upload image

Entries for Zellers and Anna Battorfin on the Hunter Subsistence Lists (1710-1713)

Privacy Level: Open (White)
Date: [unknown] [unknown]
Location: New Yorkmap
Surname/tag: Palatine_Migration, Zeller, Batdorf
This page has been accessed 509 times.

Contents

Background

In an attempt to sort out conflicting and contentious issues surrounding the Palatine families Zeller and Batdorf, I've created a detailed chronological collation of their entries from the Journal Section of Governor Hunter's subsistence lists. This shows the relationships among these 3 households during 1710-1712.

UPDATE: OCT 2023: I have updated this freespace page by adding a similar independent analysis of the Hunter Lists published in 2012 by the genealogist John Vallentine, in his last version of his well-regarded Zeller family book, "The Tulpehocken Zellers" [available as a .pdf at FamilySearch]. An inspection of the primary sources used by Vallentine and those used by Rohrbach and Jones for their full (2002) translations of the Hunter Lists reveals that the primary data originate from the same microfilm images of the originals stored in London. Thus, in theory, the two compilations should be identical. And indeed, with a few exceptions noted below, the two compilations are identical and independent transcriptions of the primary data.

Vallentine transcribed and tabulated all of the Hunter List entries for the two Zellers and for Anna Battorfin, and he did this for BOTH the Journal version and the Ledger version, as shown on pages 13-14 of his 2012 mongraph. The independent analysis of the Hunter Lists below strongly suggests that when Vallentine tabulated his data, he mistakenly "swapped" the Journal column and the Ledger column. The data Vallentine calls "Ledger" originates from the Journal section--and the one he calls "Journal" originates from the Ledger section. This transposition of the two columns does not affect the conclusion that the Hunter Lists related to the Zellers and Anna Battorfin, especially the important caveat that the early entries show large variations in household size, and these variations afford themselves to different interpretations of the data.

Some background is useful for interpreting the lists. Here is how Lewis Bunker Rohrbach, CG describes the lists[1]

The lists exists in two variations. The first or Journal Section contains a complete list of all the subsistence payments 1710-1713, arranged chronologically rather than alphabetically, on pages numbered consecutively from 1 through 156. The entries list all payments made, arranged by date. They include the person the payments were made to, the basis of payment, the place the payments were made, and sometimes other information. The basis of payment was the number of days paid and the number of persons "above" age ten (i.e. aged 10 and above) and the number under age 10 in each family. The subsistence payment was set consistently throughtout the period at 6 pence sterling per day for those ten and above, and 4 pence for those under ten. The Journal Section also contains a reference to the page number in the Ledger Section which contains the same payments.

Jones points out that the juxtaposition of names in the Journal Section often hints at common origins and family relationships, and that for that reason he has used the Journal Section for most of his research. The Journal Section has never been published before, in part or in whole [written in 2002]. Because of the additional data contained in it, it is the Journal Section of the Hunter Lists which has been transcribed here verbatim by Marlene Groves, CG.

The second or Ledger Section was drawn from the Journal Section; probably at almost the same time. The Ledger Section consists of a rearrangement of payments from the Journal Section into family sections arranged alphabetically, which sections were numbered consecutively from 1 through 847. The listings include references to the page numbers of the Journal Section from which the data were drawn. Hank Jones mentions that he used the Ledger Section primarily for the family numbers, which are cited here and elsewhere in his monumental works as "Hunter Lists #217", etc. Portions of the Ledger Section, primarily the first and last entry for each family, were published some time ago by Lou D. MacWethy. [i.e., "The Book of Names"].

Based on what Rohrbach writes above, it would seem that the Journal Section was written first and that the Ledger Section was drawn from it. However, Rohrbach goes on to describe a specific entry in the lists of one Peter Helmer (Hunter Lists #294) that seems to refute this assumption. Rohrbach concludes:

Quite likely, the Journal Section and the Ledger Section were written at almost the same time. The value of the Hunter LIsts to both genealogist and historians of colonial New York is enormous. The lists clearly show the changes in family size and age distribution as time passes during the period of the payments...An added bonus is that many widows who remarried during the period 1710-1713 are identified by maiden name and/or the name of their deceased husband...Individual family researchers working with the minute data in the Hunter Lists should be able to discover or confirm many details on their families. Hank Jones and I would love to hear of the results of such detailed and documented work you do.

