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Alexander William Douglass (abt. 1758 - abt. 1790)

Alexander William Douglass
Born about in prob. Albemarle Co., Virginiamap [uncertain]
Son of and [mother unknown]
[sibling(s) unknown]
Husband of — married about 1778 (to 1790) in Crab Orchard Creek, Kentucky Co., Virginiamap
Descendants descendants
Died about in Madison County, Kentuckymap
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Profile last modified | Created 2 Jun 2016 | Last significant change: 9 Jan 2022
22:36: Chet Ogan posted a comment on the page for Alexander William Douglass (abt.1758-abt.1790) [Thank Chet for this]
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[Evidence from Madison Co., KY, historians and a study of the Draper Papers has shown that the Moore family came from New Jersey to North Carolina, where Jane (Moore) Douglass' parents William Moore and Margaret Hudspeth married in 1745 (Granville, NC). My DNA goes back to other Hudspeth descendants. Please read the biographies of both Alexander W Douglass [ abt 1758- 1790] and William Moore [abt 1719-1799] [Moore-21813]. If you doubt this, check the sources we researched- I once believed William Moore and Alexander Douglass came to Kentucky from PA. The information in this section Ancestors and Descendants of Alexander Walker Glenn and Jane Austin is not correct whereas many other sections of that book are correct. Chet Ogan]

Alexander W Douglass was probably born in Albemarle Co., VA 1758 to Samuel H Douglass and Mary _____. He married 1778 in Crab Orchard Park, Kentucky County, Virginia, Jane Moore (b.1762 in Surry or Granville, NC-d Perche Creek, Boone Co., MO), daughter of William Moore (1719-1799) and Margaret Hudspeth (1725-1808). Alexander died 1790 and Jane married William Glenn about 1792. They were the parents of Alexander Walker Glenn, b 1799.

Biography

Alexander William Douglass. The Madison Co., KY, tax records show that Jane Douglass paid taxes on May 11, 1790, so her husband, Alexander Douglass, died before that. She is referred to as Jane Glenn on Nov. 6, 1792, in the court records when she, George Douglass, and John Snoddy asked that a certificate be granted to them for obtaining letters of administration on the estate of Alexander Douglass, deceased (2). His property was accounted by the court in 1794 (3).


from: Military History of Kentucky FIRST PUBLISHED IN JULY, 1939 -- On October 15, 1778, Capt. James Harrod with sixteen men went to Missouri for a supply of salt. They proceeded from Harrodsburg to the Falls of the Ohio where they obtained a keelboat, went down the Ohio River and up the Mississippi to the salt works on the Spanish side. [Draper MSS 12CC65] Here a quantity of salt was purchased and the hazardous return trip begun and completed in December. Those who made the trip with Captain Harrod were Alex Douglass, William Williams, James Pruett, Samuel Douglass, John Phillips, Roswell Stevens, James Millican, Edward Hammond, Wilson Mattox, John Shelp, Joseph Collins,William Menifee, John Isaacs, Samuel Dennis, and one other man whose name was not recorded.[Draper MSS 12CC105]


Notes for Alexander W DOUGLASS l. Although there may be no proof available, it appears that Alexander Douglass was a son of Samuel Douglass, who may have been a brother of James Douglass a surveyor for the Transylvania Land Company. Samuel and Alexander Douglass were among the first settlers in Kentucky, settling on land along Muddy Creek, where Samuel built the first whiskey making machine (still) in Kentucky. 2. Information acquired from Gerald Tudor, a Madison Co., Historian, indicates that Alexander and Jane Douglass latter settled on Crab Orchard Run, near Dick's River, in what was to become Lincoln Co., Kentucky. At least some of their children were born here. Younger ones may have been born here after it became Madison Co., KY. 3. Email note Gerald Tudor to Frank Slaven, May 2001. Frank, regarding Alexander Douglass' survey. I think that I copied for you what was in the Jillson Book, on his surveys, one being on White Lick and the other on Crab Orchard Run. Crab Orchard Run, wherever it was, was probably on the waters of Dick's River as the River ran through the area of Crab Orchard. [Near Dick's River headwaters] White Lick was on the waters of Paint Lick Creek that emptied into the Kentucky River. Garrard Co., is almost divided by a central ridge running south to north that divides the waters of Dick (Dix) and Kentucky Rivers. That portion east of the ridge, came from Madison Co. 4. Email Chet Ogan to Gerald Tudor. Now, I have only two early surveys for an Alexander Douglass, one being on the waters of White Lick Creek, which is in present day Garrard Co., KY, but would have been in Madison at the time of the above written instrument from Allen. The other survey was recorded as in 1780, I believe, on Crab Orchard Run. The early Crab Orchard of Lincoln Co., is still in that County and immediately south of Garrard Co. So, it is reasonable to think that Crab Orchard Run was a stream that ran either toward or from the Crab Orchard Community but has since been renamed as many of the smaller streams were through the years. A Crab Orchard Run would most likely be closer to the White Lick Creek that Alexander also had a survey. Now, these two surveys are extracted from the original surveys held by the Sec. of State’s office in Frankfort, Kentucky. 5. Notes from Earl Deveney. He is certain that Alexander W. Douglass came from Lord Archibald Douglass's line. Here is what he has: Archibald Douglass, son of Lord Archibald Douglass was born about 1695 in Scotland. He died 26 November in Pennsylvania. He married Jean. They had a son Thomas who was born about 1722. Thomas married Joyce Hudson on August 4, 1763. No other information. Second son John was born in 1724; he died in 1788 [Alexander?]: no other information. Third son Archibald was born in 1726; no other information. Fourth son George was born in 1728; no other information. Daughter Mary (Marry) was born in 1730 and married George Boyd, II. who was born in 1715 and died 1763. Daughter Jane was born in 1733 and died in 1777; married Gabriel Davis. Daughter Margaret married first to Patrick Carrigan; married second to John Wilson. Daughter Ann born 1737 married about 1751 to Patrick Boyd. Samuel and Alexander W Douglass probably do not descent from Lord Archibald Chet Ogan Bold text 6. Notes from Earl E. Deveney. York, PA. In a book called "A Dictionary of Scottish Emigrants to the USA", compiled and edited by Donald Whyte F.S.A. Scot, L.H.G., 1972, Magna Carta Book Co., Balto, Maryland. DOUGLASS, Alexander, aged 52, from Perthshire, Scotland, to Philadelphia Pa., on the ship FRIENDSHIP, ex Leith, 9 May 1775. Labourer. (T.47/12) 1367. 7. Note from Chet Ogan. ********Note 6 does not fit the current information we have on Alexander W. Douglass. ****Added information by Nancy Douglas shows more detailed information on Lord Archibald Douglass and his voyage to America. Samuel Douglass, [Douglass-3182| Samuel Douglass]] the father of Alexander Douglass was not a son of Lord Archibald Douglass. [Since this, Louise Hudspeth has found more recent documented information which confirms that Wiliam MOORE married Margaret Hudspeth, not Margaret Wright. Chet Ogan] 8. William Glenn was a friend of Alexander Douglass. It is likely that Alexander Douglass came to Kentucky with William Glenn. (Spencer and Foss. 1973.) 9. Witnesses to John Ogan's Grant Deed and betrothal to Mary Polly Douglass were as follows: William Douglass, James Douglass, Martin Douglass, John Ogan, Dudley Farris, and William Todd. Witnessed to James McCormick and John Moore. The betrothal was consented by William Glenn. Dudley Faris and James McCormack were likely close neighbors and /or close friends of Jane Moore Douglass, they witnessed other legal documents for this family 10. The Douglass’s may be brothers of Mary Polly Douglass or brothers of her father, Alexander W. Douglass. 11. The Estate of Alexander Douglass was appraised on 23 December 1792 by George Adams, Robert Burnsides, and Michal Farris. Tests. taken by Will Irvine. 12. The Estate was returned and received into the Madison County Court records Tuesday 4 November 1794. Tests Will Irvine. 13. The accounting of the estate indicates he was probably a farmer.

