Descendants of Johann Derr (Doerer, Dörer) and Maria (Echard)

Date: [unknown] [unknown]
Location: Baden-Württemburg, Germany to Montgomery County, Pennsylvania, USA
Surname/tag: Derr, Doerer, Dörer, Echard

Notes of Nancy Fisher

(This can be move to a dedicated space and the pertinent notes copied to profiles of descendants as appropriate)

Johann Martin Derr Family 1691-1763 Old Goshenhoppen Church Records :Montgomery County, PA

Posted 07 Sep 2016 by nafisher2

While researching the records of the Old Goshenhoppen Church in Montgomery County, PA for the relatives of Susanna Roos, I came across Carl Duerr/Derr and his wife Christina Muss. I also came across the name of John Martin Derr. I discovered that John Martin had arrived in Montgomery County, PA in 1728 and was one of the founders of the Old Goshenhoppen Church. Carl has always been listed as the son of a George Martin, but church records list John Martin Derr as his father and Maria Gertraut Eckhard as his mother. Carl (Charles) and Christina Derr-Dry had a large family in PA and then moved to Cabarrus County, NC, where their son Andrew married Barbara Team, daughter of Johan Jacob Diehm/Teem and Susanna Roos. Thank you Lee's Genes Family for extensively researching the Old Goshenhoppen Church Records and posting this information online. It will help us to correct our records - Nancy Fisher

John Martin Derr 1691-1763

Germany - Pennsylvania Weigant -> John Martin

The youngest son of Weigant Darr and Anna Margaretha was born August 26, 1691 in Gross Garda, Heilbronn, Wurtemburg, Germany.

In 1717, he married Maria Gertraut Eckhard, daughter of Peter, who was born 1696 in Rueth near Schellbronn, Germany. They had eight (known) children - the first four born before they emigrated in 1725, the last four were born in Pennsylvania. When they emigrated, only two of the children came with them, which makes me wonder if the other two hadn't died young (especially since there is such a great deal of confusion about them - they tend to be mixed up with the children of Hans Sigmund, once thought to be John Martin's brother).

The children were:

Laurentius 1718 on Candlemas [2 Feb]

Anna Margaretha 1720 died (this is from the Old Goshenhoppen Family Register entry)

Maria Catharina 1721 - m Philip Smith

Johan Jacob 1723 died (this is from the Old Goshenhoppen Family Register entry)

Margaretha Elizabetha 1728 - m Henry Keple

Carolus Ludovicus 1730

Maria Margaretha 1734 - m Jacob Detwiler 11 Dec 1753 at Martin Derr’s house (Old Goshenhoppen records - son Joh. Jacob b 5 Sep 1756, d. 25 Feb 1758 - buried in burial place of his grandfather Martin Deer. His sponsors were Henrich Keppel and wife Eva Greta)

Johan Martin 1737 m Anna Ursula

The children who came with them when they emigrated were Laurentius and Maria Catharina.

1725 ->Pa - Martin Derr - wife Maria Gertraut Eckhard - ch. Maria Catharina, Laurentius Burgert, Annette. Grossgartach, Wuertemberg to Pennsylvania: some early colonial German immigrants. Myerstown, PA: AKB Publications, 1999

1732 - one of the founders of Old Goshenhoppen (Upper Salford, Phila Co - later Montgomery Co). I am sure, having seen the records preserved elsewhere, that there are a lot of documents at the Old Goshenhoppen Church, but I have not looked them up.

1743 April 3 - naturalized

1759 - St Paul's Lutheran, Upper Hanover Twp, Montgomery Johan Jacob Detweiler b 6 Apr 1759, bapt 20 may 1759, conf. 1773 (son of Jacob and Margretha) sponsors martin Dorr and Gertraut

1763 August 24 (before) - died

Marlborough Twp, Montgomery Co, PA Book H, Vol 18, p 537 - Deed (Philadelphia, PA City Hall) -

“This indenture made the 24th day of August in the year of our Lord 1763 between Gertrout Derr widow and Relikt of Martin Derr late of Marlborough Twp., Yeoman, deceased and Lorentz Derr of Berks Co., of Long Swamp Twp., Yeoman, and with Mary Engle his wife; Philip Smith of Richland Twp. of Berks Co., Blacksmith, with Catherine his wife; Henry Keple of Marlborough Twp. Yeoman, with Elizabeth his wife; Carll Lodewick of Marlborough Twp. Yeoman, with Christianna his wife; John Martin Derr of Salisbury Twp. and the County of Northhampton, Wheelwright, with Anna Ursula his wife; Jacob Dettwiller of Upper Hanover Twp. And the County of Philadelphia, Yeoman, with Margaretha his wife, heirs of the said Martin Derr, sold land to Issak Summony innkeeper, etc.”

