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Robert Wynne (1558 - 1609)

Robert Wynne
Born in Shrewsbury, Shropshire, Englandmap
Son of [father unknown] and [mother unknown]
[sibling(s) unknown]
Husband of — married [date unknown] [location unknown]
Descendants descendants
Died in Canterbury, Kent, Englandmap
Profile last modified | Created 31 Mar 2011
This page has been accessed 5,372 times.

Contents

Biography

Robert Wynne (Mayor) Born: 1558/63 Salop, (Now Shrewbury), in Stottesdon, Shropshire Co., England  Died:  6 Sep 1609 St. Georges Parish, Canterbury, Kent, England  Buried:  St. George's Parish,  Canterbury, Kent, England

m. 1590/91 Canterbury, Kent, England to Frances Wattmer Born: 1565 Canterbury, Kent, England  Died:  8 Sep 1609 St Georges, Canterbury, Kent, England  Buried: St Georges, Canterbury, Kent, England (?the daughter of William Watmoughe/Wattmore and Margaret Sparkes/Parkes) 0r possibly dau. of William Wattmer and Joanna Hatch-)

Robert was a Woolen draper, a member of the Woolendrapers Guild (wool tailors union), He was an apprentice to John Rose, released from his indenture in 1590. Six years later Robert was the Mayor of Canterbury, England, and held that office from 1596-1599. He and Frances died of the Plague within 2 days of each other. Francis' father William Wattmer took the Wynne children to a house outside the city and procured a nurse for them. It was William who raised the children. In an Ecclesiastical Deposition dated 1604 he states that he came to Canterbury in 1579 and was in Swaddling Clothes in Shrewsbury, Salop (Shropshire) in 1558.

Birth

Robert Wynne was born in 1558 in Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England.[1]

Marriage

Robert married Frances Wattmer, daughter of William Watmoughe/Wattmore/Wattmer and Margaret circa 1590.[1]

Death and Burial

Robert died on September 6, 1609, in Canterbury, Kent, England, at the age of 51, and was in St George's Church (demolished), Canterbury, City of Canterbury, Kent, England. [1]

Genealogy Note

This profile DOES NOT represent the Robert Wynn who was the son of Sir John Wynn of the house of Gwydir in Caernarvonshire, Wales. That Robert was a lawyer. He is not the same person as this Robert Wynn who was a woollen draper of Shrewsbury and Canterbury who later became Mayor of Canterbury.

Occupation

Robert was born in 1558 and was originally from Shrewsbury (*1) Robert was a member of the Woolendrapers Guild and became the Mayor of Canterbury in 1599. In an Ecclesiastical Deposition dated 1604 he states that he came to Canterbury in 1579 and was in Swaddling Clothes in Shrewsbury, Salop (Shropshire) in 1558.[1]

DNA

Robert is part of the BY3290 DNA project at wikitree. See https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:BY3290_SNP_Project

Based on current thinking (July 2017) descendants of Robert should be expected to test positive for the SNP BY3290.

There are a large number of descendants of this Wynn family in the Wynn DNA project at FamilyTreeDNA. See https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/winn/about/background

Will

The Will of Robert Wynne, Mayor of Canterbury Transcribed and submitted by Dorothy Tuttle

This is the last will and Testament a nuncupative of Robert Wynne late of the parish of St. Mary Bredman in the City of Canterbury, Alderman deceased by him uttered and declared for his last will and testament he being in good and perfect memory on the fourth day of ye month of September 1609 in these words following or the like in effort viz the said Robert Wynne being moved to make his will he said his will was quickly made for he did give and bequeath to Frances his wife the one half of his goods and chattels and the other halfe of his good and chattels he did give & bequeath to his children and he did move and appoint Frances his wife to be Executrix of his will & he named William Wattmer his brother to be his overseer and the said Robert Wynne further willed that Frances his wife should pay to Sara Effield her legacy given her in ye will of Christopher Effield her father deceased of whom the said Robert Wynne was Executor. He should leave enough behind him to discharge the same. Witnesses present at the uttering of the promises by the said Testator Robert Wynne for his last will and testament. Joseph Colege, Mr. James Bissell, Clerk, Leonard Ashendon and others. s/ James Bissell, Leonard Ashendon. Probatum: (Proved) 5 Dec 1609 by witness John Fish, Executor James Bissell & Supervisor William Watmer. (Canterbury Wills, Comistory Court of Canterbury, Vol. 41 folio 4, FHL Film 188854)