******** This following has proven to not be correct.*******14. Email from Mark WIggins Subject: Alexander Douglass!! YIPPEE!!! From: Mark Wiggins Organization: Wiggins, INC. Hello Mary, I hope you are ok --- not having heard from you for a while I just hoped you were well. Did you receive my last email? I know they do go astray sometimes. Anyways --- why the subject heading of Alexander Douglass? You are wondering ... I went into town today so I decided to call in at the library and check out the emigration for you ... this is what I found. In a book called "A Dictionary of Scottish Emigrants to the USA" compiled and edited by Donald Whyte F.S.A. Scot, L.H.G., 1972. Guess who I found????? DOUGLAS, Alexander, aged 52, from Perthshire to Philadelphia PA, on FRIENDSHIP, ex, Leith, 9 May 1775. Labourer (T. 47/12) 1367. I believe Friendship was the ship he sailed on and Leith was the port of departure. The T. 47/12 + Treasury Records from the Public Office in London. The 1367 is the entry number they just run consecutively, i.e. the next name in the list was 1368. At the beginning of the book was this forward: This book is dedicated to the memory of all the Scottish Emigrants, who, in contributing to the making of America, glorified their native land. I was so pleased to find this, it was the only Alexander listed, so hopefully he is yours. I hope you are pleased as I am sure you will be. -Mark Wiggins.


From Frank Slaven:

Marriages (1) spouse: Jane MOORE (AFN: 5DWJ-0LP ) marriage: ABT 1778 Crab Orchard Creek, Kentucky, Virginia

Show children (7) Submission submitter: fhslaven2767967 submitter: fhslaven2767966 submission date: 04 May 2003 submission id: MM9T-732 person count: 3,317 Notes Please see NOTES for Samuel H. Douglass, and William Moore.

FROM THE FRENCH TIPTON PAPERS, vol 1, page 272 (Samuel the father of Alexander). Sam Douglas, of Scotch descent, came from Virginia to Madison County, Kentucky. Son John, born in Madison County made wooden moldboards [the wedge-shaped piece of a plow] up to 1850. Alex (Alexander), John’s brother, invented machinery for steam whiskey, and made such whiskey at the old Douglass/Weddle Mill on Muddy Creek, said to be the first in the State (Kentucky). John is the father of Alfred and Allen Douglass.

FROM "BACK OF THE CANE" By Fredrick Simpson. In October of 1778 Samuel and Alexander Douglass were members of a party led by James Harrod which set off down the Ohio River toward the saltworks at Kaskaskia on the Mississippi River. Before this there was no salt in Kentucky. James Harrod's mother was a Moore, and Alexander Douglass wife was Jane Moore, providing us with the possibility that their trip to Kaskaskia for salt was a family project.

FROM “THE REGISTER OF THE KENTUCKY STATE HISTORICAL SOCIETY” Vol 21, 1923 FRANKFORT, KENTUCKY. October 19 1780 - Alexander - - - -? Met with the Virginia Land Commission, at Logan's Fort.

