Her dad is recorded as Albert Kingsley - where did he come from? Who is Libbeus Kingsley?

Question

In among the good French Canadian names in the parish register, suddenly there is the family name Kingsley.  His name is Albert and he spells his own surname something like Camsley.  (He uses the old-fashioned long 's', and it has even been transcribed as Camzelay.)

Here he is at nosorigines

The plot thickens - lots of family researchers equate him with one Libbeus Kingsley, son of Jeremy Kingsley of Connecticut. What would a member of that family be doing getting married in Vaudreuil, Québec in 1787?

I'm primarily interested in identifying the father of Anastasie Kingsley, whose profile is linked to this question.  She is the daughter of Albert Kingsley and Marie Louise Lanthier.  

Who is Albert Kingsley? We know that Albert's father's name is Jeremy, and we know that Libbeus' father's name is Jeremy.  Is that the only source of the rumour? Does anyone have any evidence?

Thanks so much for considering this puzzle.

Comments

PS - in the registration of the marriage of Albert Kingsley and Marie Louise Lanthier, a mother is recorded for Albert.  It looks like Hanna Lielly (spelling?).  Libbeus's mother is Hannah Lillie.

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One good reason for a 1787 marriage in Canada for someone who was supposedly born in what would become the United States (at the time he was born, later) was that his family was on the Tory (Loyalist) side rather than the Patriot side? Just a thought, there.  

Loyalists in Canada | The Canadian Encyclopedia

https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca › article › loyalists

Loyalist (American Revolution) - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Loyalist_(American_Revolution)

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Good avenue to pursue, but no sign of him or any Kingsleys on the Loyalist List 

Answer 1

actually, the priest did not use a long S, he used a Z in the name.  Written as Camzelay. Added some research notes to Anastasie's profile.

As far as the mother's name, it's written Lailay in the marriage record, but this was probably a phonetic rendering of what he was told.  You do seem to have identified the right parents for Albert.  Whether he is in fact the same man as ''Libbeus Kingsley'' remains to be proven, his age at death given by the priest puts it rather specifically at ''79 years and a few days.''  Thus putting his birth in 1758.  Really unclear how he knew the age so closely though.

Comments

he is most likely among the ''Loyalists'', most likely Catholic or converted, since there is no objection cited on the marriage to difference in religion.  Vaudreuil where he marries is not very far from US border https://www.genealogiequebec.com/fr/LAFRANCE/carte/6101 parish map IGD (free access)

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Thanks!  Do you think i should start a profile for 'Albert' Kingsley and attach him as a son to Jeremy and Hannah?  Then if he turns out to be one of the already existing sons, just merge him?

Regarding the spelling of his surname, there is an interesting entry in the parish registry where the priest uses Kingselay, daughter Anastasie signs with modern spelling with a modern 's', and dad Albert seems to use that long 's'.  Wasn't that long 's' more used when there was a double 's'?  I'm not knowledgeable about this, just have a faint wisp of memory regarding when they used that long 's'.

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Maybe the age at death is how Albert got connected with Libbeus, since Libbeus has a birthdate of April 1757 according to a record found at FamilySearch.

Name: Labbus Kingsley
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 19 Apr 1757
Birthplace: NORWICH TWP,NEW LONDON,CONNETICUT
Father's Name: Jeremiah Kingsley
Mother's Name: Hannah

Indexing Project (Batch) Number: 7450344
System Origin: Connecticut-ODM
GS Film number: unknown
 

Citing this Record
"Connecticut Births and Christenings, 1649-1906," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F74H-6X6 : 11 February 2018), Hannah in entry for Labbus Kingsley, 19 Apr 1757; citing ; FHL microfilm unknown.

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But maybe that leaves room for another child born to Hannah actually in 1758

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Libbeus's father was a patriot, so it could have been a change of heart or economics that brought Libbeus or a brother to Canada.  However, a son might have decided to fight on the other side...certainly the issue split families.  