Sources

  1. 1.0 1.1 1.2 1.3 Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 03 February 2019), memorial page for Robert Wynne (1558–Sep 1609), Find A Grave Memorial no. 80396799, citing St George's Church (demolished), Canterbury, City of Canterbury, Kent, England ; Maintained by Shari Hanson Frey (contributor 47119699) .
  • 1 Ecclesiastical Deposition dated 1604 he states that he came to Canterbury in 1579 and was in Swaddling Clothes in Shrewsbury, Salop in 1558.

The parish records of St. George's in Canterbury show he and his wife were buried two days apart in September, 1609. Their deaths were in connection with a visitation of the plague to Canterbury, either bubonic plague, or typhus. The outbreak was severe. They left five young children orphans, and had it not been for the kindness of their uncle, William Watmer, they would have been destitute. He saw to it they were removed from the infected house until it was cleansed, and reclothed, housed, and looked after them during the quarantine. Then he boarded [BO:Peter:BO] and John with Rowland Dixon, the tailor, to follow an apprenticeship in their father's trade. Thomas was old enough to assume the responsibilities of his parent's house, Uncle William took Elizabeth and Anne to his home, and looked after the financial affairs of the young children. There is a detailed article of several pages length in the Archaeologia Cantiana, published by the Kent Archaeological Society, 1948, by Dorothy Gardiner, which tells of the dealings of "A Mayor of Canterbury: William Watmer, the Children's Friend". http://www.penjaccphoto.com/penleyged/nti04369.htm



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Comments: 7

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I am Esther Ginn, and I too am a Gwynn /Wynn researcher and decided to leave Sir John Wynn and Sidney Gerard out of the picture for awhile and see if I could find familiar names on Wynne-74 in laws.

First, I found this : https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/memories/L8ST-QT2 A pedigree from the Visitation of Kent in 1619. It shows the line of Robert Wynn's wife, Francis Watmer. Her brother is William Watmer, born 1569 in Shropshire who married secondly Joan Hatch, daughter of Thomas Hatch. link that discusses his alignment with the Wynn family: https://www.kentarchaeology.org.uk/sites/default/files/archcant/1986%20102%20A%20Notary%20of%20Canterbury%20New%20Light%20on%20William%20Watmer%20A%20Seventeenth%20Century%20Mayor%20Whatmore.pdf ...."the strongest reason is to be found in family ties, especially with the Wynnes, a Canterbury family also originating in Shropshire. ...in the dictated will of Robert Wynne, a woollen merchant who became mayor, implies that Watmer's sister Frances was his wife. ..."Watmer was to have a fateful relationship with the children of Robert and Frances Wynne,

ancient history regarding Shropshire shows it very much a part of Wales as the Kingdom of Powys. Powys Castle is 19 miles from Shropshire (Salop) where Wynn-74 was born in 1558. From another site link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powis_Castle "The ancient Kingdom of Powys had once included the counties of Montgomeryshire, much of Denbighshire, parts of Radnorshire and previously large areas of Shropshire, but by the 13th century had been reduced to two independent principalities - Powys Wenwynwyn and Powys Fadog " going back to the pedigree of Watmough: the common ancestor that begins the two lines of Watmough, is John Watmoughe of Eccleston, Lancashire. Robert Wynne-74 in -laws are on the Shropshire side while the left side is of the Watmough of Lancashire line. In this line is Richard Watmough d: 1578 married Constance Gerard, daughter of Thomas Gerard of Ince, esq. This is the same Gerard line of Sir William Gerard Lord Chancelor of Ireland, father in law of Sir John Wynne 1st Baron of Gwydir. to summarize, Robert Wynne-74 was married to Frances Watmer /Watmough(e) of the Shropshire line and her Watmer cousin of the Lancashire line (the shared ancestor being John Watmough,) married into the Gerard family of Ince in Makerfield Lancashire. I find, Gwynn/ Wynn lines both in early Virginia and in Wales and England, to be quite related all the way back to and before the Norman Conquest. Welsh research can be difficult b/c of the naming before surnames began to be used, but reading several Welsh pedigrees and research it does shows up. I have found documentation to show that Nell Gwyn mistress of Charles II and mother of his son Charles Beauclerk was related to Henry I known as Henry Beauclerc who fathered a child with Nest verh Rhys, daughter of Rhys ap Tudur, of Deheubarth. The Welsh Tudor Kings are connected and many of what they called the Norman nobility that received lands for fighting with and for William the Conqueror are also connected. Raglan Castle and William ap Thomas whose son, took the name Herbert (of Raglan and Pembroke and Powys Castles) etc etc etc.....

