What was the maiden name of Isabel Mede?

Question

She is identified as Isabel Mede, wife of Philip Mede, formerly Isabel Ricard, the daughter of Philip Ricard, in a case in Common Pleas in Easter term 1442.
 

Last entry on this side: 

http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no725/cCP40no725dorses/IMG_0427.htm 

1442 Easter/dorses 427 

Bristol. Philip Mede; Isabel his wife, formerly called Isabel Ricard, daughter of Philip Ricard, burgess of Bristol, merchant, versus William Walford, of Bristol, clerk, for a debt of 40 shillings.

Comments

question for C...

One of your changes was to add "shire" to Gloucester. I've not broken the code on the use of "shire" yet - could you explain what the difference is & when shire is needed/when not? (Keeping in mind that I'm geographically challenged :D)

Thanks!

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You don't need to add either Gloucester or Gloucestershire after Bristol. Bristol was a county in its own right since 1373.

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Don't know about what Vance has said, will have to look that up. However Bristol is not in Gloucester which is a City in itself. The shire counties are named after the County towns, but not Hampshire which I think was or should have been Southamptonshire but Winchester is the county capital. Devon, Dorset and Somerset are sometimes found with shire, which makes the ears ache. Earl of Devon, Duke of Devonshire! As usual in England it's a confusing nightmare but we cope somehow.

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If it takes its name from a town (except Durham), add shire:

Bedfordshire
Buckinghamshire
Cambridgeshire
Derbyshire
Gloucestershire
Herefordshire
Hertfordshire
Huntingdonshire
Leicestershire
Lincolnshire
Northamptonshire
Nottinghamshire
Oxfordshire
Staffordshire
Warwickshire
Worcestershire
Yorkshire

Some are contracted

Berkshire
Cheshire
Hampshire
Lancashire
Shropshire
Wiltshire

All the rest, don't

Cornwall
Cumberland
Devon
Dorset
Essex
Kent
Middlesex
Norfolk
Northumberland
Rutland
Somerset
Suffolk
Sussex
Surrey
Westmorland

Durham

You'll see alternatives, but you don't have to use them, except for the Cavendishes, who are Earls/Dukes of Devonshire not Devon.

The county could be skipped with many large cities and towns, but especially, skip it with London, Bristol and Berwick-on-Tweed.

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awesome, thanks!

Answer 1

Probably Ricard, my guess, but there are no good sources on these profiles despite the fact that there are a lot available on the Internet. If the sources were added to the profiles if would be easier to come to a conclusion. Elizabeth Sharp appears to have been Richard Mede's wife.

Comments

Elizabeth Sharpe was definitely the wife of Richard Mede, but has been mistakenly connected with Richard's father. This is dealt with at greater length on the Medieval Genealogy forum:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/soc.genealogy.medieval/philip$20mede%7Csort:date/soc.genealogy.medieval/pZlmyGHVw2M/K7ABzB9HBwAJ

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Vance can you add tags pre-1500, euroaristo and england to get attention from others who can deal with this?

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I'm not authorised to do that. I sent a message to one of the profile managers when I found this but nothing ever happened.

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Okay. Left Liz a message. Time to deal with this I think.

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Thanks

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Thanks Vance & C!

I've added the suggested tags to this post.

I'm currently tied up on non-WikiTree issues, but I've put her on my to-do list to incorporate info from the comments (thanks Vance!). Elizabeth is, I'm pretty sure, my 14x-gr-grand.

I welcome any help in sourcing/editing her profile! C - Let me know if you'd like to be added as a manager (which would allow you to change LNAB). Or let me know if it needs changing & I can do that.

Cheers, Liz

P.S. to Vance: I'm assuming you're a descendant too? If so, let me know if you'd like to be added as a manager also. Without a pre-1500 badge, you won't be able to edit the profile,* but as a manager, you'd get e-mail copies of any comments posted & changes to the profile would show up in your Family Activity feed. I have the badge & can make edits you would like made.

* Vance (and C) - there's a strong debate about folks without the pre-1500 badge being managers of pre-1500 profiles (leaning heavily toward "no"), but I think that so long as the profile has a badged collaborator, the objections are diminished.

pps/edit: I've edited the profile & after a second cup of coffee and a closer reading of everything, I think the best solution is to create a profile for Philip's wife Isabel Ricard.

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Please add me to the trusted list. Hubby's descended from Isabel.

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Hi Liz, For now maybe it's best if I just post information here or in the comments box. I work pretty much nonstop on Anglo-American Legal Tradition / AALT, indexing Common Pleas and Kings Bench records.

There is an Elizabeth Sharp, daughter of John Sharp. She was the first wife of Richard Mede the son of Philip and Isabel. The source is the Red Book of Bristol, show on his profile, page 171. Richard's second wife was Anne Pauncefot. The source is the Visitation of Gloucestershire:

https://archive.org/details/visitationofcoun00inchit/page/256

She is also in his will of 1491.

Also, going farther back, Philip the son of Thomas, the son of Thomas, is good. This is in Lives of the Berkeleys by John Smyth.

https://archive.org/details/berkeleymanuscri00smytuoft/page/172

Nicholas atte Mede in Wraxall is probable. He was in a lay subsidy in Wraxall in 1327. Before that it's pure fantasy.

Answer 2

I'm wondering if the best solution would be to change Sharpe-474 to Ricard and keep her as Richard's mother or move Sharpe-474 to be Richard's wife & create a new profile for Isabel Ricard?

Comments

with more coffee comes more clarity. I think that creating a new profile for Philip's wife would be best. Let me know if you don't - otherwise I'll make that change later today or tomorrow.

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Move Sharpe, create Ricard seems the best use of resources. I'll source and write up when you're done, if you like. Thanks.

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getting ready to do the changes... while logistically smoother to move Sharpe & create a new Ricard, I think the better plan will be to rename Sharpe so that the comments (which are about wife of Philip) stay with the profile for Philip's wife.

If anyone objects to that plan, please give a holler in the next half hour or so!

Thanks :D

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I tend to think in terms of who's interested.  I doubt if anybody is interested in Richard and his wife.

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C - I sent you a private message. I thought I could add you to Isabel's profile (now Ricard-551), but I don't have the info I need... if you'll send a trusted list request, I can you.

Also, I did not add a profile for Richard's wife... if that's the profile you were going to source, could you add it? 

Thanks to you, Vance, and RJ for all the good info!!