G2G: Origins of PGM Moses (Cleveland) Cleaveland?

Question

On 20 Nov 2022 T Stanton wrote on Cleveland-21:

I'm going to ask the PGM team to take a look at the notes Perry Streeter left on this profile two years ago which I am pasting here and sending this to G2G:

Martin Hollick is a 17th century New England genealogical expert and author of the definitive resource, New Englanders in the 1600s: A Guide to Genealogical Research Published Between 1980 and 2010 (Boston, Mass: New England Historic Genealogical Society, 2006). He has generously shared the results of modern, scholarly research conducted on the ancestry of Moses-1 Cleveland (Isaac-A, Richard-B, William-C) at:

http://mhollick.typepad.com/slovakyankee/2014/11/moses-cleveland-1621-1702-of-woburn-massachusetts.html For Martin’s sources, please see the end of his post; his 2014 research supersedes anything published prior.

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I am not stating I support this at this time but I think the sources on this need to be explored and a look taken at the supposed Ipswich baptismal record. Let's ask England Project to join this. This information doesn't appear to be the same thing as found at the linked false parent profiles which are simply full of cautions and speculation as to how certain names were created.

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Edit: I am aware of this old G2G (https://www.wikitree.com/g2g/247711/isaac-alice-cleveland-parents-moses-born-1622-ipswich-england) but suggest a fresh look at the information of a published genealogist.

Comments

The problem is - Hollick's post provides none of the sources necessary for identifying these ancestors, and his published work requires subscriptions. There's nothing to look at without them.

The parish - essential to this query - is St Nicholas in Ipswich. Richard is apparently listed in the records there, as the son of William. Richard had a sister Alice.  A Moyses is listed as married there in 1603. https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_queries/637a2a1a86557461de6a1da3?locale=en

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I can look up the NEHGS and TAG items and post them here. Beyond that, I think we just need someone with a masoginc.org membership.

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I gather that Hollis's discovery may have been the name Isaac as the son of Richard. So the question would be where he discovered it, in what parish.

There was apparently an Isaac who was born at St Nicholas in 1603 - son of Moyses.  Died in 1605.  Typescript of register  https://archive.org/details/registersofstnic00ipsw/page/48/mode/2up doesn't have the 1626 burials.  Different parish?

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I've reviewed all of the citations available thru NEHGS and the Stevens book (available to borrow at archive.org) and none of these are relevant to the question at hand. Reviewing St Nicholas Parish records they do not appear to contain any of this family. None of the given records are available at FMP, FS or Ancestry. This leaves the article behind the pay wall at MASSOG as the only source cited and not viewed so it theoretically contains the relevant data and the appropriate parish. Reading up on Mr. Hollick and reading his published work on other branches of the Cleveland family, I do not believe he would have made the statements and connections absent the appropriate primary sources. Hopefully, someone will respond to the lookup request for MASSOG.

Edit: I also posted a question on the typepad page since it appears it is still monitored.

Answer 1

Here is what is shown in MASSOG volume 32:26:

"Known children of Isaac and Alice (--) Cleveland:[14] MOSES 1 CLEVELAND, bp. 2 Feb. 1620/21 ,," son of Isaac & Alice at St. Stephen's church: d., Woburn, Mass., 9 Jan. 1702 [1701/2 or 1702/3];[15] m. Woburn 26 Sept. 1648 ANN WINN.[16]"

The birth citation listed for the 3 children, all of whom were baptized at St. Stephen's is ''Parish Registers of Ipswich, England'' (I have not included the citations for Moses' death or marriage, but they are shown)

The article gives further info on Moses' father Isaac and grandfather Richard, and ggf William as well.

Full citation for article: "THE ENGLISH ORIGIN OF MOSES1 CLEVELAND OF WOBURN, MASSACHUSETTS", by John Brooks Threlfall, MASSOG A Genealogical Magazine for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts 32 (2008), pages 22-26

Comments

I have so far not located the register of St Stephens online earlier than the 18th century. It is kept in the Suffolk Record Office, if someone wants to go there and look.

Answer 2

Well there are similar names in Ipswich 

Name:	Isack Cleveland
Gender:	Male
Record Type:	Baptism
Baptism Date:	26 Feb 1603
Baptism Place:	St Nicholas, Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Father:	Moyses Cleveland
Reference Number:	CS 410.P37x Vol 7
Roll:	990416_1459