pilot (134k points)
closed by Robert Judd
Rob Judd, I see you have done some good research with sources already. Did you ever find an obituary for your Byrne?
Was Henry Byrne Catholic?
No obituary, no death notice, no birth certificate.

He married Margery Norris in St Josephs Catholic Church, Hobart, Tasmania.
The problem is,there were many with that name.I would not know which

one was yours.

This site might help with the women: Earl Grey's Irish Female Orphans in Australia They have names, ships etc.

Thank you Anne. Another useful resource there.
10 candidates in Carlow is quite a challenge. What were his children's names? That often provides a clue.
I like the way you're thinking. Children were:

Maria Louisa, Mary Alice, Henry, Thomas Akers, Annie Maria, Ethel Sarah, Charlotte Elizabeth and Bertha Harriot (probably should be Harriet).
Closet baptism then is Petrus Bryne to Thomas Byrne & Catherine Hanlon 29/6/1820 at Tinryland, Carlow. No other Peter has either a Henry or a Thomas for a father, But, there is no Catherine in your list.
Thanks. I'll investigate that one to see if he appears in the 1851 census. If not he could be our man.
This one is SOLVED!!!

Heard from his great-great granddaughter tonight; she has been recording her grandmother's history and saw some differences, and was kind enough to send me an email to point them out. The data supplied was enough to find both a birth and a death record for him.

The big secret is that he was born in Kent, not Ireland, though I suspect his parents will trace back to the original Irish town. It also appears that he was hiding a convict past because his death record gives the name of the ship on which he arrived.

CASE CLOSED!! And my target to fill the first 7 layers of my ahnen chart just became that much closer to completion.

5 Answers

+7 votes
 
Best answer
I know it seems impossible and yes, Irish research is very impossible sometimes.  I find that working on Irish families is easier if you work on them as a family group per generation. Collect as much material for each individual, literally like looking under a rock but keep collecting. I broke two Irish brick walls using the FAN principles.

If you have Irish immigrants, work harder to cite every year of their lives, even the poor farmers or factory workers. Sources: Obituaries, burial plot records, taxes, SS forms, voting records, military, tombstone inscriptions, city/town/rural directories, petty court records, census, agricultural center, local histories, naturalization, etc. Reading church records, page by page, is a great way to find out if your relative were godparents or witnesses for other relatives who immigrated from same regions. True, poor or working Irish did not have Wills or many properties transactions but they went to church.

Another word about burial plot records. This is not Find A Grave. One needs to go to the actual graveyard offices and pull out the plot records (even pauper solo graves). Sometimes by snail mail if you can't go in person. Many times I did research for a family group and found another generation buried that were not living for census enumeration. Plus, burial records give you exact dates to work on when you have common surnames like O'Brian, Sullivan, O'Connor, etc.
by Maggie N. G2G Astronaut (1.3m points)
selected by Susan Laursen
I have a heap of details on FamilySearch but they all relate to his activities in Australia. When I go back to the UK there's no match for the DOB supplied by multiple family researchers who have spent 25 years on this tree. There are, however, dozens of Henry Byrnes in that time period.

I really need an idea of when he arrived, and from which port. Even then I'd still have to backtrace to his origins.
+4 votes
First i need a full name Exact date birth,there religion,where they lived and

who they married.
by Wayne Morgan G2G Astronaut (1.1m points)
Heh. If I had all that I wouldn't be asking. Their profiles are Byrne-3821, Norris-7438 and Walsh-7044 if you're curious. The first two were probably Catholic, the third married a Protestant but could be either one.
+5 votes
Speaking generally, findmypast is the best, but best is a very relative thing. You'll need to check rootsireland.ie and irishgenealogy.ie. Both the British and Irish newspaper archives. Cater your searches to include typical OCR issues. The Irish national archives. Flog google searches. Spend time in Ireland and get familiar with their accents for an insight into how place names and surnames might get misheard and misspelt. Get familiar with where to find old maps and different editions of those maps. Follow blogs for the latest updates and sources, https://www.johngrenham.com/blog/ and https://www.irishgenealogynews.com/?m=1 can both be useful. If the surnames not too common dig into everybody with that surname in the right area.

Not sure if that tells you anything you don't already know. Even with all those sources, if you're not chasing middle class ancestors there's still a high probability of disappointment.
by Mark Dorney G2G6 Mach 6 (65.3k points)
Thanks, I didn't know of most of those resources. Since they likely emigrated to Australia to escape the potato famine it's a fair bet that they weren't middle class at all.

There's a good chance that the two women were even shipped out from the orphanages to supplement the supply of marriageable women, which did happen around that time.

If I could get the parents of Henry Peter Byrne I could probably solve one line completely but I can't even find which ship he arrived on. I do know that Byrne and Norris arrived as free settlers and not convicts, it's stated on the 1851 census.

I'd love to spend time in Ireland but it's a bit of a hike from Australia.

"Spend time in Ireland" could also mean getting to know what digital resources are available online like newspapers, records, etc. For example, county Carlow is a region that you could narrow your search. It seems daunting, I know, but don't quit smiley

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/County_Carlow,_Ireland_Genealogy

+4 votes

Hi Rob,   Have you had a look at the Family Search "research" link from Henry Peter Byrne's profile.   It has another daughter 

Name Maria Louisa Byrne
Gender Female
Birth Date 20 Jul 1849
Birthplace , HOBART, TASMANIA, AUSTRALIA
Father's Name Henry Byrne
Mother's Name Margery Norris

Citing this Record

"Australia Births and Baptisms, 1792-1981," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XT6W-1X4 : 11 February 2018), Henry Byrne in entry for Maria Louisa Byrne, ; citing , HOBART, TASMANIA, AUSTRALIA; FHL microfilm 1,368,236

It also lists what might be his family in the 1841 census in Manchester, England.   Could the family have emigrated to Australia from Liverpool ?   There's also some petty court entries for Carlow which might refer to family members.

For Ireland in that time period you have to cast your net as wide as you can.   

by Maria Maxwell G2G6 Pilot (188k points)
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/#gsc.tab=0   can also be a great free source of info - good luck
Maria, There are eight children. I know that because I wrote the entry for FamilySearch. :)

Currently I only have my direct ancestors here, in most cases. I'll fill in the rest as the month goes on. I don't see a UK census record attached to either Henry or Margery.
+4 votes
If he arrived free in VDL by 1848 there is a good chance he was a soldier or sailor, so another possibility for records
by Elsie Gorman G2G6 Mach 1 (13.9k points)

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