Can anyone read Albert Kingsley's occupations in the various parish registry entries?  My French is only up to the common occupations. In Albert's own marriage, i can't even pick out an occupation.  (But i see lots of Gastonguays there - what are they doing there?) At Anastasie's marriage, he is a cultour?  is that short for cultivateur? or am i just reading it wrong?  Maybe if we understood his occupation, we would know what he is doing in Quebec.

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By 1776, Jeremiah and Hannah were living in Becket, MA, and having more children there. See transcription of vital records. That increases the possibility that their son Libbeus is the same as the Patriot Private Libbeus Kingsley from Becket. I originally discounted the connection on geographical grounds, but it seems i was hasty.  As a Patriot, he would not qualify as UEL.  So what was he doing in Quebec?

Libbeus born 1757 is not to be confused with Libbeus Lilly Kingsley born 1806 to Jeremiah and Hannah's son Andrew.  Another Kingsley couple, Amos and Mary, had a Libeus as well, born 1777 in Becket.  The following generations had a sprinkling of Libbeus as well.  So the name was not in disgrace in the family....

(editted to include link to Libbeus' Patriot record - all 13 days of it, it appears!)

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Whatever happened to Libbeus, he disappears from the genealogies kept by the NE branch, such as this one and this one.  Maybe that is another reason why family historians have identified him with Albert.

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Would we expect to see an adult baptism some time before Albert's marriage to Marie Louise Lanthier?  Was there a St Albert but no St Libbeus?  Could that have been the source of a name change?

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the priest does not use the older long S form at all, that was actually mostly gone out of usage by this time.  It is definitely a Z.

Albert on baptism of his first son has signature that is more legible, writes Canslay.

His first son is named Albert, his second son is named Jérémie, baptism for him in different parish and the name gets written Quinzelay,  sigh.  Albert didn't sign that one.

Next child is Paul, name written Camzelay, Albert signs Canslaes.

Next is son Verance Adonatger (no clue what that would be originally, obviously phonetic), family name written Kinsley, Albert not signing

Next is Anastasie Kinzeley, Albert signs Canslaeif

Next is François Xavier Camzelai, Albert signs Canslaef or Canslaes

Next is Marie Augustine Ruth Canslais, Albert signs Canslaef or Canslaes

Next is Jean Noël Kingseley, no signature

Next is Louis Kenselay, Albert signs Kingsley

Next is Marie Magdeleine Kenselley, Albert signs Kingsley

Last is Marie Théophile Kengselay, Albert signs Kingsley

Albert is listed as ''cultivateur'' or ''agriculteur'' (farmer) on records where it is mentioned.

As far as the name change, as you can see, he changes the spelling on his signature over time, it's the same handwriting so there is no doubt about it being him.

Libbeus or variants thereof is definitely not a French name, so might have been dubbed Albert and gone with it afterwards.  Abjurations records that I can find stop at 1757 so don't know if he renounced protestant faith after arrival here.

That he names his second son Jérémie is further evidence that he is son of the parents of Libbeus.  Just can't tell if he is in fact the same man as Libbeus, FS didn't have a link to the actual baptism for that one, just a file.

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WOW, thanks so much, Danielle!

Really interesting collection of alternate spellings for Kingsley!

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Apparently the name Libbeus is pronounced with the accent on the second syllable.  Knowing that, maybe it is not so far-fetched after all that a person named Libbeus may find himself referred to as Albert -- in a francophone context, where the accent in Albert is also on the second syllable.

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That interesting name Verance Adonatger Kingsley:

I wonder if Adonatger corresponds to Libbeus's younger brother's name 

Adonijah

 https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Kingsley-313

Cheers

Shirlea

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Well I figured he might have been a Loyalist (yesterday that was) and Danielle seems to have found support for that idea (12 hrs ago) but an hour ago Shirlea said nope, not on Loyalist lists.

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might have just found a wife who suited him and moved here, the border was open until early 1900s between US and Canada, lots and lots of ''uncontrolled'' motion back then.  

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Yes, it could be as simple as that!  I was looking for an abandoned wife on the US side, but if she is there, i couldn't find her...

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i started a profile for Albert and made a note on it that he might be Libbeus.