Elsie Gorman
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Elsie Gorman

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Signed 2 Oct 2015 | 11,213 contributions | 603 thank-yous | 2,318 connections
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Elsie Gorman
Born 1960s.
Ancestors ancestors
Sister of [private sister (1950s - unknown)] and [private brother (1950s - unknown)]
Mother of
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Profile last modified | Created 28 Sep 2015
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Elsie Gorman is a member of the Indigenous Australians Team.
Elsie was featured in a Meet Our Members Post on the G2G Forum!
Elsie Gorman participated in the 2024 Locators Challenge.

I started with wikitree to preserve the family information gathered by my father, Noel. I am interested in One Name Studies and the Australian Convicts and First Settlers Project. I created a One name study for the surname Gorman, as I am interested in tracing the journey of our name across the world. You can find it at Gorman Name study.

My Irish origins
My Irish roots are Donnelly from County Wicklow; Gorman from County Tipperary, Grady from County Tipperary, Kearney from County Limerick; O'Niell via McDonald of the Highlands and the Isles; Phillips from Castlecomer, County Kilkenny; QUIRK from Tramore, Waterford; Fieghery and Slavin from Roscrea, County Tipperary; Whalan from County Tipperary and Carter from unknown county, DNA suggests West Cork. Our mitochondrial DNA test puts us in "Clan Ursula".

The McDonald heritage links to Australia's first Saint, Mother Mary McKillop through multiple connections. We are double descended from Angus Mor McDonald via both Donald and Catherine. Angus Mor is the brother of Donald Drochaid, who is Mother Mary's maternal grandfather.

So far I have identified a few ancestors up to the tenth generation. In each generation I have identified:

Gen. # Direct Relation to Self Dates of Birth Matches # # Identified in WikiTree % Identified in WikiTree Total # Total # Identified Total % Identified
2grandparent1890s1st Cousins44100.0%66100.0%
3great grandparent1840s to 1880s2nd Cousins88100.0%1414100.0%
42nd great grandparent1810s to 1850s3rd Cousins161486.0%302893%
53rd great grandparent1770s to 1820s4th Cousins322681.25%625690%
64th great grandparent1740s to 1790s5th Cousins643245%1268567%
75th great grandparent1770s to 1810s6th Cousins1282721%25411144%
86th great grandparent1730s to 1780s7th Cousins256124.6%51012324%
97th great grandparent1660s to 1700s8th Cousins51271.36%102213012.7%
108th great grandparent1620s to 1680s9th Cousins10243.23%20461336.5%


Maternal and Paternal relationship is confirmed

  • Paternal relationship is confirmed through Family Tree DNA full sibling match to Gorman-1069 and Gorman-1070, MRCA McDonald-7805 and Gorman-1068
  • Maternal relationship is confirmed through Family Tree DNA mother/daughter match to McDonald-7805
  • Our mitochondrial DNA haplotype is U5b2c2 and Y DNA RM269 (Y67 test).
  • At 4 generations back out of 16 great great grandparents 8 (50%) originated from Ireland, 4 (25%) from the Scottish Highlands & 4 (25%) from England. An Ancestry DNA estimate gives 67% Munster Irish and 27% Scottish Highlands, Argyll and Bute, 4% Norway and 2% England.

My paternal great grandparents

  • The Catholic settler families of the Oberon and Black Springs area of NSW intermarried extensively. William and Margaret as MRCA couple closest matches are double cousins, through William's brother John Gorman and Margaret's niece Rose Grady, 105 cM across 6 segments and 100 cM across 6 segments
  • William Gorman: Born Truscotts Swamp near Oberon NSW 1850. Died 01 Apr 1882.
    • Gorman YDNA confirmed Y67 through brother *bj RM269, Niall line [1][2]
    • Phillips DNA confirmed autosomal matches to descendants of sister Fannie (Flemming)
  • Margaret Grady: Born Fish River, NSW 1856. Died Bathurst, NSW 1935.
    • Grady/Whalan DNA confirmed autosomal matches to descendants of her father's brother and sisters (Smyth Cross)
  • Michael and Sarah as MRCA couple an AncestryDNA test match between grand daughter of Elsie (*emg) and descendant of Felix of 116 cM across 6 segments Confidence: Extremely High (Rooney 2C1R)
  • Michael Carter: Born Cork, Ireland 09 Sep 1844. Died Kingsdale, NSW 05 Mar 1903, Brickwall ancestor
  • Sarah Elizabeth Grooms: Born Araluen, NSW 13 Sep 1859. Died Portland, NSW 29 Jan 1938.
    • Relationship to Sarah Elizabeth (Grooms) Carter is confirmed with an AncestryDNA test match between descendants of three daughters, Elsie, Carrie (Byrne) Quince HQ half second cousin 47 centimorgans shared across 5 DNA segments, Confidence: Very High and Aggie (Byrne) Bullard. MyHeritage match between half second cousins *bj and CP .6% 114.1‎ cM Shared DNA over 5 Shared segments, largest 40.9‎ cM
    • Match of 79.9‎ cM across 6 segments between descendants of Sarah and her sister Christina. Numerous aT matches to the descendants of Mary England and Purkins Cooper in the USA.