FROM “Benjamin Logan, Kentucky Frontiersman”, by Charles Gano Talbert (1976), Page 82: October 13, 1779, was a great day for the people in and around St. Asaph's. It was there that the Board of Commissioners, appointed by the Virginia government to hear evidence regarding land claims and to award certificates of entitlement, began its meetings. St. Asaph's was the logical place for the commission to start it's work, as it was the County Seat . Page 87, The land commissioners appointed for Kentucky County [VA] were William Fleming, Edmund Lyne, James Barbour, and Stephen Trigg. Subsequent sessions were held at Harrodsburg, Boonesborough, Bryan's Station, and the Falls. Pages 70 and 71 The tedious months that had been spent inside the crowded forts at St. Asaph's and at Harrodsburg came to an end for many people in 1779. Among the first to leave Logan's Fort was the family of William Whitley, who built a station of his own at the Walnut Flat, probably less than five miles from Logan's in the direction of Crab Orchard. This event occurred in January of 1779. These bits of historical information surely would apply to Alexander W's, as well as Jane's Moore families. This supports the date and place contained in our Douglass genealogy records for the birth of William Henry Douglass, on 19 April 1779. But, it also provides a question about the estimated date and location of Alexander and Jane’s marriage, making it a possibility that they were married at St. Asaph's (Logan's Station) or at their place near Orchard Creek, according to the Indian raids and activities at the time of that event. FROM - "BACK OF THE CANE" by Fredrick Simpson. Alexander Douglass settled below the mouth of Crab Orchard Creek, on Dick's River in April of 1779. FROM - LINCOLN COUNTY, VIRGINIA LAND RECORDS. Alexander Douglass, 10-21-1780, 400 acres on Crab Orchard Run, Book 1, page 86. Alexander Douglass, 10-19-1780, 400 acres on Dick's River. Page A 180. We read on page 16 of Charles Talbert’s book - On April 15, 1775 a group of surveyors, and adventurers were ready to leave the Holston River settlement for Kentucky. Their leader was John Floyd, a deputy surveyor of Fincastle County who had surveyed in Kentucky in the summer of 1774. In the group were about thirty surveyors, one of which, though not individually mentioned was probably James Douglass, who has been listed as being in the survey party that was in Kentucky in 1773 and 1774. On May 1, 1775, they camped at a spring in the valley of Dick's River near the present town of Stanford, Kentucky. Deciding to make it their base of operations, they named the place St. Asaph's; it was probably the headquarters for the three Fincastle survey teams. A quick thought on the Fincastle Survey teams method of operation: first the Deputy Surveyors had to be certified by William and Mary College, in Williamsburg, Va. It appears that rather than the date given in "Back of the Cane" as the date Alexander settled on Crab Orchard Creek, that date was undoubtedly the time that he received his Preemption Warrant, which was his first step in applying for land under the Virginia Land Laws. They had to wait [Revolutionary War probably delayed land transactions] to have their land surveyed, and then waited until they would receive title to the land, which would be the time it would take for the records to travel to and from Virginia, a process that was begun after October of 1780. But being that both Alexander W., and William Moore had received Preemption Warrants, which indicated that they had, in some way, been involved with the land they had chosen soon after their arrival in Kentucky, probably soon after the Boonesborough Convention. In the case of William Moore, the fact that he was chosen as a delegate to the Boonesborough Convention, should be proof enough that he was in the group of forty settlers, led by Richard Henderson, the first group of settlers to pass through the Cumberland Gap after Boone and his crew [of 30 axemen, see William Moore- cvo] made the Gap a little more passable, wide enough to accommodate a pack-horse or a man with a back-pack. Even though, in the next few weeks, Moore was a delegate to the Boonesborough Convention, representing the settlement of Boonesborough, his name does not appear on the list of those who settled there. The mere fact that William Moore was in the first groups to arrive in Kentucky, coming there with the Transylvania Company, would certainly make it reasonable that William Moore had plans to settle on land offered by the Transylvania Company. William quickly joined the other settlers, in their eagerness, to find the land they wanted to settle on. Apparently, William Moore chose land on Crab Orchard Creek, near Dick's River, which was land that the Transylvania Company claimed. Then he went through whatever procedure was required by the Company to register his choice. The amount of land that he wanted to buy and improve and was probably the 500 acres offered for his being among the first forty settlers brought into Kentucky by Richard Henderson. This to him must have seemed adequate in the beginning. But, as things either developed, or deteriorated, Virginia declared that the negotiations between the Cherokee Indians and the Transylvania Company was voided. And so, any contracts or agreements the company had made with the settlers became of no value. But earlier legislation passed by a resolution on 24 June 1776 declared that all men who had settled in Kentucky should have preference on the land they had settled, and should receive title to 400 acres. So all was not lost for William Moore. But it was 13 October 1779 that the newly appointed Virginia Land Commission began to act. He was able to obtain title to the land that he had been squatting on, or perhaps only improving, for about 4 years. In addition he was able to apply for another 1000 acres of land. Back to Samuel Douglass and his sons. The records that we have indicate that Alexander Douglass also had 400 acres of land on Crab Orchard Creek. That is supported by our genealogy records - that record the marriage of Alexander W. Douglass to Jane Moore, the daughter of William Moore and Margaret Hudspeth. We really don't know what happened regarding the Douglass's, but it appears that in some way they lived close to the Moore's. In November and December of 2002, I was in contact with Neal O. Hammon. He informed me that Alexander's 400 acres adjoined William Moore's land on Crab Orchard Creek. Not only that, but he provided his hand drawn map illustrating the situation. (A copy of that map follows these notes.) It is interesting that in 1780, Alexander and William Moore each received Preemption Warrants for the land they had been on, on Crab Orchard Creek, for at least one year, to comply with the land laws at that time. During the years between 1775 and 1779, in reading the history of those years, we know they were turbulent times, with periods that the local residents had to scurry to the fort at Harrodsburg, or to St. Asaph's Fort, after it had been completed, for protection from the raiding Indians. But there surely were times that they were able to live on their land and to improve it. The fort at St. Asaph was completed during that period by Benjamin Logan, with the assistance of some of the settlers whose land was near St. Asaph, some of those volunteers being from the Crab Orchard Creek area. It was under those conditions that the attraction between Alexander and Jane may have developed. It appears that James [Douglass], when in Saint Asaph's, was about 6 miles from his father and brothers, which is the approximate distance from Crab Orchard Creek to St. Asaph's. The Filson Map [sketch] shows "The Moores, Crab Orchard Creek, and English's Station" in the very same locality. St. Asaph later became known as Logan's Station; Benjamin Logan then was the leader of that Station. And if my scenario is correct, my Douglass's, and Moore's, would have, in time of danger, found safety at Logan's Station.

FROM MADISON COUNTY COURT RECORDS, Order book A, 1787 to 1791. 2 September 1789 - An instrument in writing from William Allen to Alexander Duglas (Douglass) was acknowledged by the oath of William Hows and ordered recorded. This Madison County Court record establishes that Alexander Douglass had moved his family from Crab Orchard Creek in Lincoln County, Virginia, to Silver Creek, Madison County, Virginia sometime before September of 1789. Information found recently, which included obtaining William Moore's "Will", indicates that it was William Moore and his wife Margaret who had promoted the move of themselves and their children from Lincoln County, Virginia[/Kentucky], to Madison County, Kentucky, and that would include their daughter Margaret, and her spouse Alexander Douglass. William Moore's will indicates that each of their children had been residing on land in the same area. In his "will" William Moore gave each of his children the land on which they had been living, the spouse of each of the girls receive 100 acres each. While his sons were given 250 acres each. We are not certain at this moment, but it appears that they were somewhere near Silver Creek.

FROM - MADISON COUNTY COURT RECORDS, Order book B, 1791 to 1801, 6 November 1792 - On the motion of George Duglas ( Douglass) and Jane Douglass ( who was Alexander's widow) and John Snoddy. Letters of administration are granted on the estate of Alexander Duglas (Douglass), deceased. Securities are James Anderson and Robert Henderson. Will book A 1, pages 65, 66. 28 December 1792 - We the undersigned subscribers being chosen, Agreeable to the Worshipful Court of Madison County - - - -. Directed and sworn, have appraised the estate of Alexander Douglass, deceased. followeth as is: ( I have a copy of the original inventory, each animal is described and called out, as well as the household items, farm equipement, and tools. and were as follows: 39 head of cattle, 9 head of horses, and 29 misc. items. And the inventory included, 1- Negro girl named DOLL.) The document was signed on 28 December 1792, by George Adams, Robert Burnsides, and Michael Ferris.

MADISON COUNTY Will book A 1, page 67. At a Court held for Madison County, on Tuesday the 4th day of March 1794. This inventory and appraisement of the estate of Alexander Douglas - deceased, was returned and ordered to be recorded Signed: Teste, Will Irvine. The three court records, listed above, when placed in their proper context, provide us with a different perspective of those events. First, we learn that Alexander's death was something like a few days before the court hearing attended by Jane, Alexander's brother - George, and John Snoddy on 6 November 1792. And it was almost two months before the court ordered the inventory of Alexander's estate; that was returned to the court on 28 December 1792. Surely, that inventory was available to Alexander's family at that time. But the court did not record the inventory for another 15 months. And then we have the dialog regarding the marriage of Jane Douglass, the widow of Alexander, to William Glenn, which was, we can be certain, never a part of that court record. It would have been the work of someone transcribing the event, and adding his or her thoughts regarding the later marriage of Jane to William Glenn. That, in some manner, has been accepted as a part the original court record. Source Citation "Pedigree Resource File," database, FamilySearch (http://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.2.1/94P2-Q5P : accessed 11 March 2012), entry for Alexander (W) DOUGLASS.