Independent Compilations Published by John Vallentine

In 2012, the genealogist John F. Vallentine first compiled and published a specific listing of Hunter Lists entries for the two male Zellers and Anna Battorfin.[2][3] Vallentine's compilations were listed BOTH by their Journal Section entry and by their Ledger Section entries, published side-by-side. In a number of instances discussed below, the household sizes for the same dated entry differ between the Journal and Ledger entries. This observation made by Vallentine is yet another reason why any particular interpretation of the Zeller and Batdorf households is often equivocal. Indeed, Rohrbach concluded his analysis of the Lists by writing the following, "a great deal of data lies in the spefic entries, often with an equal amount of confusion."

Listed directly below is a compilation of the ambiguities in the Hunter Lists, curated from two independent transcriptions of the same primary data set. The vast majority of the ambiguities originate in the primary data. However, for the 25 Mar 1711 date, I identified one small difference between what was transcribed by Vallentine versus Jones & Rohrbach.

List of Ambiguities between two compilations from the Primary Data

Vallentine's compilation has swapped column headings. The column he labels as "Journal" is data from the Ledger section--and the column he labels as "Ledger" is data from the Journal section.

  • 30 Jun 1710: Heinrich Zeller has 2 people over 10 in his household on the Ledger Entry, but 3 people on the Journal Entry. Anna Battorffin's household on this date shows (3,0)
  • 4 Jul 1710: Heinrich Zeller does not have a Journal Entry but he does have a Ledger Entry showing a household of (1,4). Similarly, Anna Battorffin does not have a Journal Entry, but does have a Ledger entry showing a household of (5,0). If the July 4 entries are correct, the combined households of Heinrich and Anna Battorffin increased from 5 people to 10 people in only 5 days.
  • 25 Mar 1711: Vallentine's compilation shows a household of (2,3)--while the transcription published by Jones and Rohrbach (2002) shows a household of (3,3) This discrepancy is found on both Journal and Ledger entries,
  • 24 Jun 1711: this is the date of the first appearance of the name "Johann George" Zeller on the Journal entries of the Hunter Lists, whereby a "Johann George Zeller's son" is listed as living in the same household as Anna Battorfin (5,0). This is confusing because, on that same date, a new household was created on the Hunter Lists--and it was called "Anna Battorffin & John Zeller" (4,0). Vallentine notes that when this entry--along with the other two mentions of "George" in later entries in the Journal--always appears as "Johannes" on the Ledger Entries. This date's entries provide support to the hypothesis that the father of Johannes Zeller was named Johann George Zeller. There are ambiguities. Was Anna Battorffin's household separate--or did she have a duplicate entry for that date? And if she was duplicated, why did the size of her household change from 5 to 4? Another factor to consider is that this entry was made almost one full year after the first entries for Johann Heinrich Zeller and Anna Battorfin. The rapid changes in household size might have occurred as more ships arrived over the summer, carrying other family members.
  • 29 Sept 1711. On this date the Journal entry reads, Johann George Zeller & An: Battorffin are listed with 5 adults over 10. According to Vallentine, the same Ledger entry is listed under "Johannes Zeller." This entry is later transferred to page 211 of the Ledger Section. This is interesting because in the prior entry, a similar entry was placed in in the Anna Battorfin household.--but now it is "reassigned" to Johannes Zeller. NOTE: for the same date, we find a separate entry for Anna Battorffin, living with 3 over 10. This entry is transferred to page 5 of the ledger section (which was the original ledger entry for the widow Battorfin for the early 1710 entries).
  • 24 Dec 1711: entries for the family of Johannes Zeller appear to have been duplicated--i.e., there are two sets of similar but not identical sets of data. On one duplicate, the household is called "George Zeller and Anna Battorffin (4,0) on the Journal Entry but becomes Johannes Zeller on the Ledger Entry. On the other duplicate, the entry is "Johannes Zeller" throughout. This is also the last chronological entry that features a possible cohabitation between Anna Battorffin's household and that of Johannes Zeller. From this point on, the household of Anna Battorffin appears to be separate from that of Johannes Zeller. From this point forward, when Anna Battorffin appears on the lists independently, her household size varies between (4,0) and (1,0)
  • The household of Anna Battorfin lacks 4 Journal Entries--but she lacks only 2 Ledger Entries. These omissions seem to have no rhyme or reason relative to the household of Johannes Zeller.

