G2G: Is the Gray / Grey family of Essex and/or London, Middlesex related to any Grey branch in Northumberland?

Question

Wondering if the Northumberland Greys (Chillingham or Heaton especially) went to Essex or Middlesex. ... Do they have any relation to John Gray of Stapleford, Tawney and his alleged descendants in Plymouth, MA?

Comments

According to the WikiTree profile of John Gray and his two sons, the sons relocated to Plymouth Colony.

---

A little speculation... Just wanna throw this out there for Grey/Gray fans to chew on.

After I cold-turkeyed (was totally obsessed with fixing Dame Isabel's husband) ... I remembered that the timing of John Gray is pretty close to the notorious Northumberland [essentially blood] feud, that broke out between the Forsters and the Carrs. As a result, Roger Forster fled Etherstone and settled in Hunsdon, Essex. His cousin John Forster of Bamburgh, recorded this ordeal in a letter. John is closely related to the Ogles and the Greys. ... So I got to asking myself ... is it possible that a Grey relative fled with Roger? Plus... there is an obscure John Grey, son of Ralph and Jane Ardington, said to be of Bradford and Burton (see pedigree). 

Anywho... Just putting this out there.

---

This is "John of Tawny." His sons, including John Jr., went to Massachusetts. He stayed home and inherited from his father Sir Rolfe Grey of Chillington. Email me if you have any questions.

---

Lucy are we any further ahead on the connection for John Gray 1588 Essex, and his son Edward 1623, died Plymouth, Massachusetts Bay, to the Northumberland Grays?

---

Jean I've been dealing with family issues for a few months & haven't been able to do any genealogy. I will add this on my to do list, which has gotten very long in my absence. I'm sorry I couldn't give you better news.

Answer 1

 

James Gray

England and Wales Census, 1871

Name	James Gray
Event Type	Census
Event Date	1871
Event Place	Plaistow, West Ham, Essex, England
Enumeration District	21
Gender	Male
Age	58
Marital Status	Married
Occupation	Trinity Pilot
Relationship to Head of Household	Head
Birth Year (Estimated)	1813
Birthplace	Northumberland
Entry Number	18
Affiliate Image Identifier	GBC/1871/1633/0041

Household	Role	Gender	Age	Birthplace
James Gray	Head	M	58	Northumberland
Mary A Gray	Wife	F	57	Middlesex
Jane Gray	Daughter	F	24	Middlesex
Eliza E Cooper	Servant	F	16	Whitechapel, Middlesex

Comments

Thank you for doing some research Frank, but I think Bree is after any ancestors of John Gray that may have links to the Gray/Greys of Northumberland, not just any Grey/Gray family that has links from Northumberland to Middlesex or Essex.

---

You could try familysearch.org for any individual to determine where they lived and where they may have moved to.

---

Both comments are great! I haven't detached John Gray from the Chillingham branch for years, but I finally did after one of the managers was open to working on it.

I did find one later Chillingham link to Essex, but from the next 2  generations. ... It would be ideal if the New England team (I forget the exact project) could explain why John Gray is the father of Edward Gray from Plymouth colony. (I previously assumed that they thought John was from Chillingham). But ... I did some very light hunting to see any confirmation for John to Chillingham ... but only findagrave.com came up. So any hint is good at this point:)

Answer 2

Agnes Gray
England and Wales Census, 1911
birth:
Heaton, Northumberland
residence:
1911
Southgate, N, Middlesex, England

Frederick Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1864
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
St Nicholas Deptford, London, Middlesex, England

Mary Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1864
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
St Nicholas Deptford, London, Middlesex, England

Gallant Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1884
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
St Nicholas Deptford, London, Middlesex, England

John Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1887
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
St Nicholas Deptford, London, Middlesex, England

Elizabeth Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1890
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
St Nicholas Deptford, London, Middlesex, England

Isabel Foulder Gray
England and Wales Census, 1901
birth:
1878
Northumberland
residence:
31 March 1901
Islington, London, Middlesex, England

George Ogle Gray
England and Wales Census, 1891
birth:
1864
Northumberland, England
residence:
1891
St Marylebone, London, England

Comments

Oooo! Nice Ogle find, Frank! You just helped me with another part the line:) I've been wondering about George for some months now:)

---

If you go to the free site, surnamedb.com  you will find information about the Grey surname and also the Ogle surname.

Grey

This ancient name has two possible origins, the first of which is from an Anglo-Saxon, Old English nickname for someone with grey hair or a grey beard, derived from the Old English pre 7th Century word "graeg", grey...

Read more: http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Grey#ixzz4Tm8qfKcV

 

Ogle

Recorded as Ogle, Oglee, Ogley, and possibly others, this is an English and occasionally Scottish, surname. It is locational either from a place called Ogle in Northumberland, or Ogley in Staffordshire...

Read more: http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Ogle#ixzz4Tm99O6dn

Answer 3

There is information about the Grey/Grays of Chillingham in the British History Online site https://www.british-history.ac.uk/search?query=%28Gray+OR+Grey%29+AND+Chillingham&title=

There is also probably information in some of the early histories of Northumberland http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/och/northumberland.shtml

However it seems better to try to confirm the parents of John Gray and go from there.  Even confirming the existing details in his profile/biography would be a good start.  (The Rootsweb information is three times removed from the original parish records.)

Comments

Grey/Gray isn't mentioned in the manor history for the parish of Stapleford Tawney (VCH in BHO) - note the spelling, which is wrong multiple times in his profile, his wife and his sons.

Sir Ralph Grey of Chllingham was a Knight of the Shire for Northumbria and has a bio in History of Parliament, no Essex mentions. 

Tudor Place has John as the son of Ralph, which is almost certainly wrong - the bio above specifies in his will his heir was William, 1st Baron Grey of Warke, the other sons were assigned land in Northumbria and Ralph's son named John prob. died without any heirs.

I doubt he's from this family - there are many gentry Grey/Gray families in England - I'd suggest the Essex Archives. 

---

Thank-you both for hunting!:) Will definitely start reading through these archives:)