ID: I19940 Name: Samuel H DOUGLASS Sex: M Birth: ABT 1726 in SCOTLAND or possibly Albemarle Co., VIRGINIA-Frank Slaven.


Note 2. From FRENCH TIPTON PAPERS, Vol., 1, page 272: Samuel Douglass --- of Scotch descent ---from Virginia to Madison Co., (Kentucky.) Son, John, born in Madison County, built wooden mooul[d]boards up to 1850. Alex (Alexander W.) brother of John, invented machinery for steam whiskey, and made such whiskey at the old Weddle Mill on Muddy Creek, said to be the first in State (Kentucky) John is the father of Alfred and Allen Douglass. "History of Weddle's Mill" By Harry G. Enoch (2004). It was first called "Douglas' Mill" and was located on Muddy creek near the Kentucky River. It reads that the mill was built in 1800 by Samuel Douglas and his sons James, John and Alexander. This is the first and only reference to Samuel being Alexander's father that has been found to date, however, which of 3 Alexander Douglasses and Samuel Douglasses. Hint: Be Careful.

Note 3. From Frank Slaven REGARDING THE ARRIVAL OF SAMUEL DOUGLASS IN KENTUCKY: Though there is not any proof, that spells out exactly what did happen, from my research of the various incidents that are actually recorded --- it appears that James Douglass, the often mentioned surveyor of the early history of Kentucky, was probably the son of Samuel Douglass. The historians are all in agreement that the early migration, and settlement of out Nation, was a matter of families attempting to improve their status in life. So, I feel that the knowledge does support, to a point my theory and the following scenario: James Douglass, was a member of the first survey party into the Kentucky region, sent there by Fincastle County, Virginia in 1773. James Harrod was also a member of that survey team. James Douglass, like the other early surveyors and explorers to enter Kentucky, was completely impressed with that beautiful new undeveloped land. So, in 1774 he urged his father, Samuel, and his brothers Alexander and George, to join the party of his friend and associate, James Harrod, who was organizing an expedition down the Ohio River, to the Kentucky River, then [to] follow that river until they found the land of their choice in Kentucky. In "KENTUCKY -Settlement and Statehood" by George Morgan Chinn, we read, that in April of 1774, by previous appointment, James Douglass was to meet James Harrod further down the Ohio River. "Accompanying Douglass were Isaac Hite, who was a member of James Douglass'survey team, and eleven settlers who planned to meet Harrod, at the mouth of the Kanawha River." Though it is not spelled out, [I suggest] that in that party was [also] Samuel and James’ two brothers. It seems quite natural that James, would escort his father and brothers to the prearranged meeting place with James Harrod. But they were perhaps late, and James Harrod decided that he could not wait any longer, so [Harrod] continued his journey to Kentucky. . . . James Douglass and his survey crew, plus the eleven settlers then pressed on to the mouth of the Kentucky River, arriving there on 14 May, where the eleven settlers and the surveyors parted company. And the settlers made their way up the Kentucky River to Harrods Town, where they finally caught up with James Harrod, who had been establishing Harrods Town for a couple of months. This information is derived from the journal of Thomas Hanson, a crew member of John Floyd's survey crew, whose journal seems to provide a running account of the surveyors and their activities. Also Neal A. Hammon, who has three articles published in the Filson Club Publications regarding the Fincastle Surveyors, relates that he had discovered the names of eight of the eleven settlers who were to meet James Harrod and later joined him in Harrod's Town, leaving three settlers unnamed. Perhaps just a coincidence. But to me, it seems quite logical that the three were actually Samuel, Alexander, and George Douglass. To further support my theory, in 1774, James Harrod led his group from what was called Harrod's Town in Kentucky, to the Holston River settlement in preparation for the Point Pleasant War. According to George Morgan Chinn's account, James Harrod's appointment as a commander of a company did not come as quickly as was expected, and some of the men in Harrod's group enlisted in other companies. George Douglass enlisted in Robert Dork's company. Another account stated that is was Samuel, so it is possible that they were there at the Holston Settlement. And perhaps George, Alexander, and Samuel were in the Holston settlement together, and that Samuel and his sons became a part of Harrod's original party who were in Harrodstown. By coincidence there was also a James Douglass enlisted in Robert Dork's company. But he was evidently not James, the surveyor, as James Douglass, the surveyor, and his survey crew, [escaping from an Indian attack and feared dead], had fled down the Mississippi River to New Orleans, where they boarded a ship heading for the Colonies. We have a letter written by James, to his fellow surveyor, William Preston, [in which] James stated that he was in Williamsburg, VA. So it appears that either James was from Williamsburg, or had made some contacts there while he attended William and Mary College, earning his certification as a surveyor, with the possibility that one of those connections was a wife. It does not appear that James Douglass ever established a residence in Kentucky, though he did make several surveys in his own name. Clyde Bunch of Jessamine County, Kentucky, states that James did not receive certification on any of the surveys he surveyed in his name, nor did he ever testify in court regarding the surveys he had made. Which seems to support the thought that he died before the Land Commission held it's first meetings on 18 October 1779 at St. Asaph's Fort. It appears that, while in Kentucky, James always seemed to be close to Samuel, Alexander, and George, in spite of the fact that James Douglasses occupation as a surveyor caused him to be somewhat of a nomad. The distances that were involved were actually not very far by their standards, or by our standards today. The total length of Dick's River is about forty-five miles. What records we have seem to indicate that Alexander settled near Dick's River, on Crab Orchard Creek shortly after the Boonesborough Convention; there is nothing to indicate where Samuel and George were at the time, so they may have all been together at that period. The land records do inform us that in 1780 Alexander received confirmation on his surveys on Crab Orchard Creek. Samuel's entry was made in 1782 on his survey on Sugar Creek. George's 200 acres that joined Samuels was also entered in 1782. By my rough scaling of the distance between Alexander, on Crab Orchard Creek, and Samuel and George on Sugar Creek was close to twenty miles, as the crow flies. Another point of interest, --- William Moore settled near the Crab Orchard area, and according to history books, that was part of the Transylvania Company's area, so William Moore had received some sort of title on the land from the Transylvania Company. And Alexander, having come with James Harrod, settled in the very same area. James Harrod, and his men, bitterly challenged the Transylvania Company’s claim to the area. [William Moore’s daughter, Jane, married Alexander Douglass.]

Note 4. From "BACK OF THE CANE"'Bold text' by Fredrick Simpson: In October of 1778, Samuel and Alexander Douglass, were members of a party led by James Harrod, that set off down the Ohio River towards the saltworks at Kaskaskia on the Mississippi River. Before there was no salt in Kentucky.