Chronological Journal Entries using the Rohrbach & Jones 2002 Transcription

With the above background and caveats in mind, here is an independent chronological listing of the two Zellers (who were probably brothers, but also could have been uncles or cousins) and Anna Battorfin, who was a widow of Peter Batdorf and whose entries are inter-mingled with the household(s) of the Zellers. This compilation relies on the Ledger section of the full Hunter Lists published by Jones and Rohrbach in 2002 The page numbers on the ledger list are relevant because, throughout the list, they correspond to different family groups that received payments. Thus:

  • Entries transferred to p. 210 refer to the "household" of Johann Henrich Zeller (Hunter List #839). The first entry date is 30 Jun 1710
  • Entries transferred to p. 4 or 5 refer to the "household" of Anna Battorfin (Hunter Lists #18), probable widow of Peter Batdorf, who died en route to America. The first entry date is 30 Jun 1710. NOTE Anna is also represented by an additional profile on Wikitree, that is Anna Catharina Batdorf
  • Entries transferred to p. 211 refer to what is apparently a joint "household" (Hunter lists # 840), consisting of Johannes Zeller AND Anna Battorfin. The first entry date for this household occurs one full year after the two above, that is, 24 Jun 1711.

Other points to consider: The first name of the male head-of-household connected to p. 211 differs according to the entry. In chronological order, he is named as: "Johann George Zellers son," "John Zeller," "Johann George Zeller,"George Zeller," and "Johannes Zeller." In later Schoharie NY records, he is almost always named as Johannes Zeller. The changing forenames create confusion and are open to interpretation. For example, based on the single entry of 24 Jun 1711, the name of the father presumably of both Zellers would be Johann George. It is also possible that the English-speaking people who wrote the Lists did not easily distinguish between the German" Johann Georg" and "Johannes:" in both cases they might be listed as "John." All-in-all, the least confusing names for the sons are "Johann Heinrich" and "Johannes." The name "Johann George" Zeller might best be reserved as the possible name of their father. A Wikitree profile for Johann George Zeller (~1616-~1712) exists that represents him, but sources from German records are required to prove/disprove that he is indeed the father. For the sons, Wikitree currently has one profile for Johnann Heinrich, and one profile for his brother: Johannes Zeller. On some secondary genealogies for Johannes Zeller, he is mis-named as "Johannes George" Zeller. This is probably a conflation of the name of the son Johannes Zeller and his probable father, Johann George Zeller. On Wikitree, all mentions of "Johannes George" Zeller have been edited to simply say Johannes Zeller.

1 Jul 1710: Johann Henrich Zeller listed on the journal section of the Hunter Lists with 2 persons over 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 210 of the ledger section.

4 Aug 1710. Johann Henrich Zeller' listed on the journal section of the Hunter Lists with 1 persons over 10 and one person under 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 210 of the ledger section. NOTE: for the same date on the list Anna Battorffin (probably a widow of Batdorf) with 5 people over 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 5 of the ledger section of the list.

4 Oct 1710. Johann Henrich Zeller listed on the journal section of the Hunter Lists with 4 persons over 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 210 of the ledger section of the list. NOTE: for the same date on the list, Anna Battorffin (probably a widow of Batdorf) is listed with 4 people over 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 5 of the ledger section of the list.

31 Dec 1710. Johann Henrich Zeller listed on the journal section of the Hunter Lists with 2 persons over 10 and 2 under 10. NOTE: for the same date on the list, Anna Battorfin (probably a widow of Batdorf) is listed with 4 people over 10.

25 March 1711. Johann Henrich Zeller listed on the journal section of the Hunter Lists with 3 persons over 10, and 3 under 10. NOTE: for the same date on the list, Anna Battorffin (probably a widow of Batdorf) is listed with 4 people over 10.

24 Jun 1711. Johann Henrich Zeller is listed with 3 people over 10, and 2 under 10. NOTE: for the same date on the list, we find the first mention of a Johann Georg. The list shows Johann Georg Zellers Son & An: Battorff (probably the widow Battorff); they are listed with 5 people over 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on page 5 of the ledger section, which confirms that this is the same family as Anna Battorfin's earlier "solo" entries. This seems to imply that a son of Johann Georg Zeller has joined the widow's household. NOTE: for the same date on the list, we find an entry for Anna Battorfin & John Zeller, living with 4 people over age 10. This entry is later transferred to page 211 of the ledger section of the list. This shows that a new ledger entry was created on this date on p. 211 for the new "household" of the widow Anna Battorfin and John Zeller.

