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Anna Margaretha (Härtlein) Witt (1729 - 1797)

Anna Margaretha Witt formerly Härtlein aka Hartlein, Herdline, Hartline
Born in Neustadt an der Aisch, Landkreis Neustadt-Bad Windsheim, Bayern, Heiliges Römisches Reichmap
Ancestors ancestors
Wife of — married 23 Apr 1750 in New Hanover, Montgomery, Pennsylvaniamap
Descendants descendants
Died at about age 68 in Maxatawny, Berks County, Pennsylvania, United States of Americamap
Profile last modified | Created 18 May 2013
This page has been accessed 90 times.
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Anna Margaretha (Härtlein) Witt was a Palatine Migrant.
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Biography

Born 1728 Weigenheim

Marriage Johannes Wit and Margretha Härtleinin married in New Hanover, Pennsylvania, in the New Hanover Evangelical Lutheran church on 23 April 1750. [1]

Died She passed away in 1797. [2]

Sources

  1. Historical Society of Pennsylvania; Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; Historic Pennsylvania Church and Town Records; Reel: 667. Accessed on Ancestry.com in database Pennsylvania and New Jersey, U.S., Church and Town Records, 1669-2013, at https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/6639922:2451. Note: The record transcript shows her name as Margretha Härtleinin. The initial letter of the last name does not look like an H, but it corresponds to H in Kurrent script.
  2. Find a Grave, database and images (accessed 16 December 2022), memorial page for Anna Margretha Herdlein Witt (1728–8 Feb 1797), Find A Grave: Memorial #144579911; Burial Details Unknown; Maintained by 47117651 (contributor 47117651).
  • Pennsylvania and New Jersey, Church and Town Records, 1708-1985 Ancestry.com Publication: Ancestry.com Operations, Inc.
  • U.S. and International Marriage Records, 1560-1900 Yates Publishing Publication: Ancestry.com Operations Inc

Acknowledgments

  • Thank you to Brad McGuire for creating WikiTree profile Herdlein-5 through the import of McGuire_s of Makanda_2013-12-07_7 gen.ged
  • Thanks to Katie Boosted for starting this profile, May 17, 2013.




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It may be possible to confirm family relationships with Anna Margaretha by comparing test results with other carriers of her mitochondrial DNA. However, there are no known mtDNA test-takers in her direct maternal line. It is likely that these autosomal DNA test-takers will share some percentage of DNA with Anna Margaretha:

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Comments: 19

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This merge is approved. Just need to finalize the LNAB and adjust the PPP accordingly.

Are we staying with Hartlein or doing one more redirect into Härtlein, with the umlaut?

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Dave Rutherford
Dropping into the conversation as a German speaker, though not native, I've lived in Switzerland for nearly 20 years.

According to the [|Germany Project Name Field Guidelines], it is proper to use Härtlein. Special characters should be preserved.

Normally, in German, if you cannot use an umlaut, you add an 'e' after the character. So, 'Müller' becomes 'Mueller'. There is a big difference in 'Mull', which translates literally to 'garbage', and 'Müller', which translates to 'miller'.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Greg Vernon
I think it should be "Härtlein" as noted in the marriage record. Greg has a good point as to the changed meaning of a simple "a" vs. ä/ae. When Härtlein is entered in Geogen 480 instances are found in the exact area of her birth.

I don't like extra redirects, but feel we should use the earliest and most proper LNAB.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
OK, I'll go ahead with this change to Härtlein
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Dave Rutherford
OK, folks...

There is an extensive discussion on G2G about the use of gendered surnames..https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/1461431/help-with-german-surname-forms-for-females?show=1461431#q1461431

The relevant page for the Germany Project is here: https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:German_Names#Female_endings

Bottom line is... remove the "in" suffix and use the neutral form for LNAB... Härtlein, Hartlein, Herdlein...

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
Following with interest the discussion about the LNAB and using the "in" as part of the last name. I don't know if there are any guidelines about using the "in" as a permanent part of the last name, but I would think that as it is a designation of the gender of the holder of the name it should not be a formal part of the last name. German (what little I remember from high school) has feminine and masculine forms for words/names that English doesn't. "Die" (female), "Der" (male), and Das (neuter) all for the English "the". I have been dropping the "in" as part of the LNAB but would like to confirm that that is the correct practice.

