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John (Ogilvy) Ogilvy of Powrie (abt. 1563 - 1609)

Master John Ogilvy of Powrie formerly Ogilvy
Born about in Angus, Scotlandmap
Ancestors ancestors
Husband of — married about 1583 in Dundeemap
Descendants descendants
Died at about age 46 in Angus, Scotlandmap
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Profile last modified | Created 20 Apr 2016
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Biography

Notables Project
John (Ogilvy) Ogilvy of Powrie is Notable.

Political Adventurer spent time in English Court, Papal Court and Spanish Court of King Philip II. Detained in Spain 1596 to 1600. Spy for English secretary Sir Robert Cecil and corresponded with him using code and alias John Gibson (John son of Gilbert!).

Born about 1563, John gained a degree about 1580 and thereafter appears as Master John Ogilvy. He was well versed in Latin, French and Spanish and could entertain visiting ambassadors to Scotland. This suggests that he had finished his education in the first half of the 1580s by a tour of European states as was common for the first sons of Scottish lairds. His father Sir Gilbert Ogilvy of that Ilk was a leading Protestant and Master john married in the 1580's to Elizabeth Scrymgeour daughter of Sir James Scrymgeour,[1] Constable of Dundee who was likewise a leading Protestant.

Under the terms of their marriage contract their fathers granted them the Mains and house of East Powrie along with its fortalice. [2] He and Elizabeth appear to have had four sons and five daughters. Master john Ogilvy may have accompanied his neighbour the Master of Gray on his visit to the English Court of Queen Elizabeth to negotiate the sparing of Mary Queen of Scots. That was unsuccessful and the Master of Gray was blamed for that. However no mention is made of Master John Ogilvy but later writings confirm that he was well known in the English Court and thereafter he kept the English Secretaries of Elizabeth informed of events in Scotland.[3] Indeed, he wrote to Sir Francis Walsingham, supposing that they dare not effect anything against the life of the Queen of Scots. He was with King James on receipt of the news of Mary’s death. [4]

King James VI made a letter of appointment on 12 August 1584 in favour of Master John Ogilvy, apparent of Powrie as factor to Patrick Lord Glamis. By the 1590's he became involved with some of the Catholic Lords and was in an English list of “chiefest known and professed Papists” but he was not altogether trusted by them given his background and may have been considered a spy. In early 1593 arrangements were made for him to go to Spain secretly on behalf King James VI to negotiate with King Philip II there but he called off and the English Secretary was aware of this. Perhaps the Spanish Blanks incident of December 1592 had disrupted this and indeed it cost the life of his neighbour David Graham of Fintry.

William, Earl of Angus granted a charter to Gilbert Ogilvy of Ogilvy and Master John Ogilvy his son, of Carie, near Abernethy. Perthshire on 20 March 1593/94. [5]

In June 1595 Master John made his way to the Low Countries (Netherlands and Belgium) and met the Angus priest Father George Crichton who was in exile in Antwerp. He also negotiated with Stephen d’Ibarra , King Philip of Spain’s secretary. Thereafter he made his way eventually to the Papal Court and presented letters which he claimed were from King James VI seeking Papal assistance to gain the throne of England.

The English spy Dr John Cecil spoiled his reception by claiming Ogilvy could not be trusted as he came from a family of Heretics. However, the Spanish Ambassador, the Duke of Sessa, was impressed by this "young man" and arranged for Ogilvy to go to Spain. This he did but accompanied by Dr Cecil in 1596. Ogilvy presented to King Philip at Teledo several letters the contents of which can still be read.[6] Philip was impressed but doubts arose and Master John was detained in Spain. His brother-in-law Thomas Erskine, a favourite of King James VI went to Spain in August 1598 to plead his release but his was not granted until 1600 by which time his father had recently died and Master John Ogilvy now had the title of that Ilk. He returned via Lindon in secret obtaining a loan from Sir Robert Cecil, the English Secretary. However early in 1601, he was detained in England just before crossing into Scotland and Queen Elizabeth wrote to King James saying she would hand over this forger of false letters to King James to deal with.[7] James VI having denied that Ogilvy's letters represented him and that he would hang him if ever he returned. However, while riding together to his trial Master John made his escape. By 1601 John was back in control of his estates in Angus and Perthshire although he had paid heavily with a sum of 1000 gold crowns to King James for his peace.

The rest of his life was lived as a local Angus laird. He died in 1609. This gifted laird through his political adventures led an exciting life but the resultant penalties probably left his estate greatly diminished. His sons Gilbert and then Thomas were served John’s heirs, on 19 January 1610 and 4 August 1612 respectively.