My maternal great grandparents

  • The McDonald families intermarried extensively in the Scottish highlands and when settled in Nimmitabel, NSW, see Space:Nimmitabel_McDonalds. Dougald and Christina as MRCA couple match 1st cousin once removed match of 448 cm over 26 segments at Ancestry (*emgA and SLynch), 2nd cousin match of 166 cM across 9 segments at Ancestry (*emgA and margie1837, grand daughter of Marg
  • Dougald McDonald: Born 10 Nov 1854. Died Nimmitabel, NSW 01 Feb 1928
  • Christina Josephine McDonald: Born "Lake View", Nimmitabel, New South Wales 12 Jun 1855. Died Nimmitabel, NSW 14 May 1933.
    • DNA confirmed autosomal matches to her mother's Campbell line
    • DNA confirmed autosomal matches Malcolm McDonald and in Canada and the USA that support the male Cranachan line
  • Charles and Mary as MRCA couple 2nd cousin match through descendants of Madeline and George, of 369.6 cm over 17 segments at MyHeritage, Mother match to same person 1C1R is 681.5‎ cM Shared DNA over 25 segments, largest 66.9‎ cM
  • Charles Bales: Born Hovell's Creek, Boorowa, NSW 1852. Died Bemboka, NSW 17 Jul 1925.
  • Mary Slavin: Born Nimmitabel, New South Wales, Australia 22 Sep 1864. Died Cooma, NSW 25 Dec 1939.
    • DNA autosomal matches to descendants of her sister Elizabeth and descendants of her aunt Elizabeth who migrated to the USA.
  • My wikitree ancestors have been added to Gedmatch Gorman ID number 9513333 McDonald ID number

As a child Mary enjoyed bicycling, going to the beach, swimming in the Wyong River and Saturday sessions at the Astra. "Inside the Astra Theatre, Wyong, n.d. This image shows the stage and screen area of the Astra Theatre.Photographer: Leonard Brennan." Alison Road and Margaret Streets, Wyong.This photo comes courtesy of Wyong Way Back Then: https://www.flickr.com/photos/wyongwaybackwhen/17636542096/in/photostream/

To do list

Advance Directive

To aid WikiTree in the administration of my account should I be incapacitated, or in the event of my death, I hereby give permission for all private profiles I'm managing to be transferred to the following WikiTreers, whether or not they are currently on the Trusted Lists: Kylie Haese Gorman profiles Bales-1882 maternal line


  1. The Clan Donald DNA site says "The “Neill” line belongs to the signature 13-25-14-11-11-13-12-12-12-13-14-29 which is strongly concentrated in northwestern Ireland. It is delineated by the SNP marker M222. It, like the purported Dalriadic line, is so large that though it bears a published academic imprimatur it clearly is far larger than just Niall descendants.[1]
  2. The FTDNA Gorman Project administrator says "Haplogroup R-M269 Family Tree DNA kit 602757 Comments: Y DNA haplogroup R-M269. He is Member # G-76 of the Gorman DNA Project, you can view his results in the project's results chart by clicking here. Listed under James, born 1811 Tipperary. FTDNA kit 602757 The project coordinator has supplied the following: he is classified as Gorman Lineage III, one of the very few well-established, and rather old, lineages of Gormans. Most Gormans in the world are completely unrelated to each other, and are actually derived from some other surname in relatively recent history. Gorman Lineage III though does appear to have borne the Gorman surname for quite a long time--many centuries
  • First-hand information entered by EM Gorman.
  • NSW Birth and baptism certificates
  • id L5N6-7XM

Only the Trusted List can access the following:
  • Elsie's formal name
  • e-mail address
  • exact birthdate
  • birth location
  • images (9)
  • private siblings' names
  • private children's names (1)
  • spouse's name and marriage information
For access to Elsie Gorman's full information you must be on Elsie's Trusted List. Please login.

