Riley Carr
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Riley Carr (abt. 1781 - 1865)

Riley Carr
Born about in Wadsley Bridge, Yorkshire, Englandmap
Ancestors ancestors
Husband of — married 2 Jul 1807 in Rotherham, Yorkshire, England, United Kingdommap
Descendants descendants
Died at about age 84 in Sheffield, Yorkshire, Englandmap
Problems/Questions Profile manager: Richard Oliver private message [send private message]
Profile last modified | Created 7 Oct 2014
This page has been accessed 466 times.

Biography

Information compiled by by Jane Lachs, 24 May 2001

Of Sheffield. Steel refiner, tool maker, patentee.

Riley was his grandmother's maiden name (Mary Ryley or Riley, wife of Joseph Bonsor and mother of Mary Carr, nee Bonsor)

Married Mary Goulding, 1807. Had Caroline bp 1808, Betsy Crompton bp 1809, Ann bp 1811, Caroline bp 1813, Esther bp 1815, Riley Goolding bp 1817.

In 1851, age 68, b. Wadsley nr Sheffield, had a wife Mary, 65, b. Bramley nr Rotherham, a son William 24, and three daughters Esther 35, Emma 29, Mary 27, all grown up but unmarried. 1841, Betsy is also at home, but William isn't.

May have had a brother Joseph.

Information added:

by Richard Oliver (2nd great-grandson) 6th Dec 2018

This profile, created some seven years ago by "Jane Lachs", was found in "orphan" status and duly adopted by me as Profile Manager.


by Sidney Oldall Addy, historian, in monograph "The Carrs of Southey and Dublin" published by Hunter Archaeological Society c. 1929

"One of the many children of Thomas Carr, who may be called the last of the Carrs of Wadsley Bridge, was Riley Carr of Sheffield (1781-1865), steel refiner and patentee. About 1863 the present writer remembers once seeing him in Glossop Road - a tall arresting figure dressed in black, with a white ruffled shirt. He was very particular about these ruffles, and would only allow one woman to get them up. The ruffled shirt and white necktie are a striking feature of his portrait by J.C.B. in 1836. He was then fifty-five years of age. He was known among his acquaintance as "handsome Carr". He knew and said that he was of good birth. He built the houses opposite Adelaide Place in Glossop Road, in one of which he died, but he had other houses in Sheffield in which he might have lived. He was diligent with his business. He married Mary Golden, who was the mother of his large family. The writer's wife was one of his grand-daughters, and the portrait of Riley Carr, with that of his wife, are in her possession"


comment by Jocelyn Oliver (great-grandson) c. 1975

"My mother's grandfather was given, not lent, £80,000 by his friend Thomas Bonsor Crompton to start his steel works. No, it wasn't an "illicit relationship", but one of those harmless male Victorian friendships which caused no-one to lift an eyebrow. When he was very old, my grandfather's wicked elder brother got at him , said my grandfather was no good, and (Jacob and Esau) got willed the great part of the money. But great grandpop found him out: "I shall alter my will at once!", he said. "You look tired, Father", said my grandfather. "At least leave it till the morning". Whereupon, Great-grand-pop made a hearty meal of salmon washed down with milk, had a stroke in the night, and died - richly deserved, for indulging in so disgusting a mixture.

Even so, my mother's brothers got about £100,000 each, and Mother and her sister £10,000 each. Unfortunately, my father fancied himself as a business expert....."


comment by Richard Oliver (great-great-grandson) 1996:

The above is mostly another lamentation by my father about not having been born rich due to skulduggery among his ancestors and incompetence on the part of his parents; also (another of his many obsessions) an assurance that his great-grandpop was not queer.

From what I have established to date the following comments may be added:

(1) Riley Carr died of heart disease aged 84. I do not know if it was sudden or slow; however, the tale of the salmon-and-milk supper (and the consequently unaltered will) seems to have been enshrined in Carr family lore - it is mentioned also in one of Jocelyn Oliver's 1944 letters home from India.

(2): Riley's son Riley Golden Carr, my great-grandpa, did indeed have two brothers - William and Henry. Was one of them a snake-in-the-grass?

As regards the apocryphal fortune, it is worth noting the following: on the back of a memorial portrait engraving, now in possession of my first cousin Susan Hirst, is the following hand-written inscription: 'Thomas Bonsor Crompton of Farnworth, Bolton, Lancs, born 20th May 1792, died 8th September 1858, cousin of Riley Carr, who presented to him (RC) twenty thousand pounds'. So, he was actually a kinsman, not just a friend; Riley's mother was Mary Bonsor. There seems to be a discrepancy over the amount of money involved. However, the inscription has been tampered with and altered, so who knows what the truth was...?

Thomas Bonsor Crompton (see his WikiTree profile) was a first cousin to Riley Carr, son of his mother's sister Elizabeth Bonsor. He was remembered for many years as a benefactor to Riley, and 'Crompton' appears as a decorative 'middle name' for not a few of Riley's descendants. As Thomas was considerably younger than Riley, it seems likely that the benefaction took the form of later 'forgiving' a debt Riley owed to the Crompton family, perhaps a business loan provided by Thomas's father John Crompton. Who knows, now?


further comment 1997:

From Riley's 19-page will, and from the Census returns so far studied, it would seem that Riley Golden Carr was in fact the firstborn son. It is thus clear that he had no "wicked elder brother", as claimed; Henry and William were, respectively, three and ten years his junior. Nevertheless, it is also clear that William was greatly preferred as the heir to Riley's Senior's business, even though he is required to pay for it out of his inheritance. Why? Perhaps he was seen as better qualified to keep it running well; he is enjoined to "continue to employ" his two brothers for at least a year, if they are willing, at the same wages. And it is more interesting still that William, the pet brother who inherited the Bailey Lane Works, died only five years after his father. Who took on the business then? Not Riley Junior, who by this time (1870) had married a young wife, retired and was busy breeding.

Sources

  • England Marriages 1538-1973 : Riley Carr & Mary Goulding, married 2 Jul 1807, Rotherham, Yorkshire
  • GRO INDEX : Deaths Sep 1865 Carr Riley Ecclesall B. 9c 167
  • Research by Richard Oliver (2nd great-grandson)




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DNA Connections
It may be possible to confirm family relationships with Riley by comparing test results with other carriers of his Y-chromosome or his mother's mitochondrial DNA. However, there are no known yDNA or mtDNA test-takers in his direct paternal or maternal line. It is likely that these autosomal DNA test-takers will share some percentage of DNA with Riley:

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Riley Carr Image 1



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