Note 5. From "THE LAND RECORDS OF LINCOLN COUNTY, VIRGINIA: Samuel Douglass, in a survey numbered 4869, received 200 acres on Sugar Creek that was adjoining George's 200 acres. It was paid for by Treasury Warrant 6523, the land entry was made on 13 August 1782, the survey was made 9 March 1784, and Samuel received title to the land 10 July 1796.

Note 6. From THE WRITINGS OF GERALD TUDOR, professor at Northern(?) Kentucky University: It seems that relationships were formed in those early adventures, that in some way result in a group of surveys near Downing's Station in the early 1780's. These surveys were made for George Douglass, Samuel Douglass, Walter Dewitt, and William Holliday. In 1787 Samuel Douglass was living in Bourbon County, in the same district was William Holliday, whose survey shared a long boundary with the Samuel Douglass survey east of Burdette Knob. The Samuel Douglass survey also shared a boundary with a survey of Walter Dewitt. On June 2, 1806, Samuel Douglass, now living in Bourbon County, sold the western 100 acres of his survey to Benjamin Floyd. On the same date, he sold the remaining 8412acres to Joseph Smith Burdette.

Note 7. From BOURBON COUNTY, KENTUCKY, TAXPAYERS 1787 to 1799: Samuel Douglass is listed in the Bourbon County taxpayer records from 1787 through 1791

Note 8. From MADISON COUNTY, KENTUCKY, ORDER BOOK B ---1791 to 1801 6 December 1796: In obedience to of of ad quo damnum, the following men met at the proposed site of David Henderson's mill on Muddy Creek and reported the following. We find Henderson owns one side of the creek where the proposed dam is to be built, and Samuel Douglass owns the other. The dam will be three feet high, and we are of the opinion that there will be no land overflowed by said dam, and navigation will not be obstructed or the health of neighbors affected (The document was signed by the twelve men on 12 November 1796). By consent of Samuel Duglas (Douglass) the proprietor of lands adjoining, he is permitted to build his mill. 3 March 1800 --- On a motion of Samuel Douglass who wishes to build a water grist mill on Muddy Creek. It is ordered that the sheriff summon twelve persons to meet at the place proposed for the said mill, and view the bed of the said creek, above and below and make a report. 6 May 1800 --- This writ of quod damnum that was granted Samuel Douglass to built a water grist mill on Muddy Creek was returned to wit: They said Douglass intends building his mill dam four feet six inches high and that lands that will be overflowed will be no damage and that the manton house, garden or orchard or no person will be injured by the said mill dam. Or the fish or ordinary navigation be obstructed, neither will the health of the neighbors be damaged by the stagnation of the waters (The document was signed by the committee on 20 March 1800). Leave was granted him (Samuel Douglass) to build his mill and dam.

Note 9. The above court records tell us that Samuel was on Muddy Creek before 6 December1789, having moved there probably from Bourbon County. Records from the same source indicate that Alexander and his family were there on Muddy Creek by 2 September 1789.

Note 10. From FRENCH TIPTON PAPERS, volume 5, page 94 1811: James, Samuel, and Alex Douglass have mill on Muddy Creek.

Note 11. It is possible that this was James Simeral Douglass, the son of Alexander W. Douglass who married his cousin Betsey Burnsides. The Alex mentioned would be the son of Alexander W., as Alexander W. had been dead since about 1792.

Note 12. From THE MADISON COUNTY, KENTUCKY, MARRIAGE RECORDS --- 1780 to 1851:

Mary (Polly) Douglass to Andrew Hamilton, 30 August 1796, the return date 1 September 1796. Bondsmen, George Tincher. Samuel Douglass father of the bride. Elizabeth (Betsey) Douglass to Henry Hamilton. Bond - 6 April 1802, return date: 8 April 1802. John Abbot - bondsman. Samuel Douglass, father of the bride.

Note 13. Samuel Douglass is listed on the 1810 and 1820 Madison County census records, along with his family, but no names for them was provided. Samuel and his family, including his son George and his family migrated to the Territory of Missouri, some time after 1820.******This would have made Samuel H Douglass 100 years old.********** It is possible that some of Alexander's children, including James Douglass, and his family were [already] there. They were in Howard County to begin with, but some found themselves in Johnson County when it was organized [from Howard County]. Samuel and George Douglass in 1832, were in a group of settlers who had moved to the area that was to become Johnson County, and more specifically, the area that was later known as Chilohwee Township. When the land that each of them had staked out was surveyed, and the new county, Johnson County was formed, they applied for the land that they had been squatting on, this was in 1834, and it was nine years later, in 1843, that they received the patents on the land they had applied for.

Note 14. From THE BUREAU OF LAND MANAGEMENT RECORDS: Patents received by SAMUEL H. DOUGLASS (In Johnson County, Missouri) 20264 - 80 acres, Section 5, Township 44 - N, Range 26-W, date 5/1/184320266 - 40 acres, Section 11, Township 44-N, Range 27-W, date 5.1.1843 ******That would make Samuel H. Douglass 120 years old!*******

Note 15. In the book "History of Johnson County, Missouri" there are only two items that refer to Samuel Douglass, one stating that Samuel and George came to Johnson County, Missouri from Howard County. The other, saying that he died in Johnson County.

Following are notes on Samuel H. Douglass received from Frank Slaven on August 18, 2003.

Note 16. SPECULATION ON THE ARRIVAL OF SAMUEL DOUGLASS IN KENTUCKY: Thought there does not seem to be any proof, that spells out what actually happened. From my research of the various incidents that are recorded---it appears that there is more than one possibility as to how Samuel and his sons, George, and Alexander may have arrived there. But, it does seem that they were among the first settlers to arrive in Kentucky. Perhaps the scenario that would seem most likely would be they were among the 23 men, whose names were unknown, ot at least un-named, in the following account: FROM - BENJAMIN LOGAN ---KENTUCKY FRONTIERSMAN, by Charles Gano Talbert. Page 16 ___ We learn of the establishment of St. Asaph's Station. On 15 April 1775, a group of Surveyors and adventurers were ready to leave the Holston River settlement heading for Kentucky. The leader was John Floyd, a deputy surveyor of Fincastle County. In this group was John Todd, Alexander Spotswood Dandridge, Jacob Baughman, Thomas Carpenter, Joseph Drake, Matthew Houett, Patrick Jordan, and 23 others. On May 1, they camped at a spring in the valley of the Dick's River, near the present town of Stanford, Kentucky. Deciding to make this their base of operations, they gave to the place the name of St. Asaph's. Page 17 In the meantime, there was the claim of the Transylvania Company to be considered. Two days after his arrival in St. Asaph's, Floyd went to Boonesborough to discuss matters with Henderson, the head of the Transylvania Company. The Boonesborough Convention was called for 23 May1775 --- with delegates chosen to represent the four tiny settlements.

