Is Henry II a direct ancestor of Joseph Baldwin? [closed]

+4 votes
330 views

A comment was recently posted on the profile of Joseph Baldwin-264 which says that he is a direct descendant of Henry II (Plantagenet-1627.)  I've been in touch with the author of the comment, who is new to the WikiTree family, and may not understand the importance of solid, scholarly sources since she cited "...plenty of cites that show the Baldwin descent from royalty..."  Of course, I don't trust internet sites, and I indicated that to her, but who knows, maybe he actually does have this royal familial relationship?  I don't know.

Since we're all friends here and desire to assist each other, will someone who is knowledgeable with the Baldwin family and/or the descent from Henry II, please respond with something based on a trustworthy source?

I told this new new member I would send her a link to this post, so she could follow along.

WikiTree profile: Joseph Baldwin
closed with the note: answer received
in Genealogy Help by Cheryl Skordahl G2G6 Pilot (288k points)
closed by Cheryl Skordahl
Probably everyone in this discussion already knows it, but for the sake of people reading the discussion the relationship finder tool will often fail to find links which it can otherwise find. It is always best to make the gap as small as possible between the two people you want to connect. For example don't search from yourself but from some gateway ancestor.
Hi Cheryl,

I think you saw some of the comments I left on the Joseph Baldwin site. I mentioned that I have gone down that Jane Aylesbury rabbit hole several times over the past 10 years. It was Sir John Baldwin, the man who tried, and found guilty, Anne Boleyn, who has the Aylesbury connection. There is a possibility that Richard Baldwin and Sir John may be related, but there is no evidence at this time, and I have looked.

On the other hand, I have seen comments about no DNA evidence for these Baldwins. I oversee my brother's DNA. He is always willing to spit and cheek swab and is more than obliging to use his DNA for genealogical research; however, he has no interest whatsoever in even turning on a computer. I have had our DNA tested through Ancestry, 23&me, and FTDNA. I just got his Y700 results about a month ago (these have more to do with migration patterns than surnames). His Y67 and Y111 is a part of the Baldwin surname study with FTDNA. The administrator is Dann Devine, JD, CG. While our direct descendant is Henry of Woburn Baldwin, Dann listed my brother's DNA with the CT Baldwin's. I spoke with Dann a couple of years ago when I knew less about DNA than I do now. He manages the site because his wife is a Pennsylvania Baldwin. Dan told me that he listed my brother's DNA with the CT Baldwin's because they share an ancestor. He was spot on. Sylvester and John of CT and Henry and John of MA share Henry and Agnes (Kinge) Baldwin of Buckinghamshire, and most of the test-takers listed Richard (b. ca 1500, Henry's father or grandfather, I don't have the site open right now). One of those CT Baldwins (I think John) is also a great grandfather. So there is DNA evidence for these Baldwin connections, but my brother does not want to do Wikitree or anything else that requires using a computer. He loves hearing of the connections and discoveries, but has never been into this technology. I've listed my GEDmatches; however, I cannot and will not list my brother's DNA without him signing on to Wikitree and giving approval. That won't happen because he just does not want to deal with computers.

Of more concern for me at present is the lack of updating on some of these Baldwin pre-1500 profiles in England. Some haven't been updated in 3 to 5 years. I have tried contacting the some of the PMs to no avail. I am going to talk with some of my England Group mates who are pre-1500 certified and see if we can work together to at least update and enhance some of the profiles and add sources.

I have found that the women the CT and MA Baldwin men marry are more likely to have the 'royal' ancestry. Sadly, the patriarchy weren't very good about documenting women's surnames. Happy searching Cheryl. I know our paths will cross as we search (they have to) because we're all connected.
Thank you, Andrew.  A good reminder for everyone.

Carol, I sure do appreciate your comment above on DNA... and the comments on the Joseph Baldwin-264 profile.  

I really know very little about the topic of DNA, so it's a bit over my head.  But, from a personal standpoint,  it's really nice that Joseph Baldwin is our common grandfather, and to have you working with England Project to try to get some answers. 

Thanks.

2 Answers

+6 votes
 
Best answer

Jane Aylesbury, who is mentioned as the ancestor of Joseph Baldwin with the link back to Henry II is on WikiTree here and she is the mother of Sir John Baldwin but although he would seem to be listed as the father of Richard Baldwin (great grandfather of Joseph Baldwin) in some online genealogies, this is highly unlikely.

See the profile of Richard Baldwin for a discussion.

So any link back to Henry II via Jane Aylesbury seems to be impossible.  Whether there are other links is perhaps yet to be discovered, but if there isn't any link to a gateway ancestor then it seems unlikely.

by John Atkinson G2G6 Pilot (618k points)
selected by Jillaine Smith
Thanks for your insight, John.  I thought that would be the outcome.
+5 votes
If you are talking Henry II Plantagenet-1627 (1133-1189) then apparently not according to the Find Relationships.   And it does not appear that Connection Finder found a connection.  This is all subject to change in the event someone or many do find documented evidence.
by Susan Smith G2G6 Pilot (656k points)
oops, I certainly should have included the WT link in my question.  I added it now, Susan.  Thank you for finding it.

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