Hello-

Please include this error check on profiles for people who were born in México (1521 - present). Spanish naming conventions do not include the use of middle names. See https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Spanish_Naming_conventions:

"Do not use the Middle Name field, but instead the entire first name included in the Proper First Name field (& the radio button “no middle name” selected)."

Thanks! Austin

I was born in the Netherlands and I disagree. Yes, we have no concept of middle names, but we also don't have a first name. We call them all "voornamen" and whatever we usually introduce ourselves by is our "roepnaam" (not to be confused with "bijnaam", which means nickname or preferred name, which is different). Putting the other voornamen in the same place as the roepnaam is silly. It's not the same for all Dutch people.

For example, one person who's full voornamen are Marie Anne Lotte may be called Marie Anne by the parents, whereas another may be called Marie. In one case, Marie Anne is the roepnaam and Lotte is the second name, in another case Marie is the roepnaam and Anne and Lotte are the second and third name. You cannot say that in all those cases, the "first name" box should contain all three names. That is overly simplified.

I personally have been given three first names at birth. I only ever went by the first. My grandmother (private in tree) has six "voornamen" and she also only goes by the first, at best she is sometimes called by the second if we are teasing her. Nobody ever uses any of her other names to refer to her. Not in official situations either. The other names are a formality. So I consider those to be middle names.

Basically: not all names of Dutch people are first names. We don't adhere to the same first name/middle name principle that other countries have, but that doesn't mean we don't have some equivalent of middle names.

I've had multiple of my ancestors' names "corrected" because of this simplification. Can we please at least make the rule that if the profile manager is a Dutch person we just assume they understand the complicated situations of people they've researched better than some random error does? Thanks.

This is why I stopped entering my data! My dbase of over 100.000 people (at this moment 103.358) all born in Groningen, the Netherlands or descending from Groningers, was built by me over the past 45+ years. Many of my families go back to the 1700's and even before that. As I have cancer I wanted to put all my data in wikitree for all to find also after I am gone. But before 1811 most Groningers only had a patronym, that was their only last name, and they are only found in the records by that patronym. That was a LAST name, not a MIDDLE name! When still alive after 1811, from then on they did have a "proper" last name. But they died with that last name, and were born, and evt married on their patronym. I hate putting that down as a middle name, for it was not!

Some relatives did have 2 first names, i.e. a normal middle name. Now all of those are put in Suggestions for me to correct. I do not want to spend my time to correcting what is already right! Like Catharina Henderika Voos (Voos-21) was called Catharina (first name) and Henderika (middle name). Why do I need to correct??? While others that were born with a patronym should get that (their then last name) as a middle name? This is way too much American, it doesnt work where we come from... So pity, I could add so much to wikitree but I quit doing that as it is not according to our official history.

Same btw with all those suggestions for so called wrongly spelled first names: in Groningen for instance Anje and Antje are 2 totally different names, spoken in Gronings they sound very different. They may look similar to americans, but it is NOT where they live(d). Same for Rijke and Rijpke, 2 brothers, yes 2 different names here, that I then get back as suggestions for missspelling... No it isnt, it is a proper name here! Not all the world is American... so maybe you either make wikitree only for americans, or accept the ways of other countries as well. This has put me off, which is really sad but I won't spend most of my time correcting things that are correct already.

The Dutch persons born before 1811 and still alive in 1811 have a different last name at birth (patronymic) than their last name after 1811, because of the French law during the occupation. Indeed no middle name. Then I will not introduce a middle name.

But there are exceptions, in the region of NL-Friesland some people have both (before 1811). In this case I use the middle name for the position of the patronymic.

All my 'errors' are still there week after week although I update the status. My information came FROM the Netherlands and the index to the info definitely is sorted by the FIRST name. I think this is nitpicking.

And furthermore: the tool to Match the WikiTree Watchlist to the FamilySearch Family Tree also uses the concept of a Middle Name for Dutch people.

This may be an issue for some people but not for all. My Dutch ancestors definitely have middle names that are not part of their first names.

I think this is a non issue that should be left out of the warnings, as this is not visible on the pages and causes people to create other mistakes, especially the appearance of the Proper first name as the Preferred name without there being any proof of this.