From --- KENTUCKY --- SETTLEMENT AND STATEHOOD by George Morgan Chinn Page 93 --- To each man who accompanied Boone when he cut the road, or had come with Henderson, the (Transylvania) company offered 500 acres, at the rate of twenty shillings per 100 acres. As with Harrodsburg, these settlers were more interested in locating land than building a fort. Fort Boonesborough was built in spurts and lapses. The discovery of Indian signs would prompt the settlers to lend a hand for a day or two before returning to (improve) their own land.

From ---VIRGINIA'S WESTERN WAR --- by Neal O. Hammon and Richard Taylor Page 12: Kentucky was (soon) being over run with settlers, mostly Virginian's who intended to stake claims on any vacant tract that they found to their liking. Some made it a point of visiting Boonesborough to discuss terms for taking up Transylvania land south of the Kentucky River. But others seemed to be satisfied to travel around the country-side in small groups, building cabins in isolated locations. On the South and west sides of Dick's River, at St. Asaph, there were originally, thirty men. Page 13: The gentlemen in Floyd's Company, as well as others who had visited Boonesborough appear to have been impressed with Henderson's deed from the Cherokee (Nation) and offered to deal with Henderson of his terms. Initially, the terms seemed fair to all --- anyone could buy land on credit. The cost of the land was one fifth of a shilling per acre ( or 1 pound per 100 acres). The deed for the land would be awarded when the buyer furnished a promissory note, or his bond. Page 14 The conference (Boonesborough Convention) which lasted six days, ended in harmony. The delegates recognized the Transylvania Company as "Soverign of the Country as well as Lord of the soil." And agreed to enter all land claims with the proprietors (The Transylvania Company). Henderson was well pleased. Henderson had established Transylvania as the 14th Colony. The main attraction was land. Those claiming land in Transylvania need only to select a site and register their claim in the company's land book. The quotations above, illustrate very well, the conditions that existed from the very beginning of the settlement of Kentucky, but were only in force for a very few months. It seems more than certain that our William Moore, whose daughter Jane, married our Alexander W. Douglass, qualified to claim 500 acres, offered to the group of 40 men who came with Richard Henderson in the group of settlers who arrived at what was to be Boonesborough a very few days after Boone and his crew arrived. William Moore was one of those chosen as a delegate for the convention. Today, we do not have the Transylvania Land Book to refer to, so from perhaps spring or summer of 1775 until October of 1779, when the First Land Commission was organized, we do have records that support the theory that William Moore's first choice of land was on Crab Orchard Creek, near the Dick's River, as that was where he resided when the Land Commission first met, and, is probably where he had been since 1775, with the possible exception of the time he returned to Clinch River to pick up his family and to bring them to Crab Orchard Run, and the possible time that they have been forced to find safety in either Harrod's Fort or later, in Logan's Fort. Hence he qualified for a Preemption Warrant, which indicates that he had been there, and had improved his land as the laws required. But about our Douglass family, their story has to be a little different. I suspect that Samuel, Alexander, and George, must have been there too, with the possibility of their having been in the area of Dick's River. Maybe by design or coincidence, William Moore's claim adjoined the land that Alexander obtained from his father and brother on Crab Orchard Run. In the last several months I have been corresponding with Neal O. Hammon, the author quoted above. He is a noted expert concerning the Fincastle Surveyors and the settlement of Kentucky, and their land laws. Mr. Hammon volunteered to draw a map of the area around Crab Orchard Creek, and he did this specifically for me. This map shows William Moore's land adjoining Alexander W. Douglass's land. Both parties land including Crab Orchard Creek. Another point of interest --- The town of Crab Orchard is very near the center of the land that William Moore owned. We have known for years that Alexander and Jane Moore were married in about 1778 in what was at the time Kentucky County, Virginia. However it happened, the Douglass's were there on Crab Orchard Creek, and next to the Moore's. By resorting to the numbers, I have attempted to determine a little more about what did happen. I calculate that in 1775, Alexander was about 16 years old. That in 1778, when they were married he would have been near 19 years old, so by the time he was of age, Alexander, meeting with the Land Commission, applied for land, and he received a Preemption Warrant. Probably all of Alexander and Jane's children were born there. (There is a copy of the map in question in the possession of Frank Slaven and also the files of Sue A. Wilcox-Hosbach.) Crab Orchard Creek is something like 6 miles from the settlement made by John Floyd and his group, they name St. Asaph's, that later became known as Logan's Fort. I cannot prove it, but I believe that Samuel and his sons, just could have been in John Floyd's party. Recent information received from Don Hill of Texas, concerning the Douglass family, who were early settlers in Albemarle Co., VA. really supports my theory that James Douglass, the surveyor, was also a son of Samuel, and we can be certain that James Douglass would have been one of the surveyors in John Floyd's party. On more than one of the descendancy charts furnished by Don Hill, there is a George Douglass listed, and calls out the names of his wife, and their children, and their spouses. Not by coincidence, all of those names, along with dates and places match perfectly with [those of] George N. Douglass, the son of Samuel, many years later in Missouri. And to top that....those records indicate that George had a brother James Douglass, providing the names of his family, as shown here on his Family Group Sheet. The information provided by Hammon and Taylor gives us some great insight regarding the conditions in Kentucky about 1775. Richard Henderson, among his other accomplishments, was a Militia Colonel, a Judge, and a Surveyor, and he was also an attorney. Being a lawyer, and planning such a vast project as Transylvania Co., and its 200 million acres of land, we can depend on his planning ahead, making it easy for the settlers to obtain the promissory notes, or personal bonds that they needed through the Transylvania Company. The State of Virginia declared the sale of the Indian Land to the Transylvania Company null and void, also the transactions between the company and the settlers. I would guess that the paper work provided to the settlers by the company, would have been a great asset to them when they were dealing with the Land Commissioners.

