John Scott (bef. 1780)

Born before 1780 in Virginia, United States [uncertain]

Descendants

Died [date unknown] in Alabama, United States [uncertain]

Problems/Questions Profile manager: Gary Pinson [send private message]

Biography

Proof of John Scott’s Parents

His parents are unknown. His daughter’s testimony that he came to South Carolina from Virginia c 1800, makes it probable he was born somewhere in Virginia. The destruction of the 1790 and 1800 Federal censi for Virginia, make it more difficult to narrow the search.

Some have suggested he was the son of Bazil Scott. This is undoubtedly because a Barzil, or Bazil, Scott of an acceptable age was located near John in the 1810 and 20 Spartanburg censi. But, said Bazil Scott was named in the 1790 Spartanburg census, placing him there at least a decade before John Scott’s arrival. For him to be John’s father, he would have had to have left John in Virginia while John was probably still a minor. Lacking solid proof, we can discount the theory that Bazil Scott was his father.

Unless a document, like his testimony, or a Virginia will naming a son, John Scott, of Spartanburg, South Carolina or Cherokee, Alabama appears We will probably never know the name(s) of his parents. We can however, see if a dna match with a person tracing Scott roots back to Virginia appears, then investigate the county where the trail leads in the late 1700’s.

Evidence of Spouse (None!)

Census data indicates John was probably widowed by 1820, remarried by 1830 and widowed again by 1840.

John's daughter Zilpha (aka Zilphia) stated that her father, John Scott, brought the family to Spartanburg S.C. circa 1800 from Virginia. But she didn't name her mother, John's wife. That hasn't stopped people from posting pedigrees proposed one spouse, or another, not realizing how many John Scotts were in Virginia pre 1800.

One of the more illogical proposals comes from Ancestrydna.com's "Thrulines" which proposes ancestors by comparing dna matches trees to an Ancestry.com published pedigree by one of the matches. "Garbage in, garbage out" often describes the result. They propose John's wife was Eleanor Vendevor (1762-1830) and she did marry a John Scott on 2 April 1782. The problem is that John Scott of this page was shown by every census in which he appeared as born in the 1770's, which would have made him a preteen child at the time Vendevor was married.

Another baseless spouse is Frances "Frankie" Woods, alleged daughter of Malone (1742- ?) Wood and Frances (1746- ?) Bishop. Allegedly, Frances “Frankie” Wood married John William Scott (1773-1845) in Greenville Co. S.C. in 1792. But, there is no proof that our John Scott was in Greenville Co SC and our John’s daughter Zilpha Dockery’s testimony is that John migrated to S.C. circa 1800, from Virginia. It’s very unlikely he would go from Greenville Co., SC to Virginia then to Spartanburg, Co., SC.

An extremely embarrassing claim is that John married a Letitia McKendrick in Virginia in 1750. That marriage date is at a minimum, twenty years prior to our John Scott’s birth.

Proof of John Scott’s Children (entered 12/27/2020 by Pinson-796)

1) Proof of parentage for any sibling can be extended as proof of parentage for all known siblings.

2) Zilpha (Scott) Dockery stated her father was John Scott and he moved from Virginia to Spartanburg, South Carolina, when she was three. She born 8 Sept. 1796 in Virginia, so this move was circa 1800. Zilpha stated she had 3 brothers and 7 sisters. Zilpha married William H. Dockery in Spartanburg S.C. when she was 22 (c 1818) and later moved to Alabama per her testimony. We can assume that her father, John Scott, was born prior to 1780, and in fact, his census data for 1810 through 1840 predict a birth date in the 1770’s.

3) In 1837 John Scott, William Scott and William Dockery in order sign the Galesburg Petition in Cherokee County Alabama. Also signing about 24 people later were George Gilbert and his son David, who had also recently moved from Spartanburg, South Carolina. We can assume that John Scott is signing with his son in law William Dockery, husband of Zilpha Scott (more evidence for that later.).

4) Daniel Gilbert, the son of George Gilbert, married Francis Scott in Cherokee County, Alabama c. 1838-40. Daniel’s sister, Jane, testified he had left their father’s house to join the state militia in the spring of 1838 (1838 Seminole Indian war). So, we can assume the marriage was after that date. First time brides usually married in the house of their parents, or a nearby close relative, so Francis’ parents, or siblings must have been nearby.