Notice that neither John Jacob, nor Anna Margaretha, the two children who did NOT emigrate with Joh. Martin and Gertrude, are not listed as heirs. Did they die young? Also there is no Carl Ludwig Derr - just a Carll Lodewick - but I believe the Derr is understood - Carl did marry a woman named Christina.

Sons of Johan Martin Laurentius 1718 - 1769

1718 Feb 2 - born in Germany

1725 emigrated - with his father, mother and sister Maria Catharina - I don’t know why the other two children did not emigrate as well. (One GedCom I’ve seen says they did.) m Maria Engle Johan Martin Derr 18 Feb 1760 Sara Derr 18 May 1762 Adam (Joh. Adam) ~1765 Johannes 17 Aug 1771

1760 - son Joh. Martin b 18 Feb, bapt. 5 Mar 1760 - sp. Martin Dorr & Gertraut St Paul's Lutheran, Upper Hanover, Montgomery (in Burgert)

1762 - dau Sarah b May 18, bapt May 30 - sp. Peter Laur and Sara (St Paul's Lutheran - Burgart)

(The History of the Wagenseller Family from Family Tree Maker’s Genealogy Library - I didn’t see this, another researcher forwarded the info - “There was a Lorentz Derr living in that region at the same period who was probably a brother of John. We find a record, ‘Sarah, daughter of Lorentz and Maria Derr, born May 28, 1762, baptized May 30, 1762,’ and ‘John Martin, son of Lorentz and Maria Derr, born Feb 18, 1760. Sponsors, Martin and Maria Gertrude Derr.’”)

1763 - mentioned in deed as “of Berks Co, Long Swamp Twp.”

1765 - son Joh. Adam born

Lorence Derr and wf [?] Johan Adam Derr c1765/25 Oct 1765 Johan Adam Schmidt and wf [?] Lehigh Church, Lower Macungie Township, Lehigh County, PA - Births/Baptisms, Confirmations, Deaths c. 1750-1790 (from the Lehigh County GenWeb site - this info provided by Tim Conrad.)

1768 - sponsor Anna Margaret Baucher, bapt 16 Sep 1768 parents George and Barbara sponsors Lorentz Duerr, Margaret Grunewaad Allemangel Lutheran - Albany Twp - near Berks/Lehigh border from Ancestry.com: Pennsylvania Church Records - Adams, Berks, Lancaster Counties 1729-1881-

1771 - son Johannes b. (I have no documentation for this one) - d aft 1772 Weisenberg Twp, Northhampton, PA (Laurentius is given a death date of 22 Apr 1769, Northhampton, so.)

Johan Jacob 1723 - ?

Researchers seem to agree on Jacob’s wife and children, but not upon his parents. One group has him the son of Hans Sigmund; another has him the son of John Martin, son of Wiegant. In favor of the Hans S theory: He was married in the same church, on the same day as Hans’s son Melchior. The John Martin people give both him and Lorenz the birthdate of Candlemas - one in 1718, one in 1723 - which seems a bit of a coincidence. He was supposedly left behind in Germany when John Martin emigrated, and then came over by himself. A likely story? On the other hand, Hans S. never emigrated, so his sons would have had to make their own way(s). The Family Register of Old Goshenhoppen lists the son of John Martin as "b. 1723 died" He is not listed in the deed of 1763, which mentions all the heirs of John Martin In favor of the John Martin theory:

The information I have gathered about him is on a page to itself, which see. (Jacob)

Carolus Ludovicus 1730 - 1797

1730 b. Montgomery Co, PA

1755 - Carl Ludwig Derr, single son of Martin Deer, was sp at the baptism of Anna Maria Wacker in 1755 Old Gosehenhoppen records (Upper Salford, Montgomery Twp) - quoted in Burgert. ~1755 m Christina Muss ~1757 - son Ulrich b. Dorr (umlaut), Ullrich bp 4 Dec 1757 Carl & Christina New Goshenhoppen Reformed, Upper Hanover, Montgomery (Humphreys)

1759 - son J. Martin b. July 29 (d 9 July 1776 - 1st Battle of Long Island) Derr, Johan Martin by 29 July 1759 J. Carl & Christina New Goshenhoppen Reformed, Upper Hanover, Montgomery (Humphreys)

1763 - Carll Lodewick of Marlborough twp, yeoman, and Christianna his wife - mentioned in deed as heir of John Martin

?1769 Phila Co tax list Upper Salford Twp - John Bergey, assessor 39 George Derr 250 - - - 6.0.0 39 Charles & Henry Derr, Kepler 160 2 3 - 12.5.4

1772 - Old Gosehenhoppen records (Upper Salford, Montgomery Twp) - quoted in Burgert Anna Christina Durr, daughter of Carl Durr, died 29 June 1772, age 3 years, 4 months, 15 days

