Need help finding records

Question

Mary Johnson was born in Toronto, Ontario, Canada in 1858. She lived with her parents there. Mother passed when mary was young. Father passed in 1878ish when mary was 20.

She lived 15 years (1878 - 1893) in California as Mary Johnson.

Changed Name and lived as Frank Woodhull for 15 years in California.(1893ish to 1908)

Went to ENGLAND for a couple months in 1908 to explore ancestory. I just noticed it said her folks came from England. I thought it was just ancestors but that makes me think maybe her parents were from there and moved before she was born.

I am having trouble finding anything from Canada or England. Ancestors were from England, I am wondering if maybe someone from Canada and someone from England may be able to find records. England should have her travel under the name Frank Woodhull and if family information can be pinned down for parents, maybe previous ancestry can be found in Canada and England.

Comments

The name of the 12 y/o grandson is illegible in the 1930 Census schedule. His name is William F.

Maizie married Orville E Carsell before 1920. Here is the family in the 1920 Census:

Household	Role	Sex	Age	Birthplace
Orville E Carsell	Head	M	28	Illinois
Maizie F Carsell	Wife	F	23	Illinois
William F Carsell	Son	M	2	Illinois

Citing this Record
"United States Census, 1920," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MJCZ-JR4 : accessed 1 May 2019), William F Carsell in household of Orville E Carsell, Moline Ward 7, Rock Island, Illinois, United States; citing ED 123, sheet 8A, line 7, family 182, NARA microfilm publication T625 (Washington D.C.: National Archives and Records Administration, 1992), roll 402; FHL microfilm 1,820,402.

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K, All need thoughts on this. It looks promising but...

if they were married before 1908, why was Josie not with Frank when he went through Ellis Island since it was a family history trip of 2 months.

There is a biological daughter, with both being female, could that be done back then? That technology is too new isnt it?

I will jump for joy if we have the link found, please do not get me wrong, but what do you all think. Is this our Frank or do we need to keep looking?

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Canadians of that time often chose Detroit if they wanted to elope with no questions asked. Bismarck was a village in Lincoln County, Ontario. I can't find a Thomas or a Woodhull in the place. I haven't had any luck finding Johanna's parents in Ontario either. All very mysterious!

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Hello Lisa.

It might be that Josie decided to visit her father / mother / siblings while Frank was in Europe. They were a very mature married couple, they got married 20 years before.

Of course Maizie was an adoptive daughter. Frank and Josie said that Maizie was their biological daughter. In the 1920 Census is said that Maizie's (biological) parents were from Illinois and Kansas (See line 6 in the sheet).

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It is said that Frank died on 1939.

I found Josie in the 1940 Census.

in the 1930 Census, they were living in a (owned) house in Cordova Township, a very small community, the full census for the place is just 6 pages long (X50 people each one).

By the way, Frank Woodhull was the ennumerator. You can see his name in the upper right corner on each one of the 6 pages.

The full 1940 Census for Cordova Township is 10 pages long (X40 people each one):

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L9MB-W7LN?cc=2000219

Almost at the top of page (image) 5, there is listed Woodhull, Josephine (I think the ennumerator wrote down Josephine instead of Josie), She is 75 y/o widow born in Canada Eng. living in an owned house and she was living in the "same home" on April 1, 1935.

We are very lucky, there is additional information on Josie at the bottom of the form (Supplementary Questions). Josie married just once, she was 22 y/o when she got married and she had no children.

I am sure she is Josie, because there are so many coincidences in a community with just 300-400 inhabitants.

Interesting, the fact that she said her father was from Pennsylvania and her mother from New York,

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I found Josie's family in Canada. Her parents were Augustus Thomas and Harriet Green. Her brothers Ira and Archi are listed on the 1911 Census:

Household	Role	Sex	Age	Birthplace
Adolphus Thomas	Head	M	87	Ontario
Harriet Thomas	Wife	F	70	Ontario
Archibald Thomas	Son	M	39	Ontario
Ira D Thomas	Son	M	37	Ontario

Citing this Record
"Recensement du Canada de 1911," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV9T-QM96 : 16 March 2018), Ira D Thomas in entry for Adolphus Thomas, 1911; citing Census, Elgin West Sub-Districts 1-41, Ontario, Canada, Library and Archives of Canada, Ottawa, Ontario; FHL microfilm 2,417,695.

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Ira died on 1926:

Name: Ira Danazo Thomas

Event Type: Death

Event Date: 20 Nov 1926

Event Place: Chatham, Kent, Ontario

Age: 52

Birth Year (Estimated): 1874

Father's Name: Agustus Thomas

Mother's Name: Harriett Green

Citing this Record:

"Ontario Deaths, 1869-1937 and Overseas Deaths, 1939-1947," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JKW8-SGM : 27 April 2019), Ira Danazo Thomas, 20 Nov 1926; citing Chatham, Kent, Ontario, p 310, Registrar General. Archives of Ontario, Toronto; FHL microfilm 2,079,876.

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Birth record of Archi:

Name: Archibald Alphonse Thomas

Event Type: Birth

Event Date: 14 Dec 1870

Event Place: Elgin, Ontario, Canada

Father's Name: Augustus Thomas

Mother's Name: Harriet Green

Citing this Record:

"Ontario Births, 1869-1912," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FM37-V19 : 8 August 2017), Augustus Thomas in entry for Archibald Alphonse Thomas, 14 Dec 1870; citing Birth, Elgin, Ontario, Canada, citing Archives of Ontario, Toronto; FHL microfilm 1,844,888.