Thanks for your help.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Judy (Luckenbill) Brett
This might be a good question to ask of the Germany Project. One of those members would know whether Hartleinin is ever used as a LNAB. I think not, but to be certain, we could open a discussion on G2G.

Edit: Judy, I truly think you are correct in dropping the "in" from the LNAB. That is what I would do if I encountered "Härtleinin" in a record.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
edited by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
I think that hartlein should merge into herdlein because of neww bethel zion church cemetery of her husband has her name spelled that way thius is just my thought
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Derrick Witt
Thanks for pointing that out. That's the spelling on her FindaGrave memorial, but unfortunately the memorial does not have a gravestone image and there is no indication of where the information in the memorial came from. Thus, it's not a reliable source of evidence for her name.

Of the sources cited on these profiles, the FindaGrave memorial is the only cited source that is identifiable from the information provided. The LNAB is supposed to represent her last name at birth. Are descendants aware of baptism records (in Germany) for her or other family members?

EDITED: The marriage record calls her Härtleinin. The "in" probably is a feminine suffix on Härtlein or Hartlein. The Härtleinin-2 profile for her got merged away, but if Härtleinin is determined to be the best estimate of her LNAB, the name on one of these profiles could be revised to Härtleinin.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Ellen Smith
edited by Ellen Smith
Check the Strassburger script reference here: https://archive.org/details/pennsylvaniagerm04penn_1/page/890/mode/1up?view=theater. It looks like a G, but it is definitely a version of the Old German orthography for H. I can't look carefully until later tonight, but at first glance the second letter appears to be an ö... or ä. Either is more proper and more likely than the English "e." IMHO.
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
The Geogen website has both Hartlein and Herdlein as German surnames, with very few modern instances of either name. The 9 instances of Hartlein are mostly in northern Germany, and all 7 instances of Herdlein are in Bavaria. However, Hertlein is a common name, with occurrences all over Germany, predominantly in Bavaria (where this woman is supposed to be from).

PS (edited) - The vowel with the umlaut can't be an e, as there is no e with umlaut in German. As for ö, Geogen reports no instances of "Hortlein."

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Ellen Smith
edited by Ellen Smith
Looking at the spelling of Johannes in the record following her marriage record, the letter with the umlaut looks identical to the "a" in Johannes. I really do think Härtlein(in) was the correct spelling at least at the time of her marriage as recorded by a German pastor. It seems to me, the marriage record points to the spelling Härtlein. Geogen finds 480 instances of Härtlein, with 61% located in Bavaria. As you pointed out previously, the "in" is used to denote a female (usually an unmarried female).

PS. Quote from Geogen.."Considering the population density the most HAERTLEINs can be found in Neustadt a.d. Aisch-Bad Windsheim (Bayern), namely 195 entries per million.

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
edited by Kie (Entrikin) Zelms
I also had several ancestors at the New Hanover Lutheran Church and the family name spellings sometimes differed in just a few years time even by the same minister. Then some tombstones can appear to have different spellings, sometimes because they do, the style of German script or even because of the material and weathering.
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Perry Hilbert
Herdlein-11 and Hartlein-9 appear to represent the same person because: same dates, same family
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Robin Lee
Härtleinin-2 and Hartlein-9 appear to represent the same person because: same marriage and husband Project should determine correct spelling
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Robin Lee
Robin, Good points. I agree with your logic, however, often spelling is a reflection of the level of education of the original person documenting the surname. Given the period of time, I think we're lucky folks were actually writing at all. LOL. Then there is the German v English spelling as well. Heck, my Mom's maiden name was Hartline, which is how I came to receive a middle name of "Hart" and when I heard the words "Bradley Hart" I KNEW I was in for a world of hurt!!!!
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Brad McGuire
Herdlein-5 and Hartlein-9 appear to represent the same person because: Clear Duplicate...

Last name should be Herdlein, since both parents have that spelling, and Anna married a Witt. If her brothers changed the spelling for the next generation, that doesn’t affect Anna’s name at birth...

posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Matthew Stepp
I think it's clear that Hartlein-9 and Herdlein-5 represent the same person but I'm not sure which LNAB to keep.
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Katie (Collins) Goodwin
Härtleinin-1 and Hartlein-9 appear to represent the same person because: Using data from Find-a-Grave Memorial #144579556, etc...
posted on Hartlein-9 (merged) by Matthew Stepp

Rejected matches › Anna (White) Converse (abt.1730-)

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Categories: Palatine Migrants