From--- BENJAMIN LOGAN--- Kentucky Frontiersman by Charles Gano Talbert. Page 16 (Probably May 1, 1775) Benjamin Logan also came to Kentucky in the spring of 1775. He could have come with Henderson, but he started from the upper Holston region as did Floyd, and ended his journey at St. Asaph's rather than Boonesborough. It is likely that he was a member of Floyd's party. He raised corn at St. Asaph's that year, as did several of Floyd's men. On the basis of this --- he later proved his claim to 14,000 acres of land at that site. Another possibility of the theory of Samuel, George, and Alexander's arrival in Virginia: James Douglass, was a member of the first survey party into the Kentucky Region, sent there by the Fincastle County, Virginia in 1773. James Harrod, was also a member of that party. James Douglass, like the other early surveyors and explorers to enter Kentucky, was completely impressed with that beautiful new undeveloped land. So, he arranged for his father, Samuel, and his brothers Alexander, and George to join the party of his friend and associate, James Harrod, who was organizing an expedition down the Ohio River, to the Kentucky River, then to follow that river until they found the land of their choice in Kentucky, in 1774. In "KENTUCKY --- Settlement and Statehood" by George Morgan Chinn, we read, that in April of 1774, by previous appointment, James Douglass was to meet James Harrod further down the Ohio River. "Accompanying Douglass were Isaac Hite, a member of James Douglass survey team, and eleven settlers who planned to meet Harrod at the mouth of the Kanawha River". Though it is now spelled out, I suggest the possibility of Samuel, and James’s two brothers being in that party. It seems quite natural that James would escort his father and brothers to the prearranged meeting place with James Harrod. But they were evidently late, and James Harrod decided that he could not wait any longer, so continued his journey to Kentucky. James Douglass and his survey crew, plus the eleven settlers then pressed on to the mouth of the Kentucky River, arriving there on 14 May, where the eleven settlers and the surveyors parted company, with the surveyors continuing their assignments, and the settlers making their way up the Kentucky River to Harrods Town for a couple of months. This information is derived from the journal of Thomas Hanson, a crew member of John Floyd's survey crew, whose journal seems to provide a running account of the surveyors and their activities. To further support my theory, in 1774, James Harrod fled with his group from what was called Harrod's Town in Kentucky, to the Holston River settlement, in preparation for the Point Pleasant War. According to George Morgan Chinn's account...James Harrod's appointment as a commander of a company did not come as quickly as was expected, and some of the men in Harrod's group, enlisted in other companies. A George Douglass is listed as being in Robert Doak's company,another accounted stated that it was Samuel, so it is possible that Samuel, George, and Alexander were all at the Holston Settlement. This made it likely that Samuel and his sons could have become a part of Harrod's original party in Harrod's Town,though they had arrived at Harrod's Town a couple of months late. By coincidence, there was also a James Douglass, enlisted in Robert Dork's company. And another James Douglass listed in the group stationed at Maiden Springs. But they were obviously not James, the surveyor, as he and his survey crew were fleeing down the Mississippi River to New Orleans, where they boarded a ship heading for the Colonies. We have a letter written by James to his surveying supervisor Col., William Preston. James stated that he was in Williamsburg, VA. So it appears that either James was from Williamsburg, or had made some contacts there while he was at William and Mary College earning his certification as a surveyor. And it seems reasonable, that during the period from 1776 through 1779, with the Indian raids and problems, the surveyors were not active in Kentucky, so possibly, James had a family, he spent that time in Virginia, probably in Amherst or Bedford County. But the records do indicate that he was at St. Asaph’s Station on 19 April 1780, where he met with the Virginia Land Commission, concerning the surveys that he had made in his name. There is a report that from Williamsburg, there was a Samuel Douglass, who was wounded during the French and Indian War, he was a member of Captain Hanchrist Carlock's company. But to date we have not been able to confirm that he was our Samuel. It does not appear that James Douglass ever established a residence in Kentucky. Though James did make several surveys in his own name. Clyde Bunch of Jessamine, County Kentucky, states that James did not receive title to any of the surveys he made in his name, nor did he ever testify in court regarding the earlier surveys he had made. Which seems to support the thought that he died shortly after the Land Commission held it's first meeting on 18 October 1779 at Logan's Fort. PLEASE NOTE: The events that are depicted in the above information, are actually events that took place. But the information regarding the Douglass’es is only speculation on my part, with the exception of James being a surveyor, and the account of his accompanying the group of settlers. I feel that there is a good possibility that he was the son of Samuel. It appears that, while in Kentucky, James always seemed to be close to Samuel, Alexander, and George. In spite of the fact that James Douglass's occupation as a surveyor, caused him to be somewhat of a nomad. The distances that were involved were actually not very far, by their standards, or our standards of today. The total length of Dick's River is about forty-five miles. Neal O. Hammon has provided documentation that establishes that Alexander settled near Dick's River, on Crab Orchard Creek, as he in 1778 received a Preemption Warrant for the 400 acres he was living on, which is evidence that he had been living there long enough to qualify. And there is nothing to indicate where Samuel and George were at that time, so they may have all been together on Crab Orchard Creek at that period. And Neal Hammon also confirms that William Moore's survey joined Alexander's Survey. The land records do inform us that Samuel's land entry was made in 1782 on his survey on the West Fork of Sugar Creek. Georges 200 acres that joined Samuel's, was also entered in 1782. By my rough scaling of the distance between Alexander on Crab Orchard Creek, and Samuel and George, on the West Fork of Sugar Creek was close to twenty miles, as the crow flies. Another point of interest --- William Moore was living on Crab Orchard Creek, and according to the history books, that was part of the Transylvania Company's Area, so William Moore had undoubtedly received some sort of title on the land from the Transylvania Company.

From "A History of Kentucky", by Elizabeth Shelby Kinkead, American Book Co., New York: 1896.

Hancock Taylor and John Floyd were deputies under Colonel William Preston, surveyor of Fincastle County, Virginia of which Kentucky was a part until 1776. These two men were sent out to survey what was to become Kentucky lands. One was killed shortly by Indians and the other did settle a family in Kentucky only later to be killed by Indians. Other surveyors were Captain Thomas Bullitt of Virginia surveying land for Dr. John Connolly at the Falls of the Ohio. Next were surveyors such as James Douglas(s), who visited Big Bone Lick. Later Simon Kenton, Daniel Boone and families explored Kentucky. In 1774 James Harrod came to survey the land along with forty men and built themselves cabins and laid off the town of Harrodsburg. Later, upon hearing of Indian insurrections, Gov. Dunmore of Virginia sent off Daniel Boone and Michael Stoner to guide surveyors and families back to Virginia. Ensued was the Battle of Point Pleasant beginning on 10 Oct 1774 near the mouth of the Kanawha River. Leading the charge were Colonels Charles Lewis, William Fleming and John Field. Their troops were the Scotch/Irish from Virginia. Under the command of Captain Russell and Captain Evan Shelby, the encounter was won and following a peace treaty was enacted. In 1775, James Harrod and his party erected permanent homes in the area now known as Kentucky. Added by Nancy Douglas 25 Aug, 2021.

Sources

  • Sources noted in the extensive notes.

Research of Frank Slaven between about 1999 and 2004.