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Great sleuthing, Rubén!

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I agree with Laurie!

Amazing job Rubén. I am heading now to update his profile. Thank you so much. I knew there had to be a story there, after Ellis Island, I just was not finding what I was feeling to be correct. It would be great if we could find something from England about when he went over in 1908. I wish I knew exactly where in England he went, that would have helped with where his parents were from.

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I have found FAG with a headstone photo for them each. Frank passed in 1936 and was buried in the Cordova Cemetery.

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Many thanks to both of you, Laurie and Lisa, for your uplifting words   

Answer 1

Hello, Lisa.

I think that the name of Mary Johnson was just the first female name that Frank could think of when she was held in Ellis Island in 1908.

I am quite convinced that this woman is the Frank Woodhull in all the records I posted in comments, starting here:

https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/821063/need-help-finding-records?show=821967#c821967

She married Johanna/Josie/Josephine on 1887 and they lived most of the time in Illinois. They had their permanent residence in Cordova, IL since before 1920 for the rest of their lives. She worked as a church minister in Cordova untill her/his retirement.

There are many strange circumstances on this couple in the records:

They were always giving different information on where they and their parents were from - like if they were hiding something - the only information that always matchs is their DOBs and the year they got married.

On the 1940 Census, Josie (Josephine) said that she had never had children, just like in the 1900 Census, when they had 13 years married.

On the 1910 Census, they said that Maizie was their (biological) daughter because of the place of birth of Maizie's parents matching theirs - but Maizie was born before 1900 !! - so it is clear that Maizie was not their biological daughter.

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Frank Woodhull died 28 Mar 1936. The information on her parents and her POB in the death record may not be the actual one. The record says that he was born in Detroit, MI and that he was the son of Isaac and Angeline Woodhull.

Name: Frank Woodhull
Event Date: 28 Mar 1936
Age: 78
Birth Year (Estimated): 1858
Birth Date: 28 Aug 1857
Birthplace: Detroit, Michigan
Father's Name: Isaac Woodhull
Mother's Name: Angeline
Occupation: Minister [Retired]
Residence Place: Cordova, Rock Island Co., Illinois
Spouse's Name: Josephine Thomas Woodhull
 

Citing this Record
"Illinois Deaths and Stillbirths, 1916-1947," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NQ7J-VQ7 : 8 March 2018), Josephine Thomas Woodhull in entry for Frank Woodhull, 28 Mar 1936; Public Board of Health, Archives, Springfield; FHL microfilm 1,765,831.

Comments

I have been wondering about this too. Things are just close enough to the reports that he gave in Ellis Island but then just different enough to have you wondering. I think we are "busting this wide open" as they say. This all makes me wonder what they were hiding. What was so bad, wierd or criminal that they had to have him make up this story if it is not true. Frustrating because it just brings up more questions and mystery. My mind is one that has to solve the mysteries. lol

Answer 2

Wow. That's quite a story!

Answer 3

Hi, Lisa! Do you know where in California he lived? Or where in Toronto, Ontario when he was known as Mary?

Comments

Toronto, Ontario, Canada is all I have for Canada.

I will look back through the records and see what there is for California. I have not gone back through and checked for anything there yet. I also have not checked in New Orleans, where he went after Ellis Island. I do not have anything other than New Orleans, Louisiana for that one.

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I found a F.B. Woodhull in a city directory in San Diego in 1906. This person was listed under the heading "Osteopaths". I'm not sure this is our guy.

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For California, no there is no mention I can find as to where. It does say she (as Mary) did graduate from college with honors and went on to Law School.

Answer 4

Possible Mary Johnson in 1861 census for Toronto at http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/1861/Pages/item.aspx?itemid=1288182

A second one at http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1861/jpg/004391543_00762.jpg

I'll look some more

Comments

In 1871 http://data2.collectionscanada.ca/1871/jpg/4396300_00559.jpg

You should look these over carefully. There is another almost match as well.

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I put a post up above, I had seen ancestors had been from England. I reread one of the sources and it says her folks were from England. Wonder if she meant her parents and they moved to Canada before 1858 when she was born.

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She also would have been an only child as it was just her and her dad after her mom passed. Then she was alone when he passed.

Answer 5

What an interesting story, Lisa. With such a common name, I can certainly see why it's been a challenge finding any record of her parents or her for that matter. I did find a photo of her taken at Ellis Island in the book The Scene of Subjectivity, p. 111. I wondered for example if she had given her correct DOB, but she looks about 50 in the photo.

Comments

I am not able to see it. For me, it stops on the page where the part starts for him. Is there a way you can put it on the page for him? I would love to see it.

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https://books.google.ca/books?id=aymODwAAQBAJ&pg=PA105&dq=%22Frank+Woodhull%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPrJ-pyfrhAhVSuVkKHe2DCB0Q6AEIKjAA#v=onepage&q=Augustus%20Sherman&f=false If that doesn't work, try googling Frank Woodhull under Books. The book should pop up and hopefully you'll be able to open the page.

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The pic can be seen here:

https://books.google.com.mx/books?id=VWCNkZaXFSQC&pg=PT87&dq=%22figure+7+frank+woodhull+1908+photograph+by+augustus+sherman+augustus+sherman+collection%22&hl=es-419&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPxcfM-_rhAhUhNH0KHVbmCTcQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=%22figure%207%20frank%20woodhull%201908%20photograph%20by%20augustus%20sherman%20augustus%20sherman%20collection%22&f=false

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Thanks! I suspect the Canadian link is problematical.