Two daughters with the same name - both survived [Resolved]

Question

I have a problem:  Folkert Tilstra and Martha Feenstra had two daughters born about 20  months apart, and both were given the name "Antje".  Normally when this happens it's because the first child dies and the next child is named after the same family member that the deceased child had been named after; that's what I assumed happened here until...

Today I was filling out the family information for Antje Folkerts Tilstra (the younger) collecting records for the births of her children and found records across several years where there are two different names for the fathers.  All the records come from the same community.  

On May 2, 1863, the 25 year old daughter of Folkert Klazes Tilstra and Martha Annes Feenstra, Antje, married Jelle Jans Dokkum.  (1863 - 25 = 1838)

Antje and Jelle had children from 1864 to 1882.

On May 5, 1871, the 33 year old daughter of Folkert Klazes Tilstra and Martha Annes Feenstra, Antje, married Jan Koehoorn.  (1871 - 33 = 1838)

Antje and Jan had children from 1871 to 1878.

There's a simple explanation for why there could be two surviving daughters with the same name, which is that both grandmothers are named "Antje" and each needs to be honored with a child named after them.  The problem I'm facing now is that I can't tell which daughter married each man.  The ages given for the brides on the marriage records both imply the older girl, which can't be true, so I'm looking for some help to figure out which Antje was married to Jelle Dokkum and which Antje was married to Jan Koehoorn.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Comments

I may have a solution...

A death record from July 9, 1886, for Antje Folkerts Tilstra, wife of Jelle Jans Dokkum, states that she was 46 at the time of death.  (1886 - 46 = 1840) implying that it was the younger Antje who was married to Jelle Dokkum.

I haven't found a death record for the other Antje to help confirm this yet.

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Did you try looking for the death records of both Antjes? Hopefully the husbands are mentioned in there and the ages are correct.

edit: ah, you already did that

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don't know how reliable this is

https://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Antje_Tilstra_%287%29

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Thank you for the link, Joke.  It looks like I'm not the first to be confused about these two sisters.

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The death record for the other Antje on January 3, 1907, says she had been married to Jan Koehoorn and was 68 when she died.  The simple math adds more confusion to the problem (1907 - 68 = 1839) implying that this Antje was also the younger one.  However, the death took place at the beginning of January--the older Antje would not turn 69 until April, and the younger Antje would not turn 68 until December.

I think that we can safely conclude that it was the younger Antje who married Jelle Dokkum in 1863 and died in 1886, and it was the older Antje who married Jan Koehoorn in 1871 and died in 1907.

Thank you all for taking an interest in this little puzzle.

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Yes, thanks, it was interesting to "listen in". I also have a few cases of same-name surviving siblings. Not as close in age, though.

Answer 1

Hey Erik! I'm a bit late to the party; but I think there's more documents out there that can back this up. First to check would be the marriage supplements:

• Antje who married to Jelle Jans Dokkum in 1863 was born on the 16th of April 1838 ("Netherlands, Friesland Province, Civil Registration, 1811-1950," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-ZMQJ-2F?cc=2026975&wc=MQ13-668%3A344260601%2C344629602 : 22 May 2014), Hemelumer Oldeferd > Huwelijksbijlagen 1852-1864 > image 2247 of 2564; Nederlands Rijksarchiefdienst, Friesland (Netherlands National Archives, Friesland).)
• Antje who married Jan Koehoorn in 1871 was born on the 16th of April 1838 ("Netherlands, Friesland Province, Civil Registration, 1811-1950," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-ZMG2-D?cc=2026975&wc=MQ13-RWR%3A344260601%2C344674901 : 22 May 2014), Hemelumer Oldeferd > Huwelijksbijlagen 1864-1875 > image 1486 of 2557; Nederlands Rijksarchiefdienst, Friesland (Netherlands National Archives, Friesland).)

Now, that's probably not right... Maybe, they Lets look at the population registers... I can find one there before they got married...

• Antje Folkerts Tilstra, born on the 16th of October 1838 in Schraard, became a maid in the municipality of Hemelumer Oldeferd on the 15th of July 1862 ("Netherlands Census and Population Registers, 1574-1940," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G936-V3W8?cc=2018408&wc=95PJ-JWG%3A338129101%2C341512601%2C341534801 : 10 July 2014), Friesland > Hemelumer-Oldeferd > Bevolkingsregister, Dienstboden en knechten 1870-1879 > image 77 of 102; regional and national archives, Netherlands.), she married on the 2nd of May 1863.

And when they were married:

• Antje Tilstra, born on the 16th of April 1838, was the wife of Jan Koehoorn (1870: "Netherlands Census and Population Registers, 1574-1940," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-8936-JCSL?cc=2018408&wc=95PN-YWY%3A338129101%2C341512601%2C341535601 : 10 July 2014), Friesland > Hemelumer-Oldeferd > Bevolkingsregister 1870-1879 > image 598 of 1439; regional and national archives, Netherlands. ; 1880: "Netherlands Census and Population Registers, 1574-1940," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-8936-JFFV?cc=2018408&wc=95PN-YWB%3A338129101%2C341512601%2C341545401 : 10 July 2014), Friesland > Hemelumer-Oldeferd > Bevolkingsregister 1880-1889 > image 727 of 1650; regional and national archives, Netherlands.) .

• Antje Tilstra, born on the 8th of December 1840 in Schraard, was the wife of Jelle Dokkum (1870: "Netherlands Census and Population Registers, 1574-1940," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L936-V754?cc=2018408&wc=95PN-YWY%3A338129101%2C341512601%2C341535601 : 10 July 2014), Friesland > Hemelumer-Oldeferd > Bevolkingsregister 1870-1879 > image 230 of 1439; regional and national archives, Netherlands.).

So, in conclusion: the wrong birth certificates were provided at marriage, which means we cannot conclude anything using these records. However, we are able to use the population registers that do give us the right birth dates :-) The younger Antje was indeed married to Jelle, the older to Jan.

Comments

Thank you, Willem, for doing all that work.  It looks like the population registers give the same answer as the death records.

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Yeah I am happy with that :-) Funny though that they submitted the same birth record for both marriages - thats why their ages in the marriage records both lead to 1838 :-)