Born before [location unknown]
Son of Osbern (Cailly) de Cailly
[uncertain]
and [mother unknown]
[spouse(s) unknown]
Descendants 
Father of
Simon (Cailly) de Cailly
Died after
after age 34
[location unknown]
Profile last modified
| Created 18 Feb 2018
This page has been accessed 1,140 times.
Biography
Humphrey de Cuelai was a Norman born before 1066. His family connections are uncertain. He passed away after 1100.
Humphrey is said to be the son of Osbern Cailly which assumes that Cuelai and Cailly are the same place.
He is said by Foster in his Yorkshire Pedigrees to have witnessed the foundation charter of Binham Priory, Norfolk, in the reign of Henry I, although this appears to simply refer to someone named Count Humphrey.[1]
Research Notes
Burke's Peerage 1869 connected the Cailly family with Humfrid de Cuelai whom the Domesday Book shows holding lands in the Massingham area of Norfolk as a tenant of Roger Bigod.[2] Foster’s Yorkshire Pedigrees also states that Humphrey de Cailly held lands at Massingham and elsewhere in Norfolk but does not explicitly mention the Domesday Book.[3] William Sealy identifies Humphrey as a son of Osbern de Cailly who settled in England.
Modern researchers do not normally identify Humphrey of the Domesday book as a de Cailly. Loyd[4] and Keats-Rohan [5] state that Humfrid de Cuelai of the Domesday Book came from Cully-le-Patry. Keats-Rohan’s sole source on this is Loyd, who himself gives no real source for this provenance and may have been relying partly on onomastic similarity which is an uncertain basis, especially given the vagaries of medieval spelling and pronunciation, and partly on the fact that Humfrid de Cuelai was in the Domesday Book a tenant of Roger Bigot (an alternative spelling of Bigod) who held a Normandy fief a few miles from Cully-le-Patry, which Loyd appears to acknowledge is not a certain basis either: he states simply that there is “nothing impossible” in Roger Bigot enfeoffing someone who came from Cully-le-Patry, which strongly suggests that Loyd, rightly, did not see this as good evidence one way or the other. There is equally nothing impossible in Roger Bigot enfeoffing someone from another part of Normandy.
Searching on the SCRIPTA website for Norman charters mentioning Cuel* many seem to connect to a place now called Rabodanges, and once Culey-sur-Orne.[6] Notably, a Hunfredo de Cuelei, dated 1181-1220, is also associated with a place spelled that way which seems to be near Culey-le-Patry.[7]
The Cailly family are known to have held lands in the vicinity of Massingham and elsewhere in Norfolk in this period and in later generations, and that may lend support to the older view that Humfrid de Cuelai was a family member and that Humphrey de Cailly son of Osbern held lands at Massingham etc. and was likely to have been the same person.
William de Cailly, believed by Foster, William Sealy and others to be Humphrey's brother, was a Domesday juror in Cambridgeshire and held lands in Norfolk at nearby Heacham.[8]
According to Charles Clay, it is William de Cailly who is most likely to be the ancestor of the de Caillys of the Skipton fee (including Trumpington) and in Norfolk (including lands near Heacham).[8]
Sources
- ↑ Foundation charter of Binham priory in Monasticon Anglicanum: https://books.google.be/books?id=MPpAAAAAcAAJ&vq=binham&pg=PA346
- ↑ Burke's Peerage 1869, p.205
- ↑ Domesday Book entries and maps for Humfrid de Cuelai:
- ↑ Lewis C Loyd, The Origins of Some Anglo-Norman Families, Harleian Society 1951, p.36
- ↑ K S B Keats-Rohan, Domesday People, pub. Boydell 1999, p. 273
- ↑ https://books.google.be/books?id=xD9KAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA199. See charter 627 in Round's CDF.
- ↑ « Acte 9664 », dans SCRIPTA. Base des actes normands médiévaux, dir. Pierre Bauduin, Caen, CRAHAM-MRSH, 2010-2019. [En ligne] https://www.unicaen.fr/scripta/acte/9664
- ↑ 8.0 8.1 Early Yorkshire Charters: Vol.7, The Honour of Skipton, William Farrer & Charles Travis Clay, Cambridge University Press 2013, pp. 109-110, viewable at Google Books
- Burke's Peerage 1869, p.205
- Pedigree at Brompton Hall, Brompton-by-Sawdon, Yorkshire, England
- Notes Historiques sur Cailli, Normandie, sur ses Seigneurs et leurs descendants en Angleterre dès l'Invasion par Guillaume le Conquérant, William Sealy, 1895, privately printed
- Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire, N and East Riding, Joseph Foster, 1874 - Cayley pedigree
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C > Cailly | D > de Cailly > Humphrey (Cailly) de Cailly
Categories: Domesday Book
I still feel we need to make the documentary evidence for this profile far more clear and open, so that we can move ahead. That has to be our aim? If Sealy is the real source for the Domesday interpretation then can someone with access to his work explain what evidence or reasoning he used? Foster puts Humphrey in the time of Henry I, and cites a document from then, although it does not seem to be verifiable https://books.google.be/books?id=MPpAAAAAcAAJ&vq=binham&pg=PA346
It is important to notice that the top of Foster's pedigree is chronologically impossible, and so we can't follow it (and we aren't following it except in a selective way). The daughters of Osbern and Hildeburg in the French line lived into the 13th century, but Humphrey (alive in 1066 according to Wikitree) is in their grandparents' generation in that pedigree. That's crazy.
For Domesday, here are the links for the only Humphrey who is a real person described on this profile (but I don't think he belongs in the de Cailly family tree)... https://opendomesday.org/name/humphrey-of-culey/ https://domesday.pase.ac.uk/Domesday?op=5&personkey=48964
Please feel free to improve things. I have done as much as I feel able on the basis of the sources I have found.
Concerning actions, I am trying to post information and ideas for now. It is a complex web. I think in terms of my usual anchorpoint strategy it in any case might make sense to go backwards only the French main line, because then we would have something to build from. I am not sure however that I can sustain the effort too long, so it is a long term project (as usual!)
edited by Michael Cayley
edited by Michael Cayley
I have a question about the text above "The Cailly family are known to have held lands in Massingham and elsewhere in Norfolk a bit later on in the medieval period". That seems a stretch? Norfolk is too big to be an interesting coincidence. Concerning Massingham and Burnham later apparently means centuries later?
Heacham found its way into the possession of a slightly later Cailly, Roger, from whom Roger's brother Ralph held property there. Roger's son John, who died by 1207 when his wife remarried, is currently said to have held property Massingam among other places in Norfolk. I am not sure how strong the evidence for his holding Massingham is - I have not found a citation referring to a primary source. But what we do have is what appears to be pretty strong evidence that property near Massingham was held in the Cailly family from the period of this profile onwards.
edited by Michael Cayley