DNA Connections
It may be possible to confirm family relationships. Maternal line mitochondrial DNA test-takers: It is likely that these autosomal DNA test-takers will share some percentage of DNA with Elsie: Have you taken a test? If so, login to add it. If not, see our friends at Ancestry DNA.
Comments: 32

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The past then was different to the past now, further away and harder to find Richard Flanagan Question 7
posted by Elsie Gorman
Hi Elsie,

We're contacting you for the annual Australia Project membership checkin. We really appreciate your involvement in the Project in the last year. Thank you so much for all your help to improve Australian profiles on WikiTree.

Please could you reply to this message, or send me a private message to let us know if you'd like to stay on in the Project, and if you'd like to make any changes to the teams that you belong to. The teams are listed on Australia Project Teams.

If you've moved on to other things for the moment, that's absolutely fine. We'd appreciate if you'd let us know so that we can remove you from the membership list.

Over the past year, Australia Project members have been more active on Discord. We're finding it a fun way to communicate as a project. As you are already a member of the dedicated Australia Project server (WikiAustralia) where all our chat channels are located, we hope you'll join the chat! It's a great way to communicate with other members on your project team/s, or for any general questions.

We're always happy to receive any ideas or suggestions that you have to make our project even better.

Looking forward to hearing from you!

The Australia Project Leadership Team ~ Gillian, Margaret and Veronica

Hi Elsie,

It is once again time for our annual Ireland Project check-in. Please respond within the next three weeks to let us know:

  1. If you would like to continue as an Ireland Project member. If your answer is yes, please tell us if you are happy with your current team, or if you would prefer to join a different one. If you are currently participating in more than one team we would appreciate you ranking them in their order of importance to you, from highest priority to lowest. This information will be helpful as we consider possible future changes to our team structure.
  2. In the past, the project has had a very minimal membership requirement (one contribution per year) for badged members to meet. Do you believe this is adequate, or should this requirement be increased? What do you believe would be a reasonable commitment to expect from all project members?
  3. How active have you been in the Ireland Project over the past year? Please choose one of the following options: a) I normally spend 1-5 hours per month helping achieve my team’s goals. b) I normally spend 6-10 hours per month helping achieve my team’s goals. c) I spend over 10 hours per month helping achieve my team’s goals. d) I am not able to contribute every month but have spent approximately ________ hours during the past year improving Irish profiles.
  4. Please provide feedback on any things you’d like to see the project do more of in the future.

You can respond to this message by posting a reply below or sending me a private message on WikiTree. If we don’t hear from you within the next three weeks we’ll assume your interests have changed or you no longer are able to participate in the Ireland Project at this time, and your badge will be removed. If your circumstances change later you will be welcome to reapply for membership.

Many thanks for all that so many of you have contributed to the project in the past year, and very special thanks to those who answered the project’s call and gave generously of their time to be part of Team Seanchaithe during the most recent connect-a-thon. We are looking forward to hearing from you.

le dea-mhéin, Jen Hutton, Ireland Project co-leader

posted by Jen (Stevens) Hutton
Hi Mary,

It's time for the annual Australia Project membership checkin. Thank you so much for contributing to the project and Australian profiles on WikiTree during the last year. We really appreciate you!

If you would like to stay in the project, please reply to this message or send me a private message to let us know that you would like to stay on. Alternatively, if your WikiTree and research interests have moved away from Australia, please let us know and we can remove you from the membership list for the moment. You will, of course, be very welcome to rejoin the project down the track whenever you want to.

We are also keen to know if you want to make any changes to the team or teams that you want to focus on. Take a look on Australia Project Teams to see what teams there are to choose from. If you want to discuss this, or have any questions or suggestions about the Australia Project we'd love to hear your ideas.

Thanks for taking the time to get back to us!