5) The 1840 Cherokee Co. Alabama Census shows John Scott in his 60’s on page 116. His birth year had to be prior to 1780. His wife is apparently dead, as the eldest female in the house is in her 20’s and there are two adult males (aged 30’s and aged 20’s) in the houshold along with 3 children. The female is probably a younger daughter or a daughter in law. On the next page (117) is Daniel Gilbert with his new wife and on page 120 is Daniel Gilbert’s father, George Gilbert. The only other Scott household is headed by J.J. Scott in his 50’s on page 136, twenty pages from John Scott and Daniel Gilbert. This could be a younger brother or elder son.

6) William & Zilpha (Scott) Dockery, John Scott and Francis Scott’s husband, Daniel Gilbert, all came from Spartanburg, SC to NE Alabama in the 1830’s. Checking the 1820 Spartanburg census, reveals that only 2 Scott households had daughters of Francis Scott’s age group: John Scott had 4, or 80% of the number. Robert Scott had 1, but there is no record of him moving to Alabama. Therefore, Francis (Scott) Gilbert is almost certainly John Scott’s daughter.

7) Zilpha (Scott) Dockery in her interview with the press names a sister in law, Bessie Gilbert. The 1830 Spartanburg S.C. census showed Hiram and Wm. Dockery living next to a James Gilbert. These same two Dockerys along with Hiram Jr. are in 1840 St. Clair Co. Alabama, surrounded by Gilberts. The Gilbert clan was a large one and a large contingent migrated to northeast Alabama from Spartanburg, SC in a couple of waves in the 1820’s and 30’s. This contingent included Daniel Gilbert who married Francis Scott and also his first cousin, Catesey Gilbert, who wed Hiram Dockery in 1835 in neighboring St. Clair (later Etowah) County, Alabama. One of Catesy’s nephews, James Madison Gilbert married Selena Dockery. So, it would be extremely unlikely for Francis Scott Gilbert and Zilpha (Scott) Dockery not to have been closely related.

8) The 1820 Spartanburg, South Carolina Census showed John Scott on page 243, three houses from Isaiih Gilbert and near Dunaways and Littlefields, which are other Gilbert associated families . On the next page are a bunch of Gilbert families including George, Father of Daniel, and his father Thomas Gilbert. The 1830 Spartanburg, South Carolina Census showed John Scott in his 50’s on page 225. That age would match the John Scott in Cherokee County Alabama in 1840. On the same page is William Littlefield Jr, Daniel Gilbert’s maternal grandfather, so it would appear the Scotts and Gilberts were well acquanted prior to their move to Cherokee Co. Alabama which we believe happened c. 1836.

9) I have autosomal dna matches with 43 people at Ancestrydna.com who claim descent from Zilpha (Scott) Dockery, while I am positive my G2GPs are Daniel Gilbert and Francis Scott. These matches predict that Zilpha could be Francis’ much older sister, an aunt, or less likely a first cousin. The latter is very unlikely, because there are only two Scott Families in Cherokee County Alabama in 1840 and Francis was married there only a year, or two, before.

10) In 1845, William Scott patents land in Cherokee Co. Alabama. William Scott signed the Galesburg petition with John Scott, yet there was no William Scott household in the 1840 Cherokee Co. Alabama census. He was likely John’s son and still in his house in 1840.

11) Evelyn Nichols (enichols at dmea.net) on an Alabama Rootsweb internet site wrote on 20 Jun 2001: “My Great Great Grandmother CHARITY SCOTT …born in SC about 1810… married George HOLLINGSHEAD in 1836 in Cherokee County, AL. He died there in 1847. About 1849, CHARITY SCOTT HOLLINGSHEAD married WILLIAM GREEN. They are on the 1850 Cherokee County, AL Census, with two of his children….”