29 Sept 1711. Henrich Zeller is listed with 3 people over 10, and 1 under 10. This entry is later transferred to a family listed on p. 210 of the ledger section. NOTE: on the same date for the list Johann George Zeller & An: Battorffin are listed with 5 adults over 10. This entry is later transferred to page 211 of the Ledger Section. NOTE: for the same date, we find a separate entry for Anna Battorffin, living with 3 over 10. This entry is transferred to page 5 of the ledger section (which was the original ledger entry for the widow Battorfin for the early 1710 entries).

24 Dec 1711. Henrich Zeller listed with 3 people over 10 and 1 under 10. This entry is transferred to a family on p. 210 of the ledger section. On the same date, Georg Zeller & An: Batterffin are listed with 4 people over 10, and this entry is transferred to page 211 of the ledger section (i.e., the entry for a new "household" that was created in June of the same year NOTE: on the same date, Johannes Zeller is listed with 4 people over 10; this entry is ALSO transferred to page 211 of the ledger section, which places it in the same "household" as Georg Zeller & An: Batterffin. NOTE: on the same date, the widow Anna Battorffin is listed with 4 people over 10 years. This entry is transferred to page 5 of the ledger section.

25 Mar 1712. Henrich Zeller is listed with 2 people over 10, and 1 under 10. This entry is transferred to page 210 of the ledger section. NOTE: Directly below, this entry, we find Johannes Zeller with 3 people over 10 years. This entry is transferred to page 211 of the ledger section. NOTE: there is no entry for Anna Battorfin or An: Battorffin for his date.

24 Jun 1712. Henrich Zeller is listed with 3 people over 10 years, and 1 person under 10 years. This entry is transferred to page 210 of the ledger section. NOTE: Directly below this entry, we find Johannes Zeller, with 4 people over 10 years, and 1 person under 10 years. NOTE: Anna Batrtorfen is listed for the same date as 1 person over 10 (i.e., her household now consists of just her); this is transferred to page 5 of the ledger section.

13 Sep 1712. Henrich Zeller is listed with 3 people over 10, and 1 under 10. This entry is transferred to page 210 of the ledger section. NOTE: on the same date (but not directly under Henrich), Johannes Zeller is listed with 5 persons over 10; this is transferred to page 211 of the ledger section. NOTE: there is no entry for Anna Battorfin or An: Battorffin for his date.

Sources

  1. Even More Palatine Families (2002), a 3-volume work, authored by Lewis Bunker Rohrbach Rohrbach and Henry Z. Jones, (p. 1780-1782)
  2. Vallentine cites the following (1980) source for his transcriptions and compilations of Zellers on the Hunter Lists: Dr. Graeff Manuscripts, Genealogical Society, Salt Lake City (Film 13683, parts 1-30 records selected by Dr Graeff at the Public Records Office, London, England. From The Palatine Immigrant, Vol. V, No. 4, Spring, 1980, p. 176
  3. The original images of the journals transcribed and published in 2002 by Jones & Rohrbach by are stored in the Public Records Office, CO 5: 1230 & 123.




Collaboration
  • Login to edit this profile and add images.
  • Private Messages: Contact the Profile Managers privately: Palatine Migration WikiTree and Michael Schell. (Best when privacy is an issue.)
  • Public Comments: Login to post. (Best for messages specifically directed to those editing this profile. Limit 20 per day.)


Comments: 2

Leave a message for others who see this profile.
There are no comments yet.
Login to post a comment.
According to NY Gov. Hunters subsistence records there was three Zeller immigrant men: Johann George Zeller and his sons Johann Henrich and Johannes who is not recorded as Johannes George in any record.
posted by Jim Baucom Jr.
Correct. Only in later secondary genealogies is the name "Johannes George" sometimes incorrectly applied to Johannes Zeller. Indeed, "Johannes George", would not be a proper German usage. On Wikitree entries and mentions for Johannes Zeller, the second name "George" has always been put in parentheses to acknowledge this mistake introduced ad hoc. But perhaps it would be better to remove "George" altogether from all mentions of Johannes to avoid confusion. Or, the name "George" could be relocated to the "other names" section of the profile for Johannes. In this free-space space, I will edit such that there is one mention of the mis-attribution of George in the intro and remove all other usages of "George" when mentioning Johannes.

In Gov. Hunter's subsistence records, the name "George" is found 3 times:

  • 24 Jun 1711: Johann Georg Zellers Son & An: Battorff
  • 29 Sep 1711: Johann Georg Zeller & An Battorffin
  • 24 Dec 1711: Georg Zeller & An: Batterffin
posted by Michael Schell
edited by Michael Schell