1773 - son Johan Michael b 17 May, bapt 13 June - sp Johan Michael Reuter & Gertraut Durr (umlaut), Johan Michael17 May 1773 Carl & Christina St Pauls Lutheran (New Goshenhoppen Lutheran), Upper Hanover, Montgomery (Humphreys)

1773 Good Friday confirmed Ulrich Durr, age 15 years, Johan Martin Durr, 13 1/2 years, sons of Carl Durr

1776 - son Johann Jacob b 4 jan, bapt 4 Feb (Old Goshenhoppen - quoted in Burgert - also in Humphreys)

1777 Doerr, Johannes 25 Mar 1777 Carl & - Old Goshenhoppen Reformed, Upper Salford, Montgomery (Humphreys)

1783 Doerr, Anna Christina 14 Feb 1783 Carl & - Old Goshenhoppen Reformed, Upper Salford, Montgomery (Humphreys)

1797 Oct 16 d - Cab, NC I don’t know where this is - I wonder if it is supposed to be Cabarrus County? He seemed to change his church affiliation fairly often - I wonder if there is more than one person here?

Johan Martin 1737-1813 1737 b. Montgomery Co, PA ~1760 [1786 April 25 - typo for 68?] - m Anna Maria Ursula Cassel, Montgomery Co, PA 1761 Jan 14 - dau Anna Margaretha b Allentown [d 1812, Frederick Co, MD] - m Henry Gross 1782 Fred. Co, MD Deerr, Anna Margaretha 14 Jan 1761 Johan Martin & Anna Ursula Old Goshenhoppen Reformed, Upper Salford, Montgomery (Humphreys) 1761-2 - moved to Allentown (then Northampton Town), Northampton (now Lehigh) Co 1762 - on tax list for Northampton Town 1763 March 9 - dau Anna Christena b. [d 22 Dec 1842] - m Felty Shyrock? - m George Valentine Shyrock 1783 Fred Co MD 1763 October 8 - massacre at Whitehall appeal sent to Governor - one of 24 signers from Northampton Town = John Martin Dourr 1763 - mentioned in deed as being of Salisbury Twp, Northhampton Co 1767 March 22 - dau Maria Elizabeth b - m George Snowdeagle 1769 son George b Allentown [d 4 July 1819, Gorham/Hopewell, Ontario, New York] -m Mary LeFevre 1786 Fred. Co, MD- 5 ch. 1770 dau Catherine b - m Morningstar d bef 1809? ? dau Anna Maria b PA - m George Miller (confused with Barbara?) 1773 Apr 17 - son Peter b [d 17 Aug 1773] Allentown (now Lehigh Co) 1774 - John Martin & Anna Maria Ursula sponsors of John Jacob s/o John & Susanna Duerr (Allentown) 1775 Dec 6 - dau Maria Barbara b. Frederick Co, MD - d. by 1800 - m George/Henry Miller, dau Betsy 1775 Dec 6 - son Johan Martin b. Frederick Co, MD [d~1823 Frederick Co, MD] -m Elizabeth Brim (1781-1848, b. Lewistown, MD Methodist) - 9 ch. 1776 August 9 - John Martin purchased land in Frederick Co Maryland. 1778 Jan 12 - dau Maria Eva b - m Conrad Holtzman 1795. Div. 18 Jan 1815 1780 Apr 30 - dau Susanna b Frederick Co MD - m Henry Miller (m 22 Feb 1800) - widower of her sister christened at Evangelical Luteran - Zion Church, Middletown, Frederick, MD 1781 - dau Sally b Frederick Co, MD - m Dillinger bef 1787 m Elizabeth Unknown in Maryland 1790 - Frederick Co, MD John Martin Derr 63 (201) 3 1 7 0 0 1800 - Frederick Co, MD - Emmitsburg 878 John Martin Darr 10001 00101 (285) sons? George Darr 12010 01010 John Darr 00100 01000 1800 - Frederick Co, MD I did not look these up - there were 4 Js and one Jo (also an F and a P) 1813 April 27 d - Frederick Co, MD will dated 22 Nov 1809 - Liber R, B no 3, Folio 205 John Martin Derr Frederick Co MD, d 27 Apr 1813 widow - Elizabeth children - Margaret - w/o Henry Gross Christena Shyrock, widow of Felty George Elizabeth w/o George Snowdeagle Catherine Morningstar dec’d - heirs Eva Holtzman, deserted w/o Conrad Mary Miller, heirs Barbara, dec’d w/o George Miller (child Betsy) John (m d/o Capt John Steiner) Susanna w/o Henry Miller Sally w/o Dillinger

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Page last updated 19 October 2005