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Hi Jennifer, That is an interesting story on early blockhouse forts. I have not seen that one but have read some others. It is possible, though unlikely, the Douglasses and Moore's knew about each other; both Albemarle Co., VA, and Granville, NC were in the piedmont. Judith Ridner's book "The Scots Irish of Early Pennsylvania: A Varied People" is a good read about these clannish groups and their movement from the British Isles to Pennsylvania then following the Old Indian Trail into the Shenandoah Valley and following the Wilderness Trail into Kentucky. They wanted freedom and liberty and were tired of being taxed to death by the British. In the early 1700s the British Isles suffered some very harsh years with very cold winters and short summer growing seasons. British settled absent barons and earls in Ireland who took land lived on by the natives who managed to eke out a living. The King demanded his taxes, the landowners demanded their share from their shareholders; there was no share. With the very poor climate conditions, the land had no more to give. Their children did not thrive. William Penn had sent barrels of wheat and dried fruits to the Quakers in England along with stories of how, because the land was not rocky, a 16 year old lad could till several acres of land in a day, fruit was dropping off the orchard trees, flax grew easily. This brought not only the Quakers but also their neighbors who wanted a better chance. Another book I read in 2020 was The Planting of New Virginia by Warren Hofstra who also wrote a book about the Valley Road of Virginia (aka the Old Indian Trail, The Old Wagon Road, etc). This trail system following the folds and valleys of the Appalachian Mountains from Tennessee through Pennsylvania and New York to western Massachusetts was used by Native Americans for millennia. It followed old woodland buffalo migration trails. When the first settlers came into the Shenandoah, they found areas along the rivers that were somewhat overgrown but that had obviously been cleared, found evidence of wild patches of squash and corn. These first European settlers had slowly filtered west from the Virginia piedmont through the gaps in the "Blue Mountains" but flooded the pathways from Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, crossing the Potomac near Harper's Ferry after crossing the Susquehanna near Harrisburg, PA. These were mostly not the tobacco farmers and slaveholders of the lazy piedmont rivers of eastern seaboard but were industrious Scots Irish with their large families looking for a place to settle. On June 14, 1775, George Washington appealed to the Continental Congress to supply him with rifle companies for the upcoming strife. Washington, during the French and Indian War, had had fought with these frontiersmen, in western Pennsylvania, including my 4g grandfather Thomas Ogan then of Lancaster Co., PA. In August 1775 Doctor James Thacher, a young doctor from Barnstable [Massachusetts] who observed the regiment during August 1775, provided this description of the rifle companies that marched to Boston:

They are remarkably stout and hardy men, many of them exceeding six feet in height and two hundred pounds. They are dressed in white frocks or rifle shirts and round hats. The men are remarkable for the accuracy of their aim, striking a mark with certainty at two hundred yards distance. At a review, a company of them, while in a quick advance, fired their balls into objects seven inches in diameter at a distance of 250 yards . . . their shot have frequently proved fatal to British Officers and soldiers who exposed themselves to view at more than double the distance of common musket shot. (Source: James Thacher, "Military Journal during the American Revolutionary War from 1775 to 1783".) Thomas Ogan's company marched 400 miles from near Harrisburg, PA, to near Boston, in ten days. They were fed and housed or provided places to sleep along the way by enthusiastic citizens. When these families settled in Virginia Valley (Shenandoah) they mostly did not bring any slaves. They were industrious in settling the new land, discovering mineral sources- iron ore, lead, sulphur, limestone, alum, clays.

Here's a reference to Scots-Irish naming patterns: Traditional Naming Patterns for Both Scots & Irish People Written by Teena

Traditional Scottish and Irish people often named their children using the following patterns, yet this was not always true

1st Son named after Fathers Father 2nd Son named after Mothers Father 3rd Son named after the Father 4th Son named after Father's eldest brother 5th Son named after 2nd oldest brother or mother's eldest brother

1st Daughter named after Mothers Mother 2nd Daughter named after Fathers Mother 3rd Daughter named after Mother 4th Daughter named after Mothers eldest sister 5th Daughter named after 2nd oldest sister or Fathers eldest sister

Differences I have found The only difference between the Scottish & Irish naming patterns was that when the Irish father remarries after his first Wife died, the first daughter born to this new marriage was often named after the deceased wife, and included her whole name. Also, If a child died young then their name was then used for the next child of the same sex, thereby keeping alive the name of the relative who they were 'named for'. There were cases within the Irish community where a child was named after a person of esteem, eg: an Aunt, or an Uncle. They have even given their child, as a middle name, the last name of the pastor/ priest of their local Parish or an influential person in the community. Also, parents may have used the mothers or grandmother's maiden name as a child's middle name.


Chet Ogan

posted by Chet Ogan
Has anyone looked very far into the Clinch River Forts and surrounding areas? William Moore and William Preston both had forts there in 1774-5. There was also the Anderson Blockhouse where Daniel Boone found his "thirty axemen" to help him traverse into Kentucky. This link refers to the Anderson House as one of the main roads to Crab Orchard, KY. I know many theorize that The Douglass' and Moore's met in KY, but it seems to me they could have already known each other in VA.

https://danielboonetrail.com/history-perspectives/the-wilderness-road-blockhouse/

posted by Jennifer Newbrough
Dear Jennifer,

Wow! Can you scan that history and send it to me [email address removed] ? I was aware that a Samuel Douglass built a mill. Filson's 1784 map from a source titled "The Discovery and Settlement of Kentucky," which is a stylized map, more for showing relative locations than accuracy like Barker's 1794 map, shows Muddy Creek east of Otter Creek which is adjacent to (east of) Boonesborough in Madison County (and immediately across Kentucky River from Bourbon County. I think I got these maps off the internet. Barker's map calls Muddy Creek by the name Middle Creek, and next to where Kentucky River turns almost due south near the confluence of Red River. Madison Co was created out of Lincoln County, named for Abe's grandfather. This Samuel S. Douglass (ca 1765- aft 1811 prob Chilowee, Johnson, MO) would likely be a brother of Alexander W Douglass and (?) a son of the Samuel Douglass identified by Frank Slaven as the father of Alexander W Douglass. Yes, Alexander W Douglass died about 1790. I was aware that the Douglasses were masons or has some of those skills (I think some of that rubbed off on me too, among other skills- at 74 years old). John Ogan and wife Polly (Mary) Douglass were married at Crab Orchard (Wm Moore's land) then moved to Silver Creek north of Madison Co courthouse and two creeks west of Boonesborough, next to Tates Creek where the parents of John's daughters John and James Ogan who married sisters Lucy and and Elizabeth Harris who lived on Tates Creek. Great historical area for our family. Chet Ogan

posted by Chet Ogan
Chet,

I would love to,how do I send it? By email or via Wiki?

Jen

posted by Jennifer Newbrough
I recently purchased "History of Weddle's Mill" By Harry G Enoch. It was first called "Douglas' Mill" and was located on Muddy creek near the Kentucky River. It reads that the mill was built in 1800 by Samuel Douglas and his sons James, John and Alexander (however it could not have been his son Alexander as he was likely deceased. Perhaps it was his grandson). It goes on to say that in 1811 they (James, Samuel and Alexander) submitted a petition to add a sawmill on the site of the gristmill and that permission was granted (Madison County Order Book C700:710). There are also references to Alexander, Son of Samuel, running this mill and distillery into the early 1800's (French Tipton papers and land records (MC DB K:498). According to the "Weddle's MIll" book, by 1825 Alexander had died and his father Samuel sold the land to Samuel Jones for 572.00 credit for debt owed to Jones by Alexander. It also reads that Samuel had by this time moved to Clay County. I wish this information nailed more history down for us, but it raises more questions as well! -Jennifer Z (Douglas is my mother's maiden name).
posted by Jennifer Newbrough

D  >  Douglass  >  Alexander William Douglass