A very full account of the life of this political adventurer is given in Ogilvy of that Ilk, Ogilvy of Powrie.[8]

Sources

  1. Alex Wedderburn’s Protocol Book April 1587-Jul 1589 fol.44v. The letter of Mr Adam Fergusson minister of Moulin in 1775 gives the mother of his mother's grandmother as a daughter of Scrymgeour of Dudhope.
  2. Dundee City Archives Alex Wedderburn’s Protocol Book 1587-1589 fol. 44v
  3. Cal. of State Papers relating to Scotland Vol.XLI item 93. also see Vol.42 p542 items 13 and 16 [1]
  4. Hist. MSS. Comm., Marquis of Salisbury, xiii. p. 334.
  5. National Library of Scotland Saltoun Papers Charter 14053
  6. Miscellany of Scottish History Society Vol. 1, 1893. “Documents illustrating Catholic policy in the reign of James VI.” Edited with introduction and notes by Thomas G Law.
  7. Calendar of State Papers, Scotland, State Paper Office, London.) 1601 SP52/67, no. 13
  8. Ogilvy of that Ilk Ogilvy of Powrie by Jack Blair published by Tay Valley FHS 2006 contains many more references identifying the above. See also [2]

See also:





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Comments: 3

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Here's a puzzle with two parts:

1. In a letter from Robert Bowes to Lord Burghley, dated August 14, 1590, Sir Alexander Stewart (of Garlies) was said to be "descended from bishop Alexander Stewart, brother of James IV..." ("James VI: August 1590." Calendar of State Papers, Scotland: Volume 10, 1589-1593. Eds. William K. Boyd, and Henry W. Meikle. Edinburgh: His Majesty's General Register House, 1936. 368-390. British History Online. Web. 4 March 2023. http://www.british-history.ac.uk/cal-state-papers/scotland/vol10/pp368-390.).

2. In a letter from Robert Bowes to Lord Burghley, dated January 13, 1591, Master John Ogilvy, "the young laird of Pury Ogilvie", was called the "nephew" of Sir Alexander Stewart (of Garlies). Master John Ogilvy apparently wrote letters to Robert Bowes on Sir Alexander Stewart's behalf ("James VI: January 1591." Calendar of State Papers, Scotland: Volume 10, 1589-1593. Eds. William K. Boyd, and Henry W. Meikle. Edinburgh: His Majesty's General Register House, 1936. 445-456. British History Online. Web. 4 March 2023. http://www.british-history.ac.uk/cal-state-papers/scotland/vol10/pp445-456.).

Regarding the first part, James IV did not have a brother named Alexander who was bishop. He did have a son, Alexander Stewart who became Archbishop of St. Andrews, but the Archbishop did not have any known children. There was also Alexander Stewart, Bishop of Moray, great grandfather of Master John Ogilvy. Taking a look at Sir Alexander Stewart of Garlies ancestry (https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Stewart-2016), there doesn't seem to be any descent from Alexander Stewart, Bishop of Moray.

Regarding the second part, it is not apparent how Master John Ogilvy could have been the nephew of Sir Alexander Stewart of Garlies, looking here at Sir Alexander Stewart's profile (https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Stewart-2016).

Could it be that someone garbled an account of Master John Ogilvy's descent from Alexander Stewart, Bishop of Moray? Could it also be because Sir Alexander Stewart of Garlies shared the same name, "Alexander" with Alexander Stewart, Bishop of Moray, and since Master John Ogilvy wrote letters on Sir Alexander Stewart's behalf, somehow, someone came to the conclusion that Master John Ogilvy was the "nephew" of Sir Alexander Stewart of Garlies, and that Sir Alexander Stewart "was descended from bishop Alexander Stewart"? Any thoughts?

posted by Charles Owens
You are correct in thinking this is a garbled message as Alexander Stewart of Garlies was not a descendant of either his namesake Alexander Archbishop of St Andrews or namesake Alexander Bishop of Moray.

Alexander Archbishop of St Andrews was son to James IV. Alexander Bishop of Moray was son to Alexander Duke of Albany uncle to James IV, John's mother Sibilla was great grand daughter to James IV on her mother's side but also grand daughter to Alexander the Bishop pf Moray.

John Ogilvy of Powrie's link was to his great grandfather Alexander Stewart Bishop of Moray. Seems also a confusion of the term "nephew" crept in. In Scots oy or nevoy normally means grandson not nephew as sometimes translated. Probably Robert Bowes got rather confused by all these Alexanders Stewart and jumped to the misconception..

posted by Jack Blair
I agree that it is a garbled message. Thank you for your prompt response.
posted by Charles Owens

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