12) In 1850 Cherokee Co Census is William Scott age 32 with wife and a 15 year old Elizabeth Hollandshed, his niece, daughter of Charity Scott Hollenshed Green. Her age puts the Scotts in Cherokee County by 1835. William was not heading a household in the county in 1840 when only John and J.J. Scott were heads of household. But, he fits as John’s son William, who signed the Galesburg document in 1937, when he would have been about 19 based on this census. In the 1850 census for Jefferson County Alabama are Jacob Crews (43) and wife Mahala (27 B SC) with children age 2 and 5/12 and 10 year old Nancy Holenshed (b. Ala.). She was the sister of Elizabeth Hollandshed in William Scott’s household. A third Hollenshed sister, Mahala Evaline, b. 1837, was living with Elijah MATHEWS (b. 1802, SC) and his wife Sarah (b. 1805, SC) in Cherokee Co, AL. We believe, therefore, that William Scott, Charity Hollenshed Green, Mahala Crews and Sarah Mathews were all Scott Siblings.

13) In the early 1840s, George and Charity (Scott) Hollenshed had two more daughters, Octavia and Sarah Ann, bringing them to five daughters total. On ancestrydna.com, I’ve matched two descendents from each of these two daughters. This is added proof that Charity Scott and Francis Scott were sisters.

14) Thomas Edward Jacks (tejacks1970 at aol.com) is an autosomal dna match estimated as a 2nd Cousin - 4th Cousin on FTDNA.Com. Thomas is the 3rd GGS of George Hollenshed and Charity Scott. If Charity was the sister of my 2nd GGM Fannie Scott Gilbert, we would share Fannie and Charity’s parents as common ancestors (they his 4th GGP’s and my 3rd GGP’s), then we’d be 4th cousins once removed. I could see no other explanation in his pedigree for our match.

15) Daniel Gilbert and his new bride Frances Scott were shown in the 1840 Cherokee Co. Census with 3 small girls (one under five and two aged 5-10), but none of these girls are in their 1850 house. Since Daniel and Francis were newly married, and their first known child was born in 1842, these girls had to been her sisters, or nieces, or his. But, they don’t fit as his Gilbert kin, and are too young to be her sisters, so they must have been her nieces. I believe they were the three Hollenshead girls, who had been left in the care of Scott aunts and uncles (see 12) above). These girls, John Scott’s granddaughter, tie various children of his together. Since we have dna matches predicting Charity Scott Hollenshed and Frances Scott Gilbert were sisters, it would appear they were also siblings of William Scott, Mahala Crews and Sarah Mathews, as proof for one falls onto the other.

16) In the late 1840’s, in Cherokee Co. Alabama, Four Scott’s are involved in patents of multiple land parcels. Their first names were John, Joseph, William L. and Moses. Joseph is the assignor of a patent in 5/1/45. His name is followed by an initial that appears to be “J”, so he is presumably the J.J. Scott on the 1840 Cherokee Co Census, but not seen afterwards. This is a “preemption” patent, so there will be a file that goes with it, which will probably document where he came from. He probably moved from the county around 1845. William L. is presumably John Scott’s son and appears in the 1850 census aged 32 with the Hollenshed niece in his household. He must have been the male in his early 20’s found in John’s 1840 Cherokee Co. Alabama household. His patents in the early 1850s list him as William L. Scott of Cherokee County. Moses Scott appears in neither the 1840 or 1850 censi, nor can we find any other records for him other than the patents. But he patents 4 parcels in 1845 and is listed as “Moses Scott of Cherokee County” in all 4 patent documents. He may have been the elder male in John’s 1840 Cherokee Co. Alabama household. Or he may have been a son of J.J. Scott, also in the 1840 Cherokee Co. Alabama census. At this point, he cannot be included as John’s son.

G. PInson

Sources

• 1810 Federal Census for Spartanburg District, South Carolina.
• 1820 Federal Census for Spartanburg District, South Carolina.
• 1830 Federal Census for Spartanburg District, South Carolina.
• 1837 Galesburg (Cherokee County, Ala.) petition to Congress.
• 1840 Federal Census for Cherokee County, Alabama.
• 1850 Federal Census for Cherokee County, Alabama.
• 1850 Federal Census for Jefferson County Alabama
• Various Scott Federal land patents in Cherokee County, Alabama from 1830 to 1860.