posted by Esther Ginn
Everything I have found so far has had Sir John and Sydney as Robert's parents. Since starting on this site, I have found all in my tree to be correct and now, this has thrown a monkey wrench into family lines.

Is there anything definitive that shows different parents for Robert. I have removed Sir John and Sydney as parents, but I need somethin else. Can anyone help???

posted by Arthur Van Riper Jr
Find A Grave Index

Name Robert Wynne Event Type Burial Event Place Canterbury, City of Canterbury, Kent, England Photograph Included Y Affiliate Record Identifier Find A Grave: Memorial #80396799 Cemetery St George's Church (demolished) Citing this Record "Find A Grave Index," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV2Y-Y31F : 13 December 2015), Robert Wynne, ; Burial, Canterbury, City of Canterbury, Kent, England, St George's Church (demolished); citing record ID 80396799, Find a Grave, http://www.findagrave.com.

posted by Andrea (Stawski) Pack
Please include a link to the evidence that Robert’s direct paternal line has the DY3290 SNP.
posted by Peter Roberts
Wynn-1290 and Wynne-74 do not represent the same person because: Hi Danni. Thanks for suggesting a merge of Robert Wynn of Gwydir and Robert Wynn of Canterbury. I am far from an expert on this line, my interest being that my Y-DNA test suggests that I am related to Robert of Canterbury whose descendants appear to share the BY3290 Y-DNA mutation with me. Both profiles on wikitree are light on primary sources and I am been trying to track down better sources over the last year. Can I suggest that the merge is put on hold until more research and discussion has taken place. I did start a G2G discussion thread for this a year ago and also reached out to the Wynn DNA project on FTDNA.

My understanding is that some researchers in years past thought the two Roberts were the same person but there has been a shift of opinion in more recent years. My understanding in the argument that they are not the same person is that.. . Robert of Gwydir son of Sir John and Sydney was Welsh and from Gwydir but Robert of Canterbury said himself in a disposition that he was born in Shrewsbury in England. . Robert of Gwydir was a lawyer and Robert of Canterbury was a Woolen Draper. . Robert of Gwydir was supposed to be the 4th? son of Sir John but the Barnonetage was eventually inherited by the son of Sir John's son Henry who was Sir John's 10th and youngest son. If Robert of Gwydir had surviving heirs they would have become the Baronets as an older son rather than Henry's line.

. The Wynn line of Baronets has been extinct since the 5th Baronet. This would not be the case if Sir John had any surviving male line descents. As Robert of Canterbury is know to have descendants in the male line that senior line would be Baronets now if Robert of Canterbury had been the son of Sir John but the line is extinct. Useful link about the Baronets http://yba.llgc.org.uk/en/s-WYNN-GWY-1300.html G2G Discussion link https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/434722/any-wynn-experts-here?show=434722#q434722

posted by Earl Davis
Wynn-1290 and Wynne-74 appear to represent the same person because: http://www.thefourwinns.net/winn.html shows that Robert was the son of John & Sidney. Multiple pedigree indexes show this lineage.
posted by Danni Pritchett
Lindsay, There is something wrong here. Robert died in 1609 and mentioned wife Frances in his Will, but he is shown as marrying Mary Wickham in 1613.

Vic

posted by Vic Watt

Rejected matches › Robert Wynn (abt.1573-)

W  >  Wynne  >  Robert Wynne

Categories: Wynne | Y-DNA Haplogroup R1b-DF27