Gillian, co-Leader, Australia Project

posted by Gillian Thomas
Hi Elsie,

It’s time for our annual Ireland Project check-in! Please respond within the next two weeks to let me know:

  • If you are happy with the team you’re on or if you’d like to make a change. It is now required that all members with an Ireland project badge work on at least one of the project’s team(s), so if you’ve not yet signed up please do so in your reply to this check-in.
  • What you think the project is doing well, and what (if any) changes you would like to see us make? Are there any teams you would like to become more active in?
  • Would you be interested in helping to work on an Ireland Project newsletter?
  • Please give us some feedback on the use of google group and discord. Do you use one or both of these? If you don’t use either of them, what is the best way for us to ensure you receive project communications? If you would like to join us on either one, Just let us know in your response and we will get you signed up.

Please respond to this message by posting a reply below or sending me a private message on WikiTree. If we don’t hear from you within two weeks, we will assume you are no longer interested in participating in the Ireland Project, and your badge will be removed. If you wish to reapply for membership later, we will be happy to have you back. Many thanks, and I look forward to hearing from you!

Sincerely, Jen Hutton, on behalf of the Ireland Project

posted by Jen (Stevens) Hutton
Hi Jen

Please include me in the the Diaspora Team. I would love to see more townlands for County Tipperary, but I don't have sufficient local knowledge to help. I use the google group

warm regards, Mary

posted by Elsie Gorman
Hi Mary,

The Australia Project leadership team are carrying out our annual check-in to see how you are going in the project. We'd really like to thank you for all your work on Australian profiles over the past year! We think we've made great progress in 2020/21 with your assistance.

Please could you reply to this message, to let us know if you would like to stay on in the project and if you are happy with your current role and team involvement. If you would like to do something additional or different, take a look on the Australia Project page to see what other options there are.

It would also be great to get any feedback or suggestions that you have to improve the project.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind Regards

Margaret Haining Membership Coordinator

Hi Margaret

yes I'm still interested and will stay involved with my current projects regards, mary

posted by Elsie Gorman
Thank you for responding to the check-in message, and for your ongoing contributions to WikiTree and the Australia Project, they are much appreciated!

Regards, Margaret

Hi Mary it is Elsie Blanche Gorman born Barrett she married Lawrence Darcy Raymond Gorman. and they are from the Larry Gorman family in Western Australia. a Pioneer of Western Australia. i Know Kylie Haese is researching this side of the family. she is on Wiki Tree Merrilyn Hunter
Hi Merrilyn

Does she have a profile on wikitree? What is your link to Elsie? mary

posted by Elsie Gorman
Hello i sent a reply dont know if i put it on the right place so i am doing it again

Elsie Blanche Gorman born Barrett married Lawrence Darcy Raymond Gorman in 1927 Elsie is the daughter of John Joseph Barrett and Fanny Howard Her mother Fanny Howard is the daughter of |Charles Howard and Emily Cooke who are my Great Grandparents Fanny is my Grandfathers sister , he is Charles howard 1884-1980 and one of 14 Children that Charles Howard 1834 - 23.11.1886 and Emily Cooke 1845-1920 had Elsie Blanche Gorman born Barrett is 4 degrees from me and my 1st cousin once removed my father was her first cousin Raymond Charles Howard 1911 to 1942 he married Ellen Matilda Carson 1918-1999 Merrilyn Hunter born Howard 11715

Hello Mary,

The Australia Project leadership team are carrying out a check-in to see how you are going in the project and especially to thank you for all your work on Australian profiles on WikiTree. We really value your participation.

Please could you get back to me by private message to let me know if you are happy with your current role and team involvement within the project or if you would like to do something additional or different. Currently we have you down as a member of the Indigenous Australians and Convicts teams. If you would like a change, you can check on the Australia Project page to see what other options there are.

It would also be great to hear any feedback and any suggestions that you have to improve the project.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Gillian, co-Leader, Australia Project

posted by Gillian Thomas
Thanks Gillian, I'm happy to carry on with current arrangements, thanks Mary
posted by Elsie Gorman
Related by marriage from the Larry Gorman side of the family , married my cousin in Western Australia Merrilyn Hunter
Hello, Elsie!

Thanks for all the work you accomplished during our Connect-A-Thon 2020. It is amazing how many more profiles were created and added to our Shared Tree. You have every right to be pleased with your efforts!

Kind regards,

Pippin Sheppard ~ WikiTree’s Appreciation Team

posted by Pip Sheppard
Hi Elsie, Dave Kessey was my father in law. We are in Western Australia. His father William emigrated to WA from the UK in 1913, along with his maternal uncle Tredrea. William was the son of Elizabeth Tredrea and Charles Keskeys. William was born in Cornwall. Dave's mother was Margretta Mort from Wales. She followed William out to WA. Dave's christened named is Dafydd Anthony Kessey. The name was gradually changed from Keskeys due to poor handwritten records. They also had family in Hull. I have an extensive family tree on Ancestry. Cheers, Elisa
posted by Elisa Wilson
Hi Mary

On behalf of the Australia Project leadership team, we're carrying out a Project Members Check-in to see if you are still interested in being involved as an active member of the project. In particular, we are ready to launch our new teams for the project. Please could you let me know what team/s you would like to contribute to. A list of teams is on the Australia Project page. Please respond by private message.

We really appreciate your enthusiasm in working on Australian profiles on WikiTree, and thank you for all the work you have been doing. We look forward to hearing back from you and that you will decide to be part of the project as we move forward with the new teams for the project. Regards, Gillian

posted by Gillian Thomas
Hi Elsie,

The Ireland Project (previously the Irish Roots Project) has now changed its structure into Teams. We require everyone with the Ireland Badge to be a member of at least one Team or Sub-Team and our google group. See https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Project:Ireland for details. The Teams are :-

1. Categories Team
2. Counties Team
3. Managed Profiles Team
4. Membership Team
5. Profile Improvement Team
6. Topics Team
7. Diaspora

? Can you let me know if you’d like to stay on in the new project and which team(s) you’d like to join. Please also let me know your e-mail address so that I can get you added to the project’s Google Group or confirm you are already a member of the google group.

Many thanks,


posted by Maria Maxwell
Thanks for the welcome and the kind words on the slavens.net site. I need to freshen up the site, add a bunch of newspaper clippings, etc., besides work on my own trees and WikiTree. Not enough hours in the day!

I was contacted a week ago by a Slaven in Scotland who has roots in Fintona, and thought he might be related to fightin' Frank. I dropped him a quick note but haven't heard back-- probably has better things to do during the holidays!

posted by Larry Slavens
Thank you for adding John Gorman and Bridget Webb of USA. I've made some more additions on my Ancestry tree...have not yet synched with Wikitree

Wish you a Happy New Year. May 2018 bring you all you need to be happy.

Congratulation for adding your contributions in December. Whatever the quantity of your contributions, they all count. As we always say "Quality is better than quantity" to make a great family tree.

Thank you for being a Wikitreer,

Guy Constantineau - Wikitree leader

Hi Elsie. I'm with @Edmond Flood 1151.

I added images for Edward Flood the politician which has your contact on it. I noticed we had possible connections according to wikitree.

Queen E II and Vaclav Z Cechy Wenceslas, (Václav the Good or Saint Wenceslaus was the duke (kníže) of Bohemia). I tried the 'connections' thing and it said:

"No Connection Found ... Yet Sorry, no connection was found between Elsie and Edmond out to 10 steps. There is one, it's just not on WikiTree yet. Please help grow the family connections of Elsie and Edmond until they meet.

posted by Wheels Flood
Hi Mary, I've posted a post of Samuel Byrnes and Eliza Gorman. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Gorman-1671
posted by Rebecca Coombes
Hello Mary,

I'd like to invite you to join in the "Weekend Chat" on G2G Today!

Share personal successes, stories about ancestors, tips, projects you are working on, or anything else you wish.

New members stop in and say Hello, introduce yourself, share your story, or ask for help.

Pilots, Mentors, and Leaders of all kinds please add something... your advice is always greatly appreciated.

Hope to see you there!


posted by Keith Hathaway
Thanks Mary. I put an image up relating to the Kearney/Dwyer marriage http://www.wikitree.com/photo/png/Kearney-543

I found this "Four Kearneys" article to be interesting background reading, although you are probably already familiar with it - http://www.kearneyreunion.com/content/?id=3&l1id=3

posted by Terry Bowden

This week's featured connections are from the War of the Roses: Elsie is 21 degrees from Margaret England, 19 degrees from Edmund Beaufort, 19 degrees from Margaret Stanley, 21 degrees from John Butler, 20 degrees from Henry VI of England, 19 degrees from Louis XI de France, 21 degrees from Isabel of Clarence, 19 degrees from Edward IV of York, 20 degrees from Thomas Fitzgerald, 20 degrees from Richard III of England, 21 degrees from Henry Stafford and 18 degrees from Perkin Warbeck on our single family tree. Login to see